Gas Price Gouging in BC!!!!

[Lazurus]

23 minutes ago, Ryan Strome said:

You didn't respond to anything I said you just pointed out that you drive truck. That's great I have a couple trucks that haul oil so I also know a bit about Trucking however I don't know about companies having to pay Trucking costs. The point I'm trying to make to you is the cost of fuel will always be more on the island because they are paying Trucking costs. Now if there really is price gouging in British Columbia like you say then wouldn't there be more of an uproar then some guy on CDC? I mean seriously. You guys have taxes that are readily available to you to find out now take that and add that on to the price of fuel before any other taxes. You can't compare it to Alberta where we don't have taxes on our fuel other than a federal carbon tax imposed on us that I think is about 5 cents a litre somewhere around there. Just take all the federal and provincial taxes off the price of fuel and see where you're at then if there is an excess of money that would be the price gouging however I really don't think that's the case. If it is then maybe it's time you guys in British Columbia stop electing such useless parties the BC liberals and the NDP are absolute garbage.

What you want the breakdown on every cost to a trucking company? WCB, IFTA, GST, Repairs, Maintenance, wages? Costs per mile?

How about I rent a tractor from Penske or Ryder and pay 89 a day plus .11 km? I work myself so my wages are fixed and I buy my fuel in BC so I get a credit from IFTA, renting I won't need a permit.

Trucking costs to the island are increase by the time, I assume paid to drivers and the ferry costs. Other than that added costs are in fuel. 13000 divided by teh ferry fee and yes I know it would have to a TDG crossing, the actual ferry fee I can't name off the top of my head.

 

You think that we have always paid 50 to 60 cents a liter more for fuel than Alberta? Or 40 cents a liter more than Toronto? If so I don't have any idea what you would call price gouging, 1.32 when a barrel of oil is $75, in summer when there are shortages and now 1.25 a liter when oil is under $30 and there is a gas glut so bad fuels prices in Europe are less than 1/2 what they were. Can't even say taxes because taxes are percentages and there isn't that much tax, I mean a total, I do think there is too much tax but this is not just tax.

The federal gov didn't nail BC with its carbon tax because BC has had it on for over a year already

 

BTW I am not on the Island.

 

Yes you would think there would be more of an uproar, but in BC we are used to paying high gas prices what i am trying to get out there is we shouldn't be right now. Most radio stations are following one another with story leads, I actually talked to a producer who outright said that, once another station gets it then they will follow, it is common among smaller stations. Covid 19 is wiping out all but the most horrendous stories, even a school stabbing is 5 minutes into the news hour or third or fourth on the lead list.

Edited March 15, 2020 by Lazurus

[Ryan Strome]

18 minutes ago, Lazurus said:

What you want the breakdown on every cost to a trucking company? WCB, IFTA, GST, Repairs, Maintenance, wages? Costs per mile?

How about I rent a tractor from Penske or Ryder and pay 89 a day plus .11 km? I work myself so my wages are fixed and I buy my fuel in BC so I get a credit from IFTA, renting I won't need a permit.

Trucking costs to the island are increase by the time, I assume paid to drivers and the ferry costs. Other than that added costs are in fuel. 13000 divided by teh ferry fee and yes I know it would have to a TDG crossing, the actual ferry fee I can't name off the top of my head.

 

You think that we have always paid 50 to 60 cents a liter more for fuel than Alberta? Or 40 cents a liter more than Toronto? If so I don't have any idea what you would call price gouging, 1.32 when a barrel of oil is $75, in summer when there are shortages and now 1.25 a liter when oil is under $30 and there is a gas glut so bad fuels prices in Europe are less than 1/2 what they were. Can't even say taxes because taxes are percentages and there isn't that much tax, I mean a total, I do think there is too much tax but this is not just tax.

The federal gov didn't nail BC with its carbon tax because BC has had it on for over a year already

 

BTW I am not on the Island.

 

Yes you would think there would be more of an uproar, but in BC we are used to paying high gas prices what i am trying to get out there is we shouldn't be right now. Most radio stations are following one another with story leads, I actually talked to a producer who outright said that, once another station gets it then they will follow, it is common among smaller stations. Covid 19 is wiping out all but the most horrendous stories, even a school stabbing is 5 minutes into the news hour or third or fourth on the lead list.

So the last time I was in Penticton which was 2 weeks ago I believe their fuel was 119.9 and when I got back to Alberta it was 92 9 in Calgary. So that is a difference of what 26 27 cents? So I'm not sure about the prices you're speaking up or where you are now if you are in a northern town or city obviously it will be more. Like I said Trucking Costco into it not what you stated but the cost of getting it to you depending where you are and how close you are to the supplier.

[Ryan Strome]

Sorry maybe it was 121.9

[Ryan Strome]

Some provinces have provincial taxes thought you might not be taking into account. I'm not sure about British Columbia but for example Saskatchewan has a $0.15 provincial fuel tax so if fuel was $1 in Alberta and $1 in Saskatchewan Saskatchewan would pay $1.15 because of the provincial fuel tax so we would need to know if British Columbia has a similar tax. Some provinces also tax fuel for highways, health, education,  etc. So we would need to know all of the provincial taxes in British Columbia that are on fuel before we could make these claims.

[RowdyCanuck]

21 minutes ago, Boudrias said:

His math doesn’t add up. As you pointed out BC pays government tax that AB doesn’t.

Okay iirc gas stations set the price.....atleast privately owned they can raise or lower their price.....

don't get me wrong a course it will be more then a barrel of oil but still......how else do you explain canal flats having the cheapest gas until you reach fort steel station....... Ha

[Lazurus]

2 minutes ago, Ryan Strome said:

So the last time I was in Penticton which was 2 weeks ago I believe their fuel was 119.9 and when I got back to Alberta it was 92 9 in Calgary. So that is a difference of what 26 27 cents? So I'm not sure about the prices you're speaking up or where you are now if you are in a northern town or city obviously it will be more. Like I said Trucking Costco into it not what you stated but the cost of getting it to you depending where you are and how close you are to the supplier.

I merely go to gas bubby and look at best prices, they show a multiple of stations.

I am sure you could find high prices in Alberta if you look hard

As far as trends, that is on the net too i beleive, I have done it the hard way, I looked everyday and waited. The last time there was an uproar the price difference was only 25 cents between Alberta and BC, Hoe 69 cents is ignored is baffling to me, hence my little one thread push to get it noticed. As i posted we are too used to high prices and many think of the great deal we are getting at 120 a liter and because teh media is locked into non panic mode, this is ignored. Also the BC and Federal government are making extra millions of the higher prices

[RowdyCanuck]

1 minute ago, Ryan Strome said:

Some provinces have provincial taxes thought you might not be taking into account. I'm not sure about British Columbia but for example Saskatchewan has a $0.15 provincial fuel tax so if fuel was $1 in Alberta and $1 in Saskatchewan Saskatchewan would pay $1.15 because of the provincial fuel tax so we would need to know if British Columbia has a similar tax. Some provinces also tax fuel for highways, health, education,  etc. So we would need to know all of the provincial taxes in British Columbia that are on fuel before we could make these claims.

Why does gas cost more in b.c....simple , trucking from Alberta.....also have to pay the driver good money too and that's a long haul too and not like there's short cuts lol 

then add in the fact gas stations need to make money too..then add in their taxes...... So it's easy to see why b.c pays more......

[Lazurus]

4 minutes ago, Ryan Strome said:

Some provinces have provincial taxes thought you might not be taking into account. I'm not sure about British Columbia but for example Saskatchewan has a $0.15 provincial fuel tax so if fuel was $1 in Alberta and $1 in Saskatchewan Saskatchewan would pay $1.15 because of the provincial fuel tax so we would need to know if British Columbia has a similar tax. Some provinces also tax fuel for highways, health, education,  etc. So we would need to know all of the provincial taxes in British Columbia that are on fuel before we could make these claims.

Hey Captain Obvious. you think maybe we in BC don't know what we pay in taxes?

 

This is simple - If a barrel of oil is $80 and in BC we pay 1.40 a liter, there is a percentage of that is tax, so lets say the production cost is 80 cents a liter the rest id tax then the price of oil goes down to $30, a drop of $50 dollars or 62%, even if the taxes are percentage based the they go down 62% as well, the amount they get changes, goes down by the same 62% but that is not happening, the taxes are based on the selling price, so oil companies are paying 20 cents but billing 70 cents for BC but only 30 cents in Alberta, that is where the gouging is, the taxes only exasperate the difference because they are percentage based for the most part.

 

Old saying, squeaky wheel gets the grease. BC is being raped, if it was toilet paper it is front page news because that is in the public eye. There had not been one mention of this even when gas was 69 cents in Edmonton and 145.in Vancouver and there are no amount of taxation to explain the lack of media mention altogether unless it is a government suggestion or request or medical order which I believe they may be able  or can do under the "pandemic" emergency measures statues. 

 

Or maybe it is all a lie and we are running out of gas in BC? There is 75 cents a liter in taxation now (surprise wasn' t before), or some MLA's own gas stations (can't be).

 

It is all fiction those other places aren't paying those prices everyone know if things were like this then the media would be saying something like they did when there was a 25 cent difference right? That was the lead story for a week or two remember?

[Boudrias]

7 minutes ago, RowdyCanuck said:

Why does gas cost more in b.c....simple , trucking from Alberta.....also have to pay the driver good money too and that's a long haul too and not like there's short cuts lol 

then add in the fact gas stations need to make money too..then add in their taxes...... So it's easy to see why b.c pays more......

Most gasoline in BC is not trucked from AB. Most comes down that dreaded TMX pipeline. That serves load racks in Kamloops and Burnaby. Truck tankers load at these racks and deliver from there. I don’t believe refined product is brought in on ocean tankers. Of course Parkland refines crude but that crude comes by Trans Mountain. 

[Lazurus]

13 minutes ago, RowdyCanuck said:

Why does gas cost more in b.c....simple , trucking from Alberta.....also have to pay the driver good money too and that's a long haul too and not like there's short cuts lol 

then add in the fact gas stations need to make money too..then add in their taxes...... So it's easy to see why b.c pays more......

This is not about paying more, stop trying to derail the thread this is about gouging.

 

40 cents a liter is gouging period

[Lazurus]

1 minute ago, Boudrias said:

Most gasoline in BC is not trucked from AB. Most comes down that dreaded TMX pipeline. That serves load racks in Kamloops and Burnaby. Truck tankers load at these racks and deliver from there. I don’t believe refined product is brought in on ocean tankers. Of course Parkland refines crude but that crude comes by Trans Mountain. 

Right now tankers are being exported from BC to Washington because there is too much gas up here

[Boudrias]

1 minute ago, Lazurus said:

Right now tankers are being exported from BC to Washington because there is too much gas up here

That might be gas shipped down TMX and then shipped south to the USA. 

[RowdyCanuck]

Just now, Boudrias said:

Most gasoline in BC is not trucked from AB. Most comes down that dreaded TMX pipeline. That serves load racks in Kamloops and Burnaby. Truck tankers load at these racks and deliver from there. I don’t believe refined product is brought in on ocean tankers. Of course Parkland refines crude but that crude comes by Trans Mountain. 

Some b.c gets their oil from Alberta cause it's closer, also I could be wrong but doesn't our oil go the states first then back to Canada ?....

 

[RowdyCanuck]

7 minutes ago, Lazurus said:

This is not about paying more, stop trying to derail the thread this is about gouging.

 

40 cents a liter is gouging period

Yes and gas stations / corporately like fast gas and so  , they set the prices they sell at.....

Edited March 15, 2020 by RowdyCanuck

[Boudrias]

3 minutes ago, RowdyCanuck said:

Some b.c gets their oil from Alberta cause it's closer, also I could be wrong but doesn't our oil go the states first then back to Canada ?....

 

Never heard of USA gas coming into BC. Refined gas leaves AB into Montana by truck but there might be a pipeline, not sure. B.C. Ships some aviation product south by pipe and to YVR I believe. Self defeating to import USA gas as all the taxes would be added back in. I might not be up to date on all this it has been awhile.

 

We all know of USA retailers at the border. In my day there were no state gas taxes it was all federal. USA pricing is a good yardstick to compare pricing but they have variables we don’t have. This is a complex industry. As I said before when the province divorces retail from the refiners then I will take them more seriously. Politicians know damn well what it takes. Establish published rack pricing and let retailers arrange their own freight to their tanks. Simple in my mind but it would undermine refiner profit structures on already small refineries. That could increase costs tha5 would be passed on.

[RowdyCanuck]

4 minutes ago, Boudrias said:

Never heard of USA gas coming into BC. Refined gas leaves AB into Montana by truck but there might be a pipeline, not sure. B.C. Ships some aviation product south by pipe and to YVR I believe. Self defeating to import USA gas as all the taxes would be added back in. I might not be up to date on all this it has been awhile.

 

We all know of USA retailers at the border. In my day there were no state gas taxes it was all federal. USA pricing is a good yardstick to compare pricing but they have variables we don’t have. This is a complex industry. As I said before when the province divorces retail from the refiners then I will take them more seriously. Politicians know damn well what it takes. Establish published rack pricing and let retailers arrange their own freight to their tanks. Simple in my mind but it would undermine refiner profit structures on already small refineries. That could increase costs tha5 would be passed on.

iirc we send them the stuff we can't  refine , which I've always heard it called dirty oil, the refiners in Canada do pretty much all the work but we ship to the states to separate the last bit....

if someone really wanted to change things , then start a private run gas station......you can set your price off the cost of oil and have less over head and that would force big companies like 7-11 and fast gas to lower their prices, it would create a change reaction.....

also as a private gas station you can find the best deal out there and give the people the best price.....if you weren't greedy ha

[Boudrias]

19 minutes ago, RowdyCanuck said:

iirc we send them the stuff we can't  refine , which I've always heard it called dirty oil, the refiners in Canada do pretty much all the work but we ship to the states to separate the last bit....

if someone really wanted to change things , then start a private run gas station......you can set your price off the cost of oil and have less over head and that would force big companies like 7-11 and fast gas to lower their prices, it would create a change reaction.....

also as a private gas station you can find the best deal out there and give the people the best price.....if you weren't greedy ha

I have had enough of that industry. Going the independent route is a recipe for disaster unless your volume is significant. Credit cards, loyalty programs, guaranteed supply and reliable suppliers. Last year I was in the business our pump margin was $0.028 per litre. I had done a depreciation schedule that told me I needed $0.046 per litre. I never got that big a margin in the 5 years I owned the place. What we had was a big convenience store that did a good business. 

[RowdyCanuck]

1 minute ago, Boudrias said:

I have had enough of that industry. Going the independent route is a recipe for disaster unless your volume is significant. Credit cards, loyalty programs, guaranteed supply and reliable suppliers. Last year I was in the business our pump margin was $0.028 per litre. I had done a depreciation schedule that told me I needed $0.046 per litre. I never got that big a margin in the 5 years I owned the place. What we had was a big convenience store that did a good business. 

Was it a Chain brand? Or did you own it privately? 

But have to think if a private gas station was on the island gas might be a lil cheaper.....

I've  found in my travels that privately owned gas stations usually have cheaper gas then chain gas stations.....most of the time fast gas and such are all around the same price maybe a cent lower or higher.

( I know my buddy gets told by 7-11 what to sell the gas for and if he wants he can raise it )

[RowdyCanuck]

1 hour ago, Lazurus said:

Hey Captain Obvious. you think maybe we in BC don't know what we pay in taxes?

 

This is simple - If a barrel of oil is $80 and in BC we pay 1.40 a liter, there is a percentage of that is tax, so lets say the production cost is 80 cents a liter the rest id tax then the price of oil goes down to $30, a drop of $50 dollars or 62%, even if the taxes are percentage based the they go down 62% as well, the amount they get changes, goes down by the same 62% but that is not happening, the taxes are based on the selling price, so oil companies are paying 20 cents but billing 70 cents for BC but only 30 cents in Alberta, that is where the gouging is, the taxes only exasperate the difference because they are percentage based for the most part.

 

Old saying, squeaky wheel gets the grease. BC is being raped, if it was toilet paper it is front page news because that is in the public eye. There had not been one mention of this even when gas was 69 cents in Edmonton and 145.in Vancouver and there are no amount of taxation to explain the lack of media mention altogether unless it is a government suggestion or request or medical order which I believe they may be able  or can do under the "pandemic" emergency measures statues. 

 

Or maybe it is all a lie and we are running out of gas in BC? There is 75 cents a liter in taxation now (surprise wasn' t before), or some MLA's own gas stations (can't be).

 

It is all fiction those other places aren't paying those prices everyone know if things were like this then the media would be saying something like they did when there was a 25 cent difference right? That was the lead story for a week or two remember?

I think your also forgetting gas stations do have some control over the price....

also have to add in the cost of living and cost of min wage and so on......as much as it pains me to say this but some of this is self inflicted......ha 

b.c stands for bring cash for a reason ha

 

edit* gas stations have you by gonads cause it's not like your going to drive all the way to Alberta to fill up.....they can charge you an arm and leg and nothing no one can do about that......oh that's right move somewhere ha

Edited March 15, 2020 by RowdyCanuck

[Warhippy]

3 hours ago, Ryan Strome said:

So the last time I was in Penticton which was 2 weeks ago I believe their fuel was 119.9 and when I got back to Alberta it was 92 9 in Calgary. So that is a difference of what 26 27 cents? So I'm not sure about the prices you're speaking up or where you are now if you are in a northern town or city obviously it will be more. Like I said Trucking Costco into it not what you stated but the cost of getting it to you depending where you are and how close you are to the supplier.

2 weeks ago in Penticton gas was as low as 99 cents for a full day but for the week hovered below $1.04 per litre.  lowest in province.

 

Now It is $1.10 a litre and oil has absolutely tanked.  Kelowna is $1.12.  We don't have the same municipal taxes in the Okanagan that Vancouver does.  

 

Counterpoint

 

77 cents a litre in bowness right now, and yesterday mi amigo in Edmonton posted this lovely image with the caption (I swear it feels like I am stealing right now) at the Costco at 149st 

 

 

Kinda makes me feel more and more that maybe just maybe there's some gouging.... going on.  Stony right now is 75 cents.