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Interesting to see how Lind and Gadjovich's developmental curves have diverged.  Gadjovich isn't even in our top 10 now.  When he's played this year, he's seemed to be fairly productive, but just too many games missed with what I assume were injuries.

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Did they give any analyses on Podkolzin?  Since his draft there's been divergent opinions re: his lack of production (some attribute it to his lack of minutes in their league) whereas some see the potential due to his play in the Juniors.  What kind of ceiling/ comparable (not sure how they review in Future Watch) did they give for him?

EDIT: also wonder what upsides are for Lind/ Rafferty, since some say Brogan is an overager who might not be more than a bottom-pair guy.  Heard Lind has top-6 winger potential though?  

Edited by Phil_314
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Posted (edited)

Honestly, when I look at that list @IBatch I see a line under Rathbone, so that is 8 prospects, I see as having great chances of making the big club

 

Which is 1 of the reasons Benning must have thought he could move asset this year....aka 1st (TJ MIller) and Madden and 2nd for Toffoli

 

With those 8 plus Tryamkin, that is a lot of youth coming to the Canucks in the next 2 years...…...

 

I am hoping that we are able to use our 1st this year, if there is no playoffs, and our 2nd next year, and we may not even feel the loss of asset...……...

 

Good new either way!

 

PS...……...I have Rathbone ranked higher (4th)

 

 

 

 

Edited by janisahockeynut
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all those are great.. but in reality maybe only 2 if lucky 3 will have any impact in the NHL

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Glad to see we have a deep swimming pool.  It takes a lot of water to make orcas happy.

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12 hours ago, Phil_314 said:

Did they give any analyses on Podkolzin?  Since his draft there's been divergent opinions re: his lack of production (some attribute it to his lack of minutes in their league) whereas some see the potential due to his play in the Juniors.  What kind of ceiling/ comparable (not sure how they review in Future Watch) did they give for him?

EDIT: also wonder what upsides are for Lind/ Rafferty, since some say Brogan is an overager who might not be more than a bottom-pair guy.  Heard Lind has top-6 winger potential though?  

Lind has moved up for sure - quietly having a stellar second year ...JB quote in the article "he knew what to expect this year and took the ground running - if he has another strong summmer of training we expect he will be close ".   

 

On the rankings - they are an average of 10 NHL scouts.   They rank the players first and then arrive at team overall team rankings both on quality and quantity. 

 

On Podz:

 

A power winger who has also played center (that's interesting right?) who's averaged just under 9 minutes as an 18 year old in the KHL.   World Juniors 2020 helped with his confidence and helped them win a silver medal.  Scouts " He's a strong power forward who will go to the walls and to the net".   JB " we are happy with his development and have big plans for him ".  Also says he will drop the gloves.  

 

Hes ahead of guys like Turcotte, Brannstrom, Newhook, Canfield, Tippet, Krebs etc.   Of course this years draft doesn't count - but previous ones do and I'm very impressed our 10th overall guy is doing this well against some very good competition. 

 

 

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7 hours ago, wai_lai416 said:

all those are great.. but in reality maybe only 2 if lucky 3 will have any impact in the NHL

Sour puss ha ha.   Depends on what your definition of "impact" means.   If playing a regular bottom six role or bottom pairing role doesn't count as impact then I'm sure your right.   Tryamkin isn't on the list because he's a pro - we already know he can play a bottom pairing role - and well - will be interesting to see if he's coming back for sure.

 

Aside from him it's a crapshoot as it is for any teams pools.   The point is we are still at a good place with ours despite losing sure things QH and EP from it the last couple of years - and have the second highest ranking during the periods they were still prospects.    

 

THN/NHL Scouts see two defenseman that can play next year - OJ and Rafferty - and three forwards within two years.    Maybe they are a little bullish, even more bullish is JB who sees 7 guys....

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3 hours ago, The Colt 45s said:

Glad to see we have a deep swimming pool.  It takes a lot of water to make orcas happy.

Orcas don't belong in tanks.

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14 hours ago, IBatch said:

1.  Podz

2.  Hoglander 

3. Rafferty (expected in the NHL next year)

4. Lind (almost a PPG AHLer, one more year of development expected)

5. OJ  (see Rafferty)

6. MD 

7. Woo

8. Rathbone

9. Focht

10. Utunen

I think we always have a skewed view of our players, but the question is, how will they translate and compare to the rest of the NHL?


I think Podkolzkin will likely be a top-6 winger, might be a bit inconsistent at times but he's got the tools, it's all about the development for him so the sooner we get him into Utica the better. Hopefully he's Utica-ready next season and possibly break into our bottom-6 in a year or two after that. Good chance he's a medium to long term NHLer.

 

I think Hoglander's shown his elite skill level and will make the NHL, he may not be a consistent scorer and worst case scenario may end up the next Goldobin, but he's got potential and again, the sooner we get him into playing tough North American hockey, the better. I think he might need a year or two in Utica before even trying the NHL. At the moment good chance he's got a medium-length NHL career.

 

Rafferty out of nowhere deserves an NHL spot next season for sure but again, AHL success and NHL success don't necessarily correlate. Could be a bit of a wild-card depending on how he deals with the speed and pressure of the NHL, but I think he's got a decent chance at a small to medium NHL career.

 

Lind I expect to put all his tools together and compete for an NHL spot next season. He probably won't get it because we're so deep at the moment, but on a weak team would deserve it. If he hustles the way Gaudette did he might push an NHLer out (Beagle, Sutter, Roussel in particular) because Lind as the skillset for the NHL. I think he'll have a decent medium to long NHL career.

 

Juolevi is interesting, I really do hope he has a long NHL career but he has never really dazzled people at any level. He's been steady and consistent which I'm hoping translates to the NHL, and if he plays in the NHL the way he has in the AHL and previously, he'll be fine, an Edler-type steady player. Based on his pedigree I'd expect a long NHL career from him but with injuries and inconsistencies in Utica you never know.

 

Rathbone, Woo and Focht I'll lump together as big unpredictables. Honestly I think they'll get a bit of a stint here and there in the NHL but will primarily be Utica players. Rathbone seems pretty solid right now (point per game in NCAA as a defenceman) as does Woo offensively, but we need to see how their defensive game can handle big strong forwards in the AHL first.They'll really have to work their ways up slowly almost the way Stecher did and whether or not they play in the NHL depends on our defensive depth in 2-3 years.

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1 hour ago, DownUndaCanuck said:

I think we always have a skewed view of our players, but the question is, how will they translate and compare to the rest of the NHL?


I think Podkolzkin will likely be a top-6 winger, might be a bit inconsistent at times but he's got the tools, it's all about the development for him so the sooner we get him into Utica the better. Hopefully he's Utica-ready next season and possibly break into our bottom-6 in a year or two after that. Good chance he's a medium to long term NHLer.

 

I think Hoglander's shown his elite skill level and will make the NHL, he may not be a consistent scorer and worst case scenario may end up the next Goldobin, but he's got potential and again, the sooner we get him into playing tough North American hockey, the better. I think he might need a year or two in Utica before even trying the NHL. At the moment good chance he's got a medium-length NHL career.

 

Rafferty out of nowhere deserves an NHL spot next season for sure but again, AHL success and NHL success don't necessarily correlate. Could be a bit of a wild-card depending on how he deals with the speed and pressure of the NHL, but I think he's got a decent chance at a small to medium NHL career.

 

Lind I expect to put all his tools together and compete for an NHL spot next season. He probably won't get it because we're so deep at the moment, but on a weak team would deserve it. If he hustles the way Gaudette did he might push an NHLer out (Beagle, Sutter, Roussel in particular) because Lind as the skillset for the NHL. I think he'll have a decent medium to long NHL career.

 

Juolevi is interesting, I really do hope he has a long NHL career but he has never really dazzled people at any level. He's been steady and consistent which I'm hoping translates to the NHL, and if he plays in the NHL the way he has in the AHL and previously, he'll be fine, an Edler-type steady player. Based on his pedigree I'd expect a long NHL career from him but with injuries and inconsistencies in Utica you never know.

 

Rathbone, Woo and Focht I'll lump together as big unpredictables. Honestly I think they'll get a bit of a stint here and there in the NHL but will primarily be Utica players. Rathbone seems pretty solid right now (point per game in NCAA as a defenceman) as does Woo offensively, but we need to see how their defensive game can handle big strong forwards in the AHL first.They'll really have to work their ways up slowly almost the way Stecher did and whether or not they play in the NHL depends on our defensive depth in 2-3 years.

How could

 

16 hours ago, IBatch said:

Another year has almost passed...and QH, EP and BB have graduated from our prospect pool the past several years ... how do we stack up against the rest of the league - even without Madden?  Well i got to say I was a little shocked when THN Future Watch arrived at the door today and I flipped through the pages looking for the Canucks and saw what I found - that is we've slipped only one spot to number 4 league wide. 

 

For comparison last year our best player was QH, ranked 10 overall (Makar was 4 BTW) and we still had a top three pool (3), and a couple others in the top 100.   This year Podz is ranked 9 (wow!) and Hoglander is 27.   Madden in LA is ranked 68 but doesn't count for our overall ranking obviously.  

 

They actually praised JB a bit saying that our depth is so good we could let Madden go and barely blink - and understandably so given BB and Ferland injuries.

 

The order they had as follows:

 

1.  Podz

2.  Hoglander 

3. Rafferty (expected in the NHL next year)

4. Lind (almost a PPG AHLer, one more year of development expected)

5. OJ  (see Rafferty)

6. MD 

7. Woo

8. Rathbone

9. Focht

10. Utunen

 

Got to say I was expecting things to go back a few years and maybe see us around 13.  That we've had BB, EP and QH graduate from the pool and still have a big player in the wings in Podz and an almost sure thing in Hogs is very encouraging.  For perspective Hogs rating is right around where Demko and BB used to be before making the show... wouldn't that be something if he could come in and have a similar impact.... thoughts?   With all that's going around I thought it would be nice to inject some optimism about our future - when JB says he sees 7 future NHLers our pool maybe he should earn our trust given how things have gone the past couple of years...

I don't agree with top 10 with no Dipietro or Brisebois.... Dipietro #3 --- Someone must of forgot making list..Forecast had him #4

Dipietro 20, having a solid first season in pro hockey and he is not in the top 10??? Should  be #3

Briesbois 22 - has to be a head of Focht and Utunen..

 

 

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48 minutes ago, wildcam said:

How could

 

I don't agree with top 10 with no Dipietro or Brisebois.... Dipietro #3 --- Someone must of forgot making list..Forecast had him #4

Dipietro 20, having a solid first season in pro hockey and he is not in the top 10??? Should  be #3

Briesbois 22 - has to be a head of Focht and Utunen..

 

 

DiPietro would be the 'MD' at 6 ;)

 

Agree on Briesbois but people have been sleeping on him for years (similar to Jasek, thanks @CRAZY_4_NAZZY).

Edited by aGENT
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I usually don't put into any stock to prospect reports/grades.  A few top prospects "Graduating" to the NHL will plummet most team's prospect pool..... thus a rush of incoming articles about why so and so's team has poor prospect pools.  

 

I mean if next season: Podkolzin, OJ and Rafferty somehow makes it to the Canucks roster.... there will be stuff written about how there's no "grade A" prospect in the farm system, JB failing, etc.  

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I like the list but am surprised to see Utenen there at #10. I think this is good news though because I see very little of him and see he scores very inoften but scouts have a fairly high regard for him.

 

Does this mean we have a defensive specialist in the making? We certainly need a few of those types to go along with the high scoring guys.

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Like IBatch, I have stacks of these magazines and have paid attention to all of them for decades. I only recently managed to throw a few away. 
 

In my experience, these prospect projections and more recently the pool rankings, are almost always wrong, in the end. So, although it’s fun, today, to speculate and get excited, like most of you should be aware as NHL fans, this is mainly an organized guess-work of projection crystal balling. 
 

Wow, amazing! 
Consecutive seasons of picking high has produced a bounty of great prospects? 
Who knew? #properrebuild, alright. 

The predicable sine wave of a roster’s life cycle and it’s effects on the farm should be less of a surprise to hockey fans. Did anyone expect an accidentally rebuilding team to NOT produce a prospect pool ranked near the top? Nothing about this ranking is unexpected, nor will it ever be. 
 

Makes you wonder why there wasn’t more of a priority on acquiring draft picks to add to this pool in the first place, but reconciling that requires revisiting the several draft pick surrendering, cap rosters that still managed lottery tickets. 

 

It’s cool to see that the Canucks are ranked among the top of the pools, still, but that’s expected for a team who picked high for the bulk of a decade. Imagine what the pool might have been if there were more draft selections available in each of those lottery seasons? 
 

Looking forward to the draft this year. 

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Posted (edited)
21 hours ago, Captain Canuck #12 said:

Interesting to see how Lind and Gadjovich's developmental curves have diverged.  Gadjovich isn't even in our top 10 now.  When he's played this year, he's seemed to be fairly productive, but just too many games missed with what I assume were injuries.

Gadj has cement skates. Saw it live in Penticton, dude looks like Lurch on the ice at times.

 

Lind is a sneaky player with LOADS of talent, and he is still flying way under the radar on most Canucks' fans, because he failed to make the NHL as an 18 year old, and then sunk even further in their eyes, because he didn't immediately light it up in the AHL (heh!). The young man clearly has  heart because he has emerged as the AHLer he was in the WHL. He is gritty, for he doesn't take crap from anyone. And he has hands, and NHL level speed. He's a better player than Roussel, with a far cleaner reputation, but still, he will not hesitate to mix it up. He will definitely get a few callups in the next couple seasons, and I could see him making life miserable for management at this fall's training camp.. much like Motte did.

Edited by xereau
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6 hours ago, DownUndaCanuck said:

I think we always have a skewed view of our players, but the question is, how will they translate and compare to the rest of the NHL?


I think Podkolzkin will likely be a top-6 winger, might be a bit inconsistent at times but he's got the tools, it's all about the development for him so the sooner we get him into Utica the better. Hopefully he's Utica-ready next season and possibly break into our bottom-6 in a year or two after that. Good chance he's a medium to long term NHLer.

 

I think Hoglander's shown his elite skill level and will make the NHL, he may not be a consistent scorer and worst case scenario may end up the next Goldobin, but he's got potential and again, the sooner we get him into playing tough North American hockey, the better. I think he might need a year or two in Utica before even trying the NHL. At the moment good chance he's got a medium-length NHL career.

 

Rafferty out of nowhere deserves an NHL spot next season for sure but again, AHL success and NHL success don't necessarily correlate. Could be a bit of a wild-card depending on how he deals with the speed and pressure of the NHL, but I think he's got a decent chance at a small to medium NHL career.

 

Lind I expect to put all his tools together and compete for an NHL spot next season. He probably won't get it because we're so deep at the moment, but on a weak team would deserve it. If he hustles the way Gaudette did he might push an NHLer out (Beagle, Sutter, Roussel in particular) because Lind as the skillset for the NHL. I think he'll have a decent medium to long NHL career.

 

Juolevi is interesting, I really do hope he has a long NHL career but he has never really dazzled people at any level. He's been steady and consistent which I'm hoping translates to the NHL, and if he plays in the NHL the way he has in the AHL and previously, he'll be fine, an Edler-type steady player. Based on his pedigree I'd expect a long NHL career from him but with injuries and inconsistencies in Utica you never know.

 

Rathbone, Woo and Focht I'll lump together as big unpredictables. Honestly I think they'll get a bit of a stint here and there in the NHL but will primarily be Utica players. Rathbone seems pretty solid right now (point per game in NCAA as a defenceman) as does Woo offensively, but we need to see how their defensive game can handle big strong forwards in the AHL first.They'll really have to work their ways up slowly almost the way Stecher did and whether or not they play in the NHL depends on our defensive depth in 2-3 years.

Everyone has their own viewpoint of course - i do too.  It's interesting to see how the experts line things up and I'm a little biased towards the average of ten scouts (what THN does then reports) over some lists as their track record has been very good since they started this quite awhile ago.   As of right now they are predicting (in no order) the Senators, NYR, Canucks and Avalanche to have the youngest and strongest cores in the league going forward ... had a lot of nice things to say about JB too saying his traditional approach to a rebuild has and will pay huge dividends over the scorched earth ones that are now in vogue (cap related).   Accidentally or on purpose he's done a good job - and I'm stoked to see that the experts appreciate what we still have in the wings ... we will certainly need it. 

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26 minutes ago, xereau said:

Gadj has cement skates. Saw it live in Penticton, dude looks like Lurch on the ice at times.

I've heard similar concerns regarding Gadjo for some time now.

I'm not writing him off just yet by any means.  BoHo himself showed us what someone is capable of doing when they set their minds to training - one of his biggest knocks was his skating and now I'd say it's a non-issue.   Not saying Gadjo is going to become an elite skater but he's so young still, it's definitely not out of the realm of possibly that he brings his skating up to minimally acceptable levels for NHL duty.  Then he can be a useful net-presence hopefully for some creative, dynamic linemates. 

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1 hour ago, 189lb enforcers? said:

Like IBatch, I have stacks of these magazines and have paid attention to all of them for decades. I only recently managed to throw a few away. 
 

In my experience, these prospect projections and more recently the pool rankings, are almost always wrong, in the end. So, although it’s fun, today, to speculate and get excited, like most of you should be aware as NHL fans, this is mainly an organized guess-work of projection crystal balling. 
 

Wow, amazing! 
Consecutive seasons of picking high has produced a bounty of great prospects? 
Who knew? #properrebuild, alright. 

The predicable sine wave of a roster’s life cycle and it’s effects on the farm should be less of a surprise to hockey fans. Did anyone expect an accidentally rebuilding team to NOT produce a prospect pool ranked near the top? Nothing about this ranking is unexpected, nor will it ever be. 
 

Makes you wonder why there wasn’t more of a priority on acquiring draft picks to add to this pool in the first place, but reconciling that requires revisiting the several draft pick surrendering, cap rosters that still managed lottery tickets. 

 

It’s cool to see that the Canucks are ranked among the top of the pools, still, but that’s expected for a team who picked high for the bulk of a decade. Imagine what the pool might have been if there were more draft selections available in each of those lottery seasons? 
 

Looking forward to the draft this year. 

I've subscribed for about 25 years now - haven't missed an issue and but a lot  end up in the recycling eventually (keep maybe five years just to help my hockey pools, plus the special ones) and they've only been doing the best under 21 for maybe a decade.  Used to be one prospect mag a year - then it was two and now it's three of 40 not including the draft.   They've done a great job the past decade predicting what teams are on this rise based on their pools.   It's pretty funny really they like to remind us readers when they get it right - and they even did that in a way with the introduction with JB (right?) this issue.   First in the division for a lot of the season (what they said first page plus other nice things).   Print media, outside of THN is hard to find now - aside from hockey pool magazines and the occasional SN rag so not sure what else your reading.   I agree they don't ever get the order down right - but they are pretty close overall.   The order is also very fluid as new guys often supplant the last year or two flavours of the month - see Kakko and J Hughes - and on this site a lot of fans were willing to sell the farm for them.  Same with "the next Lidstrom" and the year before that Hirschier and Patrick.   Funny that Detroit was blasted for taking Seider...but now he's rated 6th best prospect in the world ahead of some huge names from the same and previous drafts .... in other words it's a crapshoot.  Despite all the modern tools it's the same as it ever was - just as many busts, surprises and sure things.   JB looks to have found the best guys two drafts in a row despite slipping both times - QH was ranked 10 coming in behind his brother and Kakko - imagine if he did it again with Podz wouldn't that be a laugh....i figured we'd have slipped out of the top ten....we still have both quantity and quality..and we will absolutely need it.   And it's always fun to read nice things about us, for a few years recently  you just couldn't find it. 

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