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Top 50 Canucks of All-Time - #45

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Top 50 Canucks of All-Time - #45  

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Posted (edited)
15 minutes ago, goalie13 said:

Sure he had a great team, but they played a high offense style of hockey, which can result in more chances against.  So I would tend to think that would balance it out somewhat.

Auld matched his winning percentage and had about the same stats (and that was after that team peaked) no the WCE team never did to Cloutier what our team has done to Markstrom this season. Markstrom is the main reason we are still in it...he goes down and we lost our lead quickly.  Skudra also had similar stats...any way you slice it - Clouiter was one of the most mediocre number ones we’ve had - better then most of the goalie graveyard guys - but not much better - they had a lot less to work with.   Markstrom has won 10 less games and played around a dozen more now - playing for one of the worst Canuck teams ever.    Factually I’d say the worst defense by quite a margin until this last season. 

Edited by IBatch
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27 minutes ago, goalie13 said:

Sure he had a great team, but they played a high offense style of hockey, which can result in more chances against.  So I would tend to think that would balance it out somewhat.

That's fair!  Marky also gets hung out to dry though.  We were quite well known for giving up a ton of shots this year.  I think I'd take the defense in front of Cloutier over the defense in front of Marky.

 

That's a good point though.  We weren't exactly New Jersey locking it down in front of poor Danny!

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25 minutes ago, IBatch said:

Auld matched his winning percentage and had about the same stats (and that was after that team peaked) no the WCE team never did to Cloutier what our team has done to Markstrom this season. Markstrom is the main reason we are still in it...he goes down and we lost our lead quickly.  Skudra also had similar stats...any way you slice it - Clouiter was one of the most mediocre number ones we’ve had - better then most of the goalie graveyard guys - but not much better - they had a lot less to work with.   Markstrom has won 10 less games and played around a dozen more now - playing for one of the worst Canuck teams ever.    Factually I’d say the worst defense by quite a margin until this last season. 

Imagine if we had made the Bertuzzi for Luongo trade at the 04 deadline... Maybe I shouldn't do that to myself LOL

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Posted (edited)

I’d have the remaining guys as follows;

 

Smith - Hart votes...no pendant without him - would be like Markstrom not getting injured this year and shutting the door so hard we never lost the lead and finished first in our division.

 

McCarthy - really he should be on the list already ... 199 points in 352 games ...  our Captain for several years and IF wasn’t hurt in 82 who knows ... he’s one of our best defenseman ever.  Monkey business... THN has his at 35
 

Lanz ... also a leader and three of his 6.5 years with scored at over a 50 point rate as a defenseman. Big guy with a howitzer - the first and better Sami Salo type 227 points in 417 games during that time ...outscored Cooke ha ha.  Should also be in already - before EP.  THN has him at 37.  Cooke played 566 games ...same as Salo...Lanz scored 9 less points then Salo and 24 more then Cooke.  Monkey business guys and gals. 

 

Oddleifson: Solid playmaker/checker in forgotten teams ... stats almost exactly like Horvats...THN has him at 40.

 

Murzyn:  Did the same job as Tanev for a decade ... defensive defenseman often led or was close the team in plus minus ..only a minus once when Keenan had destroyed the team - minus one.   Except he also fought anyone who did something to his goalie or teammate - which was often.   Blocked shots before equipment improved to help with that and didn’t shove boards down his shin pads like Craig Ludwig did. 
 

Fraser:  Five years of Fraser and we are still taking about him.  Cooke won’t be talked about at all 30 years from now.   But I bet Fraser will.   67 points and fought and did fine against Ben Wilson (a top all-time heavyweight) who dropped Gilles so bad it took two years for him to man-up and try again (he recovered his reputation).  The players themselves talk about Fraser with reverance which matters too - as one of the toughest hombres in his era. 

 

 

edit:  With all due respect to Larionov and BB - you shouldn’t  be on this list before any of the above.  Cooke shouldn’t even be an available nomination.    BB - well Lanz has outscored him... and Fraser scores 67 points AND fought and did well against some of the toughest best fighters the league has ever known. No romantically attached statements here.  If Tanev gets in with a few playoff games - where is Murzyn?   He was the soul of our defensive conscious for a decade that mattered more to the clubs history then the last one  ... and also played a lot more meaningful games.  Ugh.  Come on guys really think about it.   Voted Smith (again) and not even nominating at this point given I feel the top 50 is already on the list. 

 

 

 

Edited by IBatch
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I’d have the remaining guys as follows;

 

Smith - Hart votes...no pendant without him - would be like Markstrom not getting injured this year and shutting the door so hard we never lost the lead and finished first in our division.

 

McCarthy - really he should be on the list already ... 199 points in 352 games ...  our Captain for several years and IF wasn’t hurt in 82 who knows ... he’s one of our best defenseman ever.  Monkey business... THN has his at 35
 

Lanz ... also a leader and three of his 6.5 years with scored at over a 50 point rate as a defenseman. Big guy with a howitzer - the first and arguable better Sami Salo type 227 points during that time ...outscored Cooke ha ha. Would also be in by now without some monkey business THN has him at 37.

 

Oddleifson: Solid playmaker/checker in forgotten teams ... stats almost exactly like Horvats...THN has him at 40.

 

Murzyn:  Did the same job as Tanev for a decade ... defensive defenseman often led or was close the team in plus minus ..only a minus once when Keenan had destroyed the team - minus one.   Except he also fought anyone who did something to his goalie or teammate - which was often.   Blocked shots before equipment improved to help with that and didn’t shove boards down his shin pads like Craig Ludwig did. 
 

Fraser:  Five years of Fraser and we are still taking about him.  Cooke won’t be talked about at all 30 years from now.   But I bet Fraser will.   67 points and fought and did fine against Ben Wilson...who dropped Gilles so bad it took two years for him to man-up and try again (he recovered his reputation).  The players themselves talk about Fraser with reverance which matters too - as one of the toughest hombres in his era.  
 

 

 

 

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Posted (edited)
3 hours ago, IBatch said:

...any way you slice it - Clouiter was one of the most mediocre number ones we’ve had - better then most of the goalie graveyard guys - but not much better - they had a lot less to work with. 

I continue to loath even the mention of that player’s name when I think about the Canucks. 
 

That basket-case cost the Canucks their momentum and then confidence several times, but only when it seemed to matter the most. 
 

Dan Cloutier, the goalie not the person, is probably my least favourite Canuck not named Messier. 
 

I’m holding back here on what is going to be left unsaid, but I will simply state that Cloutier was a sieve and not anywhere near the calibre of player to be considered in the Top 50 for the Canucks.

Top 200, sure.

Top 3 players to cost the Canucks their season, definitely. 

Top liability Canuck player ever, absolutely. 

 

Dan Cloutier, winner of most worst Canucks goaltending performances, but all of them when it mattered most. 
 

Edited by 189lb enforcers?
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Posted (edited)
16 hours ago, goalie13 said:

Me being a Coutier fan, I have to disagree a little with your assessment.

 

Cloutier was a phenomenal regular season goalie and set several records during his time, such as being the first Canuck goalie to record three consecutive 30 win seasons.  And he did it at a time when the game could end in a tie, so no shootout wins to add to that total.  While Markstrom has passed Cloutier in games played, he is still behind in wins.  Cloutier is also still 3rd all-time in shutouts for the Canucks and 3rd in GAA.

 

If it wasn't for Cloutier's playoff record, I think he would already be on your list.

 

btw - In case you didn't guess, I would like to nominate Cloutier.  Again.   ::D

 

Canucks name Dan Cloutier goaltending coach | Offside

 

 

Cloutier in the Top 50?

Top Canuck player for ruining momentum and team confidence, likely at the worst possible time, sure.

Top Canuck Player basket-case award. Definitely. 

Top Canuck goalie to cost the team the season, yes. 
Top 100 Canucks? Puck no. 
 

Even remembering the guy’s name is enough to make me sick. 
 

Dan Cloutier doesn’t belong in a conversation about Great Canucks, not in any context of seriousness, fondness or anything that isn’t an internet joke. The guy became one of Sport’s first human memes. 
 

1398EF3C-FDF5-4945-A406-07252DFD71B6.jpeg.79e46d0937ea59455b8e3afc91f26e6b.jpeg

75A83DC0-21E7-46DD-B051-6184EF63D87B.jpeg.5a8f8d2bf4dfa51cd9784d4d405bdd68.jpeg

 

Top worst playoff performance ever award is not Greatest Canuck Material. 
Does he still own that one? I think he still does. 
 

Edited by 189lb enforcers?
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Posted (edited)
15 minutes ago, 189lb enforcers? said:

 

Edited by 189lb enforcers?

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Right now I am feeling nostalgic for the 1994 playoff run, so I voted for Martin Gelinas and I nominate Sergio Momesso.

 

On this date (May 6) in 1994 the Canucks lost 4-3 at home to the Dallas Stars in game 3 of the Western Conference semifinals after dominating the Stars in games 1 & 2 in Dallas. The Momesso-Lafayette-Gelinas line was held scoreless in this loss, but two days later Momesso would go on to reward Captain Kirk's outstanding goaltending performance in game 4 by scoring the game-winning goal in overtime. It was probably the highlight of Sergio's career.

 

He liked to stir sh*t up too:

 

And definitely knew how to take a punch:

 

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47 minutes ago, 189lb enforcers? said:

Cloutier in the Top 50?

Top Canuck player for ruining momentum and team confidence, likely at the worst possible time, sure.

Top Canuck Player basket-case award. Definitely. 

Top Canuck goalie to cost the team the season, yes. 
Top 100 Canucks? Puck no. 
 

Even remembering the guy’s name is enough to make me sick. 
 

Dan Cloutier doesn’t belong in a conversation about Great Canucks, not in any context of seriousness, fondness or anything that isn’t an internet joke. The guy became one of Sport’s first human memes. 

 

Top worst playoff performance ever award is not Greatest Canuck Material. 
Does he still own that one? I think he still does. 

So, can we count on you for a Cloutier nomination?

 

::D

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Posted (edited)
6 hours ago, IBatch said:

I’d have the remaining guys as follows;

 

Smith - Hart votes...no pendant without him - would be like Markstrom not getting injured this year and shutting the door so hard we never lost the lead and finished first in our division.

 

McCarthy - really he should be on the list already ... 199 points in 352 games ...  our Captain for several years and IF wasn’t hurt in 82 who knows ... he’s one of our best defenseman ever.  Monkey business... THN has his at 35
 

Lanz ... also a leader and three of his 6.5 years with scored at over a 50 point rate as a defenseman. Big guy with a howitzer - the first and better Sami Salo type 227 points in 417 games during that time ...outscored Cooke ha ha.  Should also be in already - before EP.  THN has him at 37.  Cooke played 566 games ...same as Salo...Lanz scored 9 less points then Salo and 24 more then Cooke.  Monkey business guys and gals. 

 

Oddleifson: Solid playmaker/checker in forgotten teams ... stats almost exactly like Horvats...THN has him at 40.

 

Murzyn:  Did the same job as Tanev for a decade ... defensive defenseman often led or was close the team in plus minus ..only a minus once when Keenan had destroyed the team - minus one.   Except he also fought anyone who did something to his goalie or teammate - which was often.   Blocked shots before equipment improved to help with that and didn’t shove boards down his shin pads like Craig Ludwig did. 
 

Fraser:  Five years of Fraser and we are still taking about him.  Cooke won’t be talked about at all 30 years from now.   But I bet Fraser will.   67 points and fought and did fine against Ben Wilson (a top all-time heavyweight) who dropped Gilles so bad it took two years for him to man-up and try again (he recovered his reputation).  The players themselves talk about Fraser with reverance which matters too - as one of the toughest hombres in his era. 

 

 

edit:  With all due respect to Larionov and BB - you shouldn’t  be on this list before any of the above.  Cooke shouldn’t even be an available nomination.    BB - well Lanz has outscored him... and Fraser scores 67 points AND fought and did well against some of the toughest best fighters the league has ever known. No romantically attached statements here.  If Tanev gets in with a few playoff games - where is Murzyn?   He was the soul of our defensive conscious for a decade that mattered more to the clubs history then the last one  ... and also played a lot more meaningful games.  Ugh.  Come on guys really think about it.   Voted Smith (again) and not even nominating at this point given I feel the top 50 is already on the list.

 

I think that's my exact order except that I might have Fraser ahead of Murzyn (not sure) and a similar photofinish between Oddleifson and Lanz.

 

I'm just nominating now mostly to hopefully get a few good names for people to think about into the 51-59 "honorables" list.  Sedlbauer, Blight, Lalonde, Barry Pederson, Halward, etc.  But I expect an uphill battle...

 

Larionov was a great player and I'm glad we had him, but his Canucks time was kind of just a pit stop between two separate Hall of Fame careers in Russia and Detriot.

 

Edited by Kevin Biestra
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4 hours ago, kingfreako said:

Right now I am feeling nostalgic for the 1994 playoff run, so I voted for Martin Gelinas and I nominate Sergio Momesso.

 

On this date (May 6) in 1994 the Canucks lost 4-3 at home to the Dallas Stars in game 3 of the Western Conference semifinals after dominating the Stars in games 1 & 2 in Dallas. The Momesso-Lafayette-Gelinas line was held scoreless in this loss, but two days later Momesso would go on to reward Captain Kirk's outstanding goaltending performance in game 4 by scoring the game-winning goal in overtime. It was probably the highlight of Sergio's career.

 

He liked to stir sh*t up too:

 

And definitely knew how to take a punch:

 

Great post...I have Momesso in my top 45-50 too...one of the best support players we’ve ever had .. and yes he could certainly give and take a punch.  Top shelf in meanest mugs all-time ... 

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4 minutes ago, Kevin Biestra said:

 

I think that's my exact order except that I might have Fraser ahead of Murzyn (not sure) and a similar photofinish between Oddleifson and Lanz.

 

I'm just nominating now mostly to hopefully get a few good names for people to think about into the 51-59 "honorables" list.  Sedlbauer, Blight, Lalonde, Barry Pederson, Halward, etc.  But I expect an uphill battle...

 

Larionov was a great player and I'm glad we had him, but his Canucks time was kind of just a pit stop between two separate Hall of Fame careers in Russia and Detriot.

 

It’s pretty close with most of these guys isn’t it ... your right to keep up the nominations and I just noticed one for Momesso who for me at least left an impression.   So in the same spirit will also nominate Momesso - one of my favourites from that era.   

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