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DarkIndianRises

[proposal] Some Canucks trades and moves that I’d like but you’d probably hate

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Posted (edited)

[proposal] Some Canucks trades and moves that I’d like but you’d probably hate

 

1) Eriksson and Demko to Ottawa or Detroit for a cheap back-up.

-The Canucks risk losing Demko to the Expansion Draft anyways.   Even if they don’t, they’ll need to find a way to get Eriksson’s contract off the books so that they can have enough money to re-up guys like Pettersson, Hughes, etc.   The Sens or Wings get a solid young goalie that can help them by taking on a bad contract.

 

2) Podkolzin for Noah Dobson:

-The Islanders get a better prospect, while we get a prospect that plays a more important position.   The Isles already have Bode Wilde as a right side D prospect and so they might be interested in becoming more well rounded.  Podkzolin playing Barzal could be a real nightmare for them.  Dobson gives the Canucks a future top pairing all situations dman that can over from Edler one day.  We don’t have anyone in our system that can effectively replace what Edler brings to the table.

 

3) Virtanen for Colton Sissons:   The Canucks get a young legitimate shut down center at a very good cap hit.   The presence of Sissons would allow for the Canucks to free up Horvat a little more and let Horvat play in more offensive roles instead of being our defacto shut down guy (something that Sutter was supposed to do by the way).  Virtanen is a better play than Sissons but Sissons is cheaper and would play a much more important role for us when you consider the fact that we’d have Boeser and Toffoli already.

 

4) Stecher either gets moved for a pick or is unqualified.

5) Tryamkin comes back

6) Gaudette moved for a draft pick.

7) Baertschi traded with 50% retention for a pick.

8) Sutter traded at 50% retention for a pick.

9) Chris Tanev walks to clear cap space

10) Trade Jordie Benn for a draft pick.

11) Rafferty makes the team.

12) Re-sign Toffoli

13) Re-sign Leivo

14) Re-sign Motte

 

New line-up:

 

Miller-Pettersson-Toffoli

Pearson-Horvat-Boeser

Ferland-Sissons-Leivo

Motte-Beagle-MacEwen

 

Edler-Myers

Hughes-Dobson

Tryamkin-Rafferty

 

Markstrom

NewBackUp

 

You guys do not have to thank me all at once for saving the Canucks and building us a winner beyond this season.  :-p

 

Edited by DarkIndianRises
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43 minutes ago, RetroCanuck said:

No to nearly everything you said


It’s fine.  We all have different levels of understanding hockey and so I look forward to you getting more experienced as a fan. ;)

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I could see the first one happening if either they fear Demko getting plucked in expansion draft/ there's no compliance buyout coming.

Don't see the second one happening though since most Isles fans are pretty high on Dobson, and in the same trade suggested most of them said no.  Of course this probably doesn't necessarily reflect management but it very well could.  Seems like right D are more highly valued than wingers in general.

 The Sissons move I feel COULD work, but given the options we already have in the 3rd line (Gaudette emerging/ Sutter already being a shutdown guy), I don't see why we would get him and then go through the other efforts to revamp the roster when there's no guarantee that Sutter would be tradeable (unless Gaudette and Stecher are packaged with Sven and Sutter, it would be pricey to move these big cap hits when it comes to the picks also going out).  Of course if that was the approach taken then J.B. would be quite the genius.

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no to giving away demko for nothing

 

nucks have 20 million in cap space this off season

42 million the next off season
we have enough cap room to deal with contracts particularly in light of contracts increases being very unlikely in this time of covid

better to buy ericksson out then to give away talent to move his contract

 

don't understand the urgency to move ericksson expressed by so many

he is forcing team to hold cap room so we have it when ep40 and hughes need to be resigned

(he is like a forced savings plan)

if you move ericksson now and spend his cap space now

there will be problems when our 2 elite youngsters need contracts

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Why do people want to throw Demko away for nothing? I think pretty much everyone (myself included) would rather pay Seattle a decent pick to take anyone else. Hard no to Podkolzin for Dobson and an even harder no to Virtanen for Sissons. I don’t know why you thought Sissons is young he’s three years older than Virtanen. 

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Posted (edited)

Why would we move AG for a pick?  He’s already made the team isn’t that the point?  And then you trade Sutter at 50% so there goes two centers..Noah Dobson is a maybe but not sure either party would be interested.    As for LE and Demko, your dreaming neither Detroit or OTT is biting on that one (at least not without a nice add).   Demko is likely our sacrifice to the alter of expansion- too easy to find a back-up and too many other young goalies available with just as much upside.   Bear - cleared waivers twice - we’d be the ones retaining AND giving up a minor pick as a cap dump.   

Edited by IBatch

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I'm sorry but you do not just get rid of HOBEY BAKER AWARD WINNERS like they are nothing,Adam G. is young and already you can see he is a player.

So no thanks to that one,however #4 getting rid of Stetcher would not be the worst thing this club has done.

With his money we could get a bigger body to do the job, because I like Troys effort he just isn't capable of clearing the front of his net or hitting or scoring,well you can see where I am going with this, I hope.

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3 hours ago, DarkIndianRises said:

[proposal] Some Canucks trades and moves that I’d like but you’d probably hate

 

1) Eriksson and Demko to Ottawa or Detroit for a cheap back-up.

-The Canucks risk losing Demko to the Expansion Draft anyways.   Even if they don’t, they’ll need to find a way to get Eriksson’s contract off the books so that they can have enough money to re-up guys like Pettersson, Hughes, etc.   The Sens or Wings get a solid young goalie that can help them by taking on a bad contract.

 

2) Podkolzin for Noah Dobson:

-The Islanders get a better prospect, while we get a prospect that plays a more important position.   The Isles already have Bode Wilde as a right side D prospect and so they might be interested in becoming more well rounded.  Podkzolin playing Barzal could be a real nightmare for them.  Dobson gives the Canucks a future top pairing all situations dman that can over from Edler one day.  We don’t have anyone in our system that can effectively replace what Edler brings to the table.

 

3) Virtanen for Colton Sissons:   The Canucks get a young legitimate shut down center at a very good cap hit.   The presence of Sissons would allow for the Canucks to free up Horvat a little more and let Horvat play in more offensive roles instead of being our defacto shut down guy (something that Sutter was supposed to do by the way).  Virtanen is a better play than Sissons but Sissons is cheaper and would play a much more important role for us when you consider the fact that we’d have Boeser and Toffoli already.

 

4) Stecher either gets moved for a pick or is unqualified.

5) Tryamkin comes back

6) Gaudette moved for a draft pick.

7) Baertschi traded with 50% retention for a pick.

8) Sutter traded at 50% retention for a pick.

9) Chris Tanev walks to clear cap space

10) Trade Jordie Benn for a draft pick.

11) Rafferty makes the team.

12) Re-sign Toffoli

13) Re-sign Leivo

14) Re-sign Motte

 

New line-up:

 

Miller-Pettersson-Toffoli

Pearson-Horvat-Boeser

Ferland-Sissons-Leivo

Motte-Beagle-MacEwen

 

Edler-Myers

Hughes-Dobson

Tryamkin-Rafferty

 

Markstrom

NewBackUp

 

You guys do not have to thank me all at once for saving the Canucks and building us a winner beyond this season.  :-p

 

There is no way Benning will trade prospect Gaudette...This will never happen, way to talented and can move up if needed..Never mess with this strong centre position.

1. Pettersson - 2. Horvat - 3. Gaudette --- Solid centre position under 25 no way will Jim trade one of these guy..

Wingers are depth and this is where Benning will make a move..Strong winger depth...

1. Miller- 2. Taffoli - 3. Boeser - 4. Pearson - 5. Virtanen - 6. Ferland -  7. Leivo - 8.Roussel - 9. MacEwen - 10. Motte - 11. Podkolzin  - 12. Hoglander

I can see Boeser 5.98 million Dollars will bring back a top #2 D man ----- Only make this trade if Taffoli is signed.

Big Jake Virtanen would be the other player that could bring back a good D prospect..

Boeser will bring back best return --- Need to strength #2 D position..

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3 hours ago, DarkIndianRises said:


It’s fine.  We all have different levels of understanding hockey and so I look forward to you getting more experienced as a fan. ;)

I think the one lacking experience is you. :lol:

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Posted (edited)

Thanks for the feedback guys:  

 

I will try and answer a few common questions and concerns that came up:

 

1) Why move Gaudette?

 

The Canucks need to find a center that can take on the tough match ups and defensive deployments so that it frees up Horvat more for offense (which in effect, also helps take pressure off of Petey’s line).  Brendan Sutter isn’t good enough to match up against other top lines, while “shutting down” and playing two way hockey isn’t something that Gaudette specializes in.   As a result, the Canucks are using the Pearson-Horvat-Eriksson as their match-up shut down line which is taking away from putting more pressure on the Pettersson line, while also minimizing Horvat.

 

That is why in my above outline plan, I would bring in Colton Sissons (Virtanen goes the other way).   Sissons would basically our version of Alex Kerfoot, Nazem Kadri, Teddy Bluegar, etc.

 

2) Why get rid of Demko?

 

The Canucks will be entering their window very shortly, and Markstrom is better goalie.  Furthermore, the Canucks would risk losing Demko to expansion anyways......which leads to point number three.

 

3) Why is there an urgency to move Eriksson?

 

Signing Markstrom, Tanev, Virtanen, etc., will not be easy (although in my above outlined scenario, i end up moving on from Markstrom).    Regardless, the Canuck have to find ways to free up as much money possible to re-up Pettersson and Hughes in a couple of years, and Eriksson’s contract will be an obstacle.    
 

By packaging Demko with Eriksson, you kill two birds with one stone.   You get another team to take on a bad contract without retention, AND you move a guy (Demko) that would likely be picked up during the expansion draft anyways.    
 

Miller-Pettersson-Toffoli

Pearson-Horvat-Boeser

Ferland-Sissons-Leivo

Motte-Beagle-MacEwen

 

Edler-Dobson

Hughes-Myers

Tryamkin-Rafferty

 

Markstrom

NewBackUp

 


 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited by DarkIndianRises

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1.  Ottawa believes they can be competitive next year.  Don't see them wanting to add a slowing down veteran like Eriksson.  He has also that additional year when they'll have to extend their RFAs.  He could cost them players with cap being limited.  

 

Detroit already has too many players past their prime and are trying to get rid of those contracts.  No reason to believe they'd want to add another one.  

 

Could see those teams more looking to make a JT Miller type of trade - ie target teams who have to move good young players to create cap space. 

 

Demko has not proven anything yet and his numbers were mediocre this season.  Doubt he has much value, goalies hardly ever do, and is certainly insufficient to move Eriksson. Unless the Canucks offer up multiple high end futures, that's not Demko, there's not much appeal for any team to take on Eriksson.  

 

Canucks are also in cap trouble and teams know that they want to sign Markstrom, Toffoli, etc.  It's going to cost more to move contracts because of that pressure to create cap space.  

 

2.  Don't see Lamoriello wanting a winger for a D especially with some of their Ds getting up in age.  Virtanen also has arbitration rights and will be UFA in 2 years.  NYI does not have a lot of cap space either so can't see them trading a key player for their future in Dobson for a winger in Virtanen.  

 

3.  Nashville signed Sissons to a 7 year deal last summer.  Pretty strong signal that they want to keep him long term.  Friedman in his 31 thoughts even wrote how much they like him over there. He had a horrible season but has always done well in the playoffs.  It was also evident that they need his versatility.  When they lost Johansen to injury in the playoffs he filled in as C1 and even had a hat trick.  

 

Nashville moved Fiala because of his inconsistency and youth.  Same argument here.  Virtanen drafted the same year as Fiala and doesn't fit their age group - it's a team of veterans that want to win now.  He'll also cost more than Sissons as he has arbitration rights and is 2 years to UFA.  Doesn't bring the versatility either and not the player to trust with 1 minute to go.  Don't see Nashville having an interest in that deal. 

 

4. Stecher has arbitration rights.  Doubt any team would want that hassle given the cap situation.  Canucks probably won't even qualify him.  

 

6. 7. 8.  Hoping for draft picks for Sutter, Baertschi, Benn seems ambitious - seems more likely that the Canucks would have to add the pick.  Fwiw Anaheim's beat writer earlier this year was suggesting Jet Woo to take on Benn as cap dump.  Teams can see that Baertschi spent the season in the AHL, that Sutter was again injured and that Benn ended up as D7. They also know that the Canucks are looking to create cap space.  

 

Could see teams exploit that cap space is limited and ask for sweeteners to take unwanted contracts, especially if the team trying to move those contracts are in need of cap space to retain key players.   

 

Cap space is limited and the cap is probably not even going to reflect true revenue.  Teams are set to lose considerable money next season.  Some teams might operate under an internal cap to minimise their losses until better days.  Not every owner might be willing to spend up to the cap next season as it's unlikely to reflect the true revenue situation.  It could be a fair bit more challenging to trade unwanted contracts.

 

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4 hours ago, coastal.view said:

no to giving away demko for nothing

 

nucks have 20 million in cap space this off season

42 million the next off season
we have enough cap room to deal with contracts particularly in light of contracts increases being very unlikely in this time of covid

better to buy ericksson out then to give away talent to move his contract

 

don't understand the urgency to move ericksson expressed by so many

he is forcing team to hold cap room so we have it when ep40 and hughes need to be resigned

(he is like a forced savings plan)

if you move ericksson now and spend his cap space now

there will be problems when our 2 elite youngsters need contracts


CapFriendly is using 84M to calculate cap space.  Seems unlikely that the cap would increase as much.  There's also the bonus overages that have not been accounted for yet.

 

Canucks end of season cap space was shown as 30'474.- ever since Ferland went on LTIR - no cap space created using LTIR.  Any performance bonuses in excess of that 30K will count against next season's cap.  Pettersson and Hughes look to have hit their maximum schedule A targets - 1.7M combined.  Gaudette might have some games played bonuses.  


So around 16M seems more likely (with Ferland healthy and Baertschi buried).  If they use the full 16M - they will create bonuses overages for the season after but there will be some contracts coming off the books.   

 

Virtanen has arbitration rights and is 2 years to UFA - his agent might want to file for leverage.

 

It's a bigger cap hit to buyout Eriksson and replace him on the roster than just keep Eriksson as F13.  His buyout cap hit is 5.7M next season.

 

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9 hours ago, DarkIndianRises said:

[proposal] Some Canucks trades and moves that I’d like but you’d probably hate

 

1) Eriksson and Demko to Ottawa or Detroit for a cheap back-up.

-The Canucks risk losing Demko to the Expansion Draft anyways.   Even if they don’t, they’ll need to find a way to get Eriksson’s contract off the books so that they can have enough money to re-up guys like Pettersson, Hughes, etc.   The Sens or Wings get a solid young goalie that can help them by taking on a bad contract.

I don't hate it. If we can unload Eriksson, then Demko is an acceptable price to pay.

 

9 hours ago, DarkIndianRises said:

2) Podkolzin for Noah Dobson:

-The Islanders get a better prospect, while we get a prospect that plays a more important position.   The Isles already have Bode Wilde as a right side D prospect and so they might be interested in becoming more well rounded.  Podkzolin playing Barzal could be a real nightmare for them.  Dobson gives the Canucks a future top pairing all situations dman that can over from Edler one day.  We don’t have anyone in our system that can effectively replace what Edler brings to the table.

Dobson plays more important position, but can he play it at a top 4 level in the NHL? Don't know Dobson's game well enough to comment. I'd say no for the moment.

 

9 hours ago, DarkIndianRises said:

 

3) Virtanen for Colton Sissons:   The Canucks get a young legitimate shut down center at a very good cap hit.   The presence of Sissons would allow for the Canucks to free up Horvat a little more and let Horvat play in more offensive roles instead of being our defacto shut down guy (something that Sutter was supposed to do by the way).  Virtanen is a better play than Sissons but Sissons is cheaper and would play a much more important role for us when you consider the fact that we’d have Boeser and Toffoli already.

I like Virtanen's game way more and he is finally putting things together. Not the right time to trade him. Sissons is a really good 3rd liner but I think Virtanen has higher upside; he was on pace for 20+ goals.

 

9 hours ago, DarkIndianRises said:

 

4) Stecher either gets moved for a pick or is unqualified.

I like it. We won't be able to afford him anyways.

 

9 hours ago, DarkIndianRises said:

5) Tryamkin comes back

Who doesn't like this?

 

9 hours ago, DarkIndianRises said:

6) Gaudette moved for a draft pick.

Why? Making space for someone? Puzzled.

 

9 hours ago, DarkIndianRises said:

7) Baertschi traded with 50% retention for a pick.

For a pick? As in, we get a pick back and get rid of his cap? Yes please. But I don't think other GMs are willing to add a pick.

 

9 hours ago, DarkIndianRises said:

8) Sutter traded at 50% retention for a pick.

ctrl-c, ctrl-v. re: Baer.

 

9 hours ago, DarkIndianRises said:

9) Chris Tanev walks to clear cap space

Don't like it. I think if we free up Eriksson's cap, we can sign him. He will probably sign a short 1 year deal due to uncertainties arising from COVID.

 

9 hours ago, DarkIndianRises said:

10) Trade Jordie Benn for a draft pick.

OK. Marginal move but why not? Fanta is better. Re-sign Fanta.

 

9 hours ago, DarkIndianRises said:

11) Rafferty makes the team.

Yay!

 

9 hours ago, DarkIndianRises said:

12) Re-sign Toffoli

Yay!

 

9 hours ago, DarkIndianRises said:

13) Re-sign Leivo

Meh!

 

9 hours ago, DarkIndianRises said:

14) Re-sign Motte

Good.

 

Like: 9.

Don't like: 4.

Puzzled: 1.

 

I am still puzzled over Gaudette trade proposal. Is Gaud trade you are proposing return us 1st rounder? Unless it's a top 15 pick, we are trading away a young NHL center for an unknown prospect. Gaud has low cap hit. I just don't understand the logic behind this proposal.

 

Anyhow, your title is misleading. I like more than half of your proposals. I suggest to change the title to,

 

Some Canucks trades and moves that I’d like and you’d probably like too.

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4 hours ago, DarkIndianRises said:

Thanks for the feedback guys:  

 

I will try and answer a few common questions and concerns that came up:

 

1) Why move Gaudette?

 

The Canucks need to find a center that can take on the tough match ups and defensive deployments so that it frees up Horvat more for offense (which in effect, also helps take pressure off of Petey’s line).  Brendan Sutter isn’t good enough to match up against other top lines, while “shutting down” and playing two way hockey isn’t something that Gaudette specializes in.   As a result, the Canucks are using the Pearson-Horvat-Eriksson as their match-up shut down line which is taking away from putting more pressure on the Pettersson line, while also minimizing Horvat.

 

That is why in my above outline plan, I would bring in Colton Sissons (Virtanen goes the other way).   Sissons would basically our version of Alex Kerfoot, Nazem Kadri, Teddy Bluegar, etc.

 

2) Why get rid of Demko?

 

The Canucks will be entering their window very shortly, and Markstrom is better goalie.  Furthermore, the Canucks would risk losing Demko to expansion anyways......which leads to point number three.

 

3) Why is there an urgency to move Eriksson?

 

Signing Markstrom, Tanev, Virtanen, etc., will not be easy (although in my above outlined scenario, i end up moving on from Markstrom).    Regardless, the Canuck have to find ways to free up as much money possible to re-up Pettersson and Hughes in a couple of years, and Eriksson’s contract will be an obstacle.    
 

By packaging Demko with Eriksson, you kill two birds with one stone.   You get another team to take on a bad contract without retention, AND you move a guy (Demko) that would likely be picked up during the expansion draft anyways.    
 

Miller-Pettersson-Toffoli

Pearson-Horvat-Boeser

Ferland-Sissons-Leivo

Motte-Beagle-MacEwen

 

Edler-Dobson

Hughes-Myers

Tryamkin-Rafferty

 

Markstrom

NewBackUp

 


 

 

 

 

 

 

So Gaudette goes and makes space for Sissons. Cool. But still don't want to trade Virtanen for Sissons and they are probably going to say no as well.

 

I think Gaudette will be able to fill the defensive role while putting up better offensive numbers than Sissons.

 

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