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Why not just clear Loui’s contract by attaching a 1st like the Leafs did?

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EP40.

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Going 2 years without a 1st would be tough for a team that'll need cost controlled complimentary players once Hughes/Petey sign. But if you could sign all these guys we need right now by getting out from Eriksson, you'd have to consider it. I like the idea of trying to find a Backes/Kase type trade.

 

It sucks but it's the situation we are in.

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21 minutes ago, captaincowbasher said:

Hmm...lose toffoli or boeser, legit top 6 players, of which the Canucks have been starved of for the last 20 years, or move a prospect/pick + Louie. It's a no brainer. Don't forget both Podkolzin and Hoglander will be legit top 6 as well. This will be the very best top 6 the Canucks has ever iced, and i say we go to our strengths.

I disagree, it's not a no brainer at all. Like I said, our drafting success doesn't mean we're suddenly okay to stop gathering talented, young prospects. Our young, top guys are going to all need to be paid over the next few years and we're going to need guys on ELC's to step in. And first/second round picks have a better chance at turning into something. Given how we've been drafting I think it'd be foolish to not keep as many picks as possible, we need as much talent in the prospect pool as possible.

 

We also have no idea what Toffoli actually wants, for all we know he might be interested in seeing what his options are as a UFA. He showed well during his ten games here, but we aren't the only team who'd be interested in a winger who put up 44 points in 68 games, with 24 of those points being goals. Players only get so many chances to explore the UFA option. People keep talking as if it's a certainty that he'll sign when it's not. 

 

As for Podz and Hoglander, until they both do something at the NHL level they're just prospects. They're great prospects, and I'm rooting for them, but saying they'll be legit top 6 guys before they've even played a game is silly. They're both unknowns at the NHL level, and guys stepping in and tearing things up right away is the exception to the norm. 

 

There's also no guarantee a first alone would be enough to make a team take Loui anyway, it could very well take more. Every other GM knows we're in a tough spot, of course they're going to try and capitalize on that in any discussion involving Loui. Like I said, there could very well be a bidding wars for team's excess cap space, we're definitely not the only team facing tough decisions because of the cap. Loui also has a NTC, he straight up controls his destiny when it comes to trades. 

Edited by Coconuts
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1 hour ago, IBatch said:

If he’s not in the lineup or playing a 4th line role he might decide to pack it in.  I don’t expect him to retire next season but do believe there are decent odds he will after the next season .   There are very good adds he will end up with the Ladd/Redden treatment early next year.  With Covid he might not even want to risk showing up in Utica.   But yeah you could be right.   As far as the post-season goes they won’t re-coup any losses if fans aren’t allowed to buy tickets.   TV revenue and other revenue streams currently are less then 50% ....there are too many scenarios to know how things will shake out.  One things almost a for sure - at least one more roster player is going the way of Bear next season ... who do you think that will be?  
 

Edit:  If TT is re-signed, JV too...he’s as good as gone.  McEwen will slot in. 

 

They are hoping to have fans in the stands for the later part of the season.   TV deals, merchandising will bring more if the team makes the post-season - not comparable to having fans in the stands but still more income than missing the playoffs.

 

With no fans in the stands teams might have the added pressure to ice a competitive team to retain fan interest - they need for people to continue watching games and being invested although they can't be on site.  


Benning did say that he was going to try and recover some of the draft picks they no longer have - he was saying that if they were a playoff team they wouldn't have a 1st or a 2nd.  He was saying that they have too many players.  Last off-season Virtanen was apparently the player they had the most calls on.  If they sign Toffoli I see Virtanen traded too.  He's in a similar situation to Hutton last season.   He is arbitration eligible and they might just not have the cap space to risk an award.  

 

Probably need to wait after the extended season to have a better idea of where the team stands and who becomes movable.  It depends also what other teams feel their needs are.  

 

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19 hours ago, Toews said:

One of the reasons Marleau commanded a 1st was that the Canes had to buyout the contract. The Bruins traded a 1st along with Backes (had 2 years left like Eriksson) and a C grade prospect in Andersson to get back Kase. Now I am not the biggest fan of Kase, there are concerns with his durability and there are question marks if he can survive the grind of the post-season. I suspect the Ducks don't see enough value in Kase at 2.6M AAV, while the Bruins are betting on him outperforming his price tag. I think that is probably the best we can expect, a 1st + Eriksson and get back a bit of a compromised asset in Kase.

I'd love it if we could pull something like that off.  Any under-performing right-side D-men who fit the Kase mold on teams with cap space that you would suggest?  

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4 minutes ago, Phil_314 said:

I'd love it if we could pull something like that off.  Any under-performing right-side D-men who fit the Kase mold on teams with cap space that you would suggest?  

Off the top of my head no. Maybe @mll probably has a name or two.

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19 hours ago, Rick Blight said:

They can buy Loui out but the cap savings are not that great.

 

Cap Hit Calculations
SEASON INITIAL BASE SALARY INITIAL CAP HIT SIGNING BONUS BUYOUT COST POST-BUYOUT EARNINGS SAVINGS CAP HIT (VANVAN)
2020-21 $1,000,000 $6,000,000 $3,000,000 $666,667 $3,666,667 $333,333 $5,666,667
2021-22 $3,000,000 $6,000,000 $1,000,000 $666,667 $1,666,667 $2,333,333 $3,666,667
2022-23 $0 $0 $0 $666,667 $666,667 -$666,667 $666,667
2023-24 $0 $0 $0 $666,667 $666,667 -$666,667 $666,667
TOTAL $4,000,000 $12,000,000 $4,000,000 $2,666,667 $6,666,667 $1,333,333 $10,666,668

Please no.  Just prolong the pain.  Really wish we just take our medicine for two more years.  This could be our best chance to do some damage in the playoffs ... if we do I hope management isn’t fooled (again) into thinking we are close because we are not.   This teams peak years won’t be wasted waiting two more years at all.   That’s when we should be just entering prime time. 

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58 minutes ago, mll said:

 

They are hoping to have fans in the stands for the later part of the season.   TV deals, merchandising will bring more if the team makes the post-season - not comparable to having fans in the stands but still more income than missing the playoffs.

 

With no fans in the stands teams might have the added pressure to ice a competitive team to retain fan interest - they need for people to continue watching games and being invested although they can't be on site.  


Benning did say that he was going to try and recover some of the draft picks they no longer have - he was saying that if they were a playoff team they wouldn't have a 1st or a 2nd.  He was saying that they have too many players.  Last off-season Virtanen was apparently the player they had the most calls on.  If they sign Toffoli I see Virtanen traded too.  He's in a similar situation to Hutton last season.   He is arbitration eligible and they might just not have the cap space to risk an award.  

 

Probably need to wait after the extended season to have a better idea of where the team stands and who becomes movable.  It depends also what other teams feel their needs are.  

 

Agree that things will fall into place after the season is over.  Nobody knows what’s going to happen with gate income and unless we go very far in the playoffs merchandising won’t be a revenue driver.   JV is a cheap option even with his arbitration rights.   He was the best value forward after EP for us this season by a long shot and won’t get much of a raise.   Don’t see us keeping Leivo who’s also probably looking for a raise despite his injury - at least not over JV.   TT is a complete luxury and don’t see much of a chance we sign him - and if we do say goodbye to two lower tier guys - Pearson and JV likely unless Ferland ends up on the LTIR to start the season.    We will need 3.5-5 million to sign Markstrom, JV, AG and Tanev...a lot more for TT.    To me Stetcher is the guy that’s like Hutton this year.  With Rathbone signed .... think the writings on the wall ...

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5 minutes ago, IBatch said:

Please no.  Just prolong the pain.  Really wish we just take our medicine for two more years.  This could be our best chance to do some damage in the playoffs ... if we do I hope management isn’t fooled (again) into thinking we are close because we are not.   This teams peak years won’t be wasted waiting two more years at all.   That’s when we should be just entering prime time. 

I tend to agree. Our best case scenario is he retires before the 2020/21 season (not likely) or someone is willing to take him (50% retained) and a current non-roster player (again not likely). Otherwise, just wait out the 2 years.

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15 minutes ago, Rick Blight said:

I tend to agree. Our best case scenario is he retires before the 2020/21 season (not likely) or someone is willing to take him (50% retained) and a current non-roster player (again not likely). Otherwise, just wait out the 2 years.

Yep and yep.  One more year no more Spooner, Roussel, Sutter, Pearson etc..two more years no more LE, Luongo etc.    Sure we won’t be able to ice the same team this year but that was obvious last season (a year ago)...Covid had made that harder as no cap increase - however as far as UFAs go some are going to be very disappointed in their suitors and their offers too.  Really I know we are one of “ten” teams that are going to have some problems... but also doubt it will mean much other then losing some depth and adding some rookies.  Looking at CHI had to do four times now and what TO had to do last off-season I don’t think we have it close to as bad as some seem to think and are proposing.    3.5-5 million shouldn’t be too hard to find ... TT was a trade of circumstance (if BB didn’t get injured no way we’d have done that)...with the new circumstances I doubt he’s even in the picture. 

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2 hours ago, Toews said:

Off the top of my head no. Maybe @mll probably has a name or two.

Backes only had 1 year left - Anaheim is likely to buy him out.

 

In the Eriksson thread there are a few trade suggestions from the Daily Hive.  One was for Miller who looks to be in Krueger's dog house in Buffalo.  

 

I have a hard time seeing a team taking on Eriksson even if a mid-1st is tagged to him.  He has that extra year and teams have RFAs, key UFAs to sign and will probably prefer to stay flexible in case an unexpected player becomes available.  A Miller buyout is 1.3M for 4 years which seems more manageable than 2 years at 6M with Buffalo looking to be competitive.

 

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3 hours ago, Coconuts said:

I disagree, it's not a no brainer at all. Like I said, our drafting success doesn't mean we're suddenly okay to stop gathering talented, young prospects. Our young, top guys are going to all need to be paid over the next few years and we're going to need guys on ELC's to step in. And first/second round picks have a better chance at turning into something. Given how we've been drafting I think it'd be foolish to not keep as many picks as possible, we need as much talent in the prospect pool as possible.

 

We also have no idea what Toffoli actually wants, for all we know he might be interested in seeing what his options are as a UFA. He showed well during his ten games here, but we aren't the only team who'd be interested in a winger who put up 44 points in 68 games, with 24 of those points being goals. Players only get so many chances to explore the UFA option. People keep talking as if it's a certainty that he'll sign when it's not. 

 

As for Podz and Hoglander, until they both do something at the NHL level they're just prospects. They're great prospects, and I'm rooting for them, but saying they'll be legit top 6 guys before they've even played a game is silly. They're both unknowns at the NHL level, and guys stepping in and tearing things up right away is the exception to the norm. 

 

There's also no guarantee a first alone would be enough to make a team take Loui anyway, it could very well take more. Every other GM knows we're in a tough spot, of course they're going to try and capitalize on that in any discussion involving Loui. Like I said, there could very well be a bidding wars for team's excess cap space, we're definitely not the only team facing tough decisions because of the cap. Loui also has a NTC, he straight up controls his destiny when it comes to trades. 

in your argument you actually validated my point, therefore I thank you sir. Again, it's a no brainer

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How about fixing the Cap by not signing any UFAs. Just sign the RFAs. I’m 100% fine with that option. 

 

Some may forget if Canucks sign Markstrom to a multiple year contract , Canucks open up losing young Demko to Seattle. 

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Don’t attach a first. Attach Demko. 
 

lots of teams who have cap space are looking for a goalie. 
 

Ottawa

Detroit

Buffalo

Colorado

LA

 

Demko is going to be lost to the Expansion draft anyways. Might as well send him early and strap Eriksson to him on the way out

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8 hours ago, gurn said:

Starting 20/21 He has a modified NTC, Loui submits a 15 team no trade list.

so all he has to do is list 15 teams with no cap space lol at this point pretty much a NTC if he doesn't want to move. he knows the team can't afford to bury him in the minor as there's no cap saving and he'll always have a spot on the bottom 6 lol. not that hard to find 15 teams that can't afford to have loui's contract. i'm pretty sure Eriksson would prefer to sit in the pressbox or play bottom 6 mins than go to a team fighting for the lottery to grind it out. pretty much the bottom feeders/rebuilding teams are the only one that will even remotely consider his contract and eriksson and veto everything by just listing 15 teams with 0 cap space lol

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4 minutes ago, wai_lai416 said:

so all he has to do is list 15 teams with no cap space lol at this point pretty much a NTC if he doesn't want to move. he knows the team can't afford to bury him in the minor as there's no cap saving and he'll always have a spot on the bottom 6 lol. not that hard to find 15 teams that can't afford to have loui's contract. i'm pretty sure Eriksson would prefer to sit in the pressbox or play bottom 6 mins than go to a team fighting for the lottery to grind it out. pretty much the bottom feeders/rebuilding teams are the only one that will even remotely consider his contract and eriksson and veto everything by just listing 15 teams with 0 cap space lol

He'd be rolling the dice that he'd make the team over guys who wouldn't be useless such as Lind or MacEwen.  We don't save cap but at least we aren't wasting a roster spot on a spoiled, laxy piece of garbage.  If LE tries to block any trade Benning needs to send him down to Utica and instruct Cull to make his life as miserable as possible.

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