[Proposal] My off-season plan

[kloubek]

Signings: Tryamkin, Leivo, Markstrom, Toffoli, Tanev, Leivo

 

Leaving Ferland on the roster because I don't know whats going on there. If we were able to get him back healthy, he would slot in 3rd line.

 

Trades:
Virtanen, Woo or Gadjovich to Wild for Dumba. I think everyone knows what Virtanen is capable of when he wants to. He will never be that player here. Wild could use some scoring help. Woo helps to replenish the D prospects or Gadjovich is a Wild-type, heavy player. With the signing of Brodin, its clear Wild are not basing their d core on Dumba. Something has gotta give considering the other high salaries. Wild are in a position to lose him at the ED anyway.

Eriksson, Stecher, Focht to Ottawa for Anisimov. Ottawa saves a couple million in real dollars and helps them get to the cap floor. They get a solid d-man in Stecher who will show their young team how to play hard, and a middling prospect in Focht. For us, we move LE. We take back some salary in Anisimov, but save a bit in cap, and it's only for 1 year then we can let him walk when Hughes and Petey are reupped or maybe re-sign him cheaper. Another benefit is for Podkolzin to have an instant Rusky connection on arrival as well as Tryamkin.

Sutter moves somewhere for a 4th.
Pearson moves somewhere for a 2nd.
Benn and Rouse for nothing and a 7th.

Find a way to move Baer. 

 

New lineup:

Miller Pettersson Toffoli
Gaudette/Hoglander Horvat Boeser
Ferland Anisimov Mackewan/Podkolzin
Motte Beagle Leivo

 

Hughes Tanev
Edler Myers
Tryamkin Dumba

 

Marky Demko

 

With this plan, we remain cap compliant, add toughness, add another scoring defenseman in Dumba, and also free up cap next year for our 2 big signings.

Edited September 16, 2020 by kloubek
fix

[goalie13]

1 hour ago, kloubek said:

Signings: Tryamkin

Maybe I am wrong, but doesn't he have to finish his current contract in the KHL again?  And wouldn't that take him past the off-season?

[qwijibo]

46 minutes ago, goalie13 said:

Maybe I am wrong, but doesn't he have to finish his current contract in the KHL again?  And wouldn't that take him past the off-season?

Exactly 

[kloubek]

15 minutes ago, qwijibo said:

Exactly 

Ok... fair enough. Guess the KHL playoffs end in April. But can he not join us after that? 

[mll]

13 minutes ago, kloubek said:

Ok... fair enough. Guess the KHL playoffs end in April. But can he not join us after that? 

Depends when the NHL season starts. He is a RFA and there's a signing deadline for RFAs.  Past that date they can't be added to the roster anymore.  It's 25% into the NHL season.  Was 1 December in the past.  

 

The Canucks would also need to have the cap space available.  Priority will likely be Podkolzin.  He can join at any time as he would be a 1st time ELC player and there's no deadline for them.  

[mll]

There is only a 6 goal difference between both teams.  Vancouver has more empty nets (13 to 9).

 

The Wild scored 15 goals more than Vancouver at 5v5 - good for 6th best in the league.  That's after a disastrous October where they scored only 30 goals total and were tied for last place in the standings.  The October issues are behind them - it was more behind the scenes where they had to integrate players and get on the same wave length.

 

Other than Fiala and maybe Erikson Ek the Wild don't have Fs that are more valuable than their Ds.  They can fairly easily go 4 Fs + 4 Ds for expansion as their roster stands for now.

 

Dumba could be traded to help the Wild get better but they don't have to move him.  Guerin has apparently received plenty of calls on him. They should be able to get better offers than that. 

 

Gadjovich can't even skate at AHL pace and Pronman doesn't even list him as having NHL potential in his organisational ranking.  Virtanen is not a top-6 player and they already have Greenway as inconsistent big body with all the tools but can't seem to piece it together.  Virtanen also has arbitration rights and is 2 years to UFA.  Can't use the league's financial condition as argument in arbitration.  LeBrun and Friedman believe teams could pass on qualifying some of their RFAs to avoid the arbitration risk and being stuck with a disproportionate contract given the pandemic.  

 

Green likes using Horvat against top lines.  Gaudette was one of the most sheltered players in the league this past season and was caved in - his defensive game needs work. Seems ambitious to put him besides Horvat given the role of that line.  Same for Hoglander who has yet to adjust to NHL ice and pace.  Although you are adding Toffoli, you are still taking close to 40 goals out of the lineup in Virtanen/Pearson.  

 

This is the Wild's roster right now - lines obviously not accurate.  I don't see how Guerin thinks it's a good idea to use Dumba to get a winger when their C line is so pitiful.  Eriksson Ek is a great C3.  Staal has only 1 year left and turns 36 next month.  Bjugstad is coming off spinal surgery and got his points playing on Barkov's wing and not at C.

 

Where do you even put Virtanen or Boeser as most offers are Boeser for Dumba.  Guerin was on a podcast last month and admitted that veterans like Parise and Zuccarello are going to play because of their contact status.  They both have NMCs and have 4/5 years left.  The Wild have to put them in positions to succeed and be worth their contracts.

 

Parise  ErikssonEk  Fiala

Kaprizov Staal Zuccarello

Greenway  Bjugstad Kunin

Foligno Sturm Hartman

Donato

Rask

 

The Wild have Addison so it's not like they can't move Dumba but if you look at their lineup and prospect depth it's pretty evident that wing is not really the issue.  It's top 6 centre and especially C1.  Khovanov just bailed on them to go to the KHL without even talking to the Wild ahead of time.  He projects as a C2.  They have wingers in Boldy, Beckman who was named MVP in the WHL and led the league in goals.

 

Brodin was more the D to target than Dumba.  Dumba got to play with either Suter and now Brodin - they mask a lot of his defensive lapses. Dumba is an offensive D that sometimes forgets his defensive responsibilities and often pinches at the wrong time leading to odd man rushes against.  He has Brodin to cover for him.  The Canucks don't have that kind of D.

 

The Canucks were one of the worse defensive team this season with Markstrom doing a remarkable job.  Vancouver allowed the 2nd most rush scoring chances against this season per Sportlogiq's tracking technology.  Adding Dumba without a Brodin or a prime Suter is not going to improve those numbers.

 

Fwiw in the West Colorado projects to be a top rival for years to come and they are by far the best rush scoring team in the league.

 

Edited September 16, 2020 by mll

[MrCanuck94]

Going to take a lot more to get Dumba.

[Fanuck]

Or we just trade Sutter and re-sign Marky, Toffoli & Tanev.  

 

Done.

[Lazurus]

11 hours ago, kloubek said:

Signings: Tryamkin, Leivo, Markstrom, Toffoli, Tanev, Leivo

 

Leaving Ferland on the roster because I don't know whats going on there. If we were able to get him back healthy, he would slot in 3rd line.

 

Trades:
Virtanen, Woo or Gadjovich to Wild for Dumba. I think everyone knows what Virtanen is capable of when he wants to. He will never be that player here. Wild could use some scoring help. Woo helps to replenish the D prospects or Gadjovich is a Wild-type, heavy player. With the signing of Brodin, its clear Wild are not basing their d core on Dumba. Something has gotta give considering the other high salaries. Wild are in a position to lose him at the ED anyway.

Eriksson, Stecher, Focht to Ottawa for Anisimov. Ottawa saves a couple million in real dollars and helps them get to the cap floor. They get a solid d-man in Stecher who will show their young team how to play hard, and a middling prospect in Focht. For us, we move LE. We take back some salary in Anisimov, but save a bit in cap, and it's only for 1 year then we can let him walk when Hughes and Petey are reupped or maybe re-sign him cheaper. Another benefit is for Podkolzin to have an instant Rusky connection on arrival as well as Tryamkin.

Sutter moves somewhere for a 4th.
Pearson moves somewhere for a 2nd.
Benn and Rouse for nothing and a 7th.

Find a way to move Baer. 

 

New lineup:

Miller Pettersson Toffoli
Gaudette/Hoglander Horvat Boeser
Ferland Anisimov Mackewan/Podkolzin
Motte Beagle Leivo

 

Hughes Tanev
Edler Myers
Tryamkin Dumba

 

Marky Demko

 

With this plan, we remain cap compliant, add toughness, add another scoring defenseman in Dumba, and also free up cap next year for our 2 big signings.

Not cap compliant, the team was millions over the cap before the end of the season. That could carry a penalty. The Canucks iced a team that had a cap hit of 87 mil for the first game of the play in's, essentially the end of the regular season, no other team exceed the cap at all and not counting Sven's cap hit.

Covid is hurting other teams even more, it has been speculated that some teams want the cap rolled back or will have internal caps as low as 70 mil.

 

The concept is bad nor is the mix, many of the moves can be made but there will be a step backward to get a handle on the cap.

 

Only a few more weeks and the water will get muddier with speculation. IMO if any of the Canuck contracts were going to get done there would be at least ONE done by now.

[BPA]

From all the rumors I've seen, MIN want a #1C from a Dumba trade (which isn't going to happen).  So most likely a #2C at best and/or a high 1st round draft pick so they can draft and develop a #1C.

[kloubek]

1 hour ago, BPA said:

From all the rumors I've seen, MIN want a #1C from a Dumba trade (which isn't going to happen).  So most likely a #2C at best and/or a high 1st round draft pick so they can draft and develop a #1C.

It certainly isn't. I would imagine that given his regression (since injury?) plus a 6m, ongoing contract would make many GMs think twice in this cap strapped world. Surely a motivated Jake would be a welcome option against Kunin or Zuccarello. But if they are truly after a center, then whadda ya do...

[komodo0921]

12 hours ago, kloubek said:

Signings: Tryamkin, Leivo, Markstrom, Toffoli, Tanev, Leivo

 

Leaving Ferland on the roster because I don't know whats going on there. If we were able to get him back healthy, he would slot in 3rd line.

 

Trades:
Virtanen, Woo or Gadjovich to Wild for Dumba. I think everyone knows what Virtanen is capable of when he wants to. He will never be that player here. Wild could use some scoring help. Woo helps to replenish the D prospects or Gadjovich is a Wild-type, heavy player. With the signing of Brodin, its clear Wild are not basing their d core on Dumba. Something has gotta give considering the other high salaries. Wild are in a position to lose him at the ED anyway.

Eriksson, Stecher, Focht to Ottawa for Anisimov. Ottawa saves a couple million in real dollars and helps them get to the cap floor. They get a solid d-man in Stecher who will show their young team how to play hard, and a middling prospect in Focht. For us, we move LE. We take back some salary in Anisimov, but save a bit in cap, and it's only for 1 year then we can let him walk when Hughes and Petey are reupped or maybe re-sign him cheaper. Another benefit is for Podkolzin to have an instant Rusky connection on arrival as well as Tryamkin.

Sutter moves somewhere for a 4th.
Pearson moves somewhere for a 2nd.
Benn and Rouse for nothing and a 7th.

Find a way to move Baer. 

 

New lineup:

Miller Pettersson Toffoli
Gaudette/Hoglander Horvat Boeser
Ferland Anisimov Mackewan/Podkolzin
Motte Beagle Leivo

 

Hughes Tanev
Edler Myers
Tryamkin Dumba

 

Marky Demko

 

With this plan, we remain cap compliant, add toughness, add another scoring defenseman in Dumba, and also free up cap next year for our 2 big signings.

1. Tryamkin can't be signed until his contract is up in the KHL.

2. The fact that Toffoli is closer to signing then Marky, suggests things aren't going well with negotiations to retain him and we could, very well, be looking at Demko as our starter next season.

3. Trading for Dumba would be pushing Tanev out the door due to commitments to Edler and Myers.

4. Agree on Leivo. He's proven effective when healthy. Want to see him in a full season. He should come at a decent price.

5. Want to see Motte back too.

6. The highlighted area is where dealing Virtanen becomes an issue. Everyone knows he's got skills but, everyone also knows he's a wildcard as to what's being gained. Virtanen has value but, I don't think it's high enough to get Dumba, even with the proposed adds. I'd have to believe Boeser's name would come up, and that's a non-starter for me. I do, however, agree Virtanen's time here should come to an end. 

7. Ottawa's not taking Eriksson for, what amounts to leftovers. Stetcher's a decent depth guy but, he's far from getting Loui off the books. Focht may be a decent player but, is no where near an NHL certainty. I believe we're riding Eriksson's contract to the bitter end.

 

While this years playoff push has created a strong desire to see it improved on, the fact is, it was also a real toss up as to who was going to come out of the gates hot and who was going to be cold. Some players' desire to be there may not have been strong as evidenced by Rask's departure mid-run. This creates a lot of doubt in my mind as to where we truly are in our build. The reality is, we may not have even made the playoffs, had the season been played out. While grabbing a high profile player in Dumba may be an exciting prospect to some, I rebut with the fact that we have a defender in our own system in Woo that carries a lot of the same traits as Dumba and is one I'd like to see fully developed. Sports history has proven that internal development is the true path to winning. I believe this should be our direction. 

[JeremyCuddles]

How many times does it need to be stated that Dumba isn't being traded for anything other than a legit top 6 center. Bjugstad is not the fix to their center problem. If he was Pittsburgh would not have needed to retain. Why would they take Virtanen and a unproven prospect for a top 4 minute munching RD? 

[BigTramFan]

I would be keen on three things this off season:

1. Upgrading our D with a younger RHD that meshes well with Hughes. Not a Dumba type, but more a Pesce type. - e.g. trade Boeser for Pesce

2. Clearing a bunch of cap so that all 2019/20 performance overages plus 2020/21 performance bonuses are covered. This generates much more ability to lock in Pettersson and Hughes to long term deals in 2021. This means moving on from guys that are not part of the future...IMO this includes Eriksson, Markstrom, Sutter, Stecher, Roussel, Virtanen. We will have to sell some futures to get there.

3. Remain competitive in the short term, so our core is learning about how to win in the playoffs. - To me this means signing Tanev, Toffoli plus another top 6 forward (e.g. UFA Craig Smith) and signing a decent 1A/1B goalie to rotate with Demko (e.g. UFA Greiss). Smith and Greiss are guys that are standing in until our young talent (Podkolzin, Hoglander, Dipietro) develop.

 

My example roster next season is below. You might not agree with the details of the trades or signing amounts, but MOST important to note that the cap space is greater than the performance bonuses! This means we have no carry over to 2021. And this includes having Ferland on injured reserve - not LTIR, otherwise we will not have the cap space to pay the 2020-21 performance bonuses.

 

 

 

[UKNuck96]

22 hours ago, kloubek said:

Ok... fair enough. Guess the KHL playoffs end in April. But can he not join us after that? 

From what I understand if he has a break clause he can come whenever, however the KHL is not pro NHL so unlikely to be in place. He could break his contract (unlikely) or the Canucks could pay compensation to his club to do so (have no idea how this would work with the cap etc and again unlikely)

 

the Canucks could sign him before the RFA deadline and his cap hit would be applied right away, and he could finish his KHl season. However that would require leaving the cap space available for such a signing and it eating up cap space while he was in the KHL. (This is a possibility but depends on what next season looks like and the gap between the RFA deadline and the playoffs) 

[mll]

5 minutes ago, UKNuck96 said:

From what I understand if he has a break clause he can come whenever, however the KHL is not pro NHL so unlikely to be in place. He could break his contract (unlikely) or the Canucks could pay compensation to his club to do so (have no idea how this would work with the cap etc and again unlikely)

 

the Canucks could sign him before the RFA deadline and his cap hit would be applied right away, and he could finish his KHl season. However that would require leaving the cap space available for such a signing and it eating up cap space while he was in the KHL. (This is a possibility but depends on what next season looks like and the gap between the RFA deadline and the playoffs) 

Canucks can’t pay for that.  Would be considered cap circumvention and could lead to fines that count against the cap of up to 5M and even possibly the loss of draft picks. 

[UKNuck96]

26 minutes ago, mll said:

Canucks can’t pay for that.  Would be considered cap circumvention and could lead to fines that count against the cap of up to 5M and even possibly the loss of draft picks. 

I’m not a CBA expert and wasn’t sure on the NHL policy on essentially paying transfer fees - but so that means that option is off the table.

 

I guess with Tryamkin it’s either do something next off season or sign him before RFA deadline and take the cap hit then and wait untill KHL season is done for him to join 

[mll]

27 minutes ago, UKNuck96 said:

I’m not a CBA expert and wasn’t sure on the NHL policy on essentially paying transfer fees - but so that means that option is off the table.

 

I guess with Tryamkin it’s either do something next off season or sign him before RFA deadline and take the cap hit then and wait untill KHL season is done for him to join 

He would have to pay it himself as he would be breaking his contract.

 

There’s no agreement so they can’t get involved.

 

Don’t think Benning is looking to do that.  I think it would still require him to get out of his contract so he can be loaned back.

[Lazurus]

Thinking mostly about the flat cap for the next 3 or more years

 

Extend Term and cap hits not salary structure

Hughes - 4 years @ 6 mil average

Pettersson - 4 years @ 6 mil average,

Virtanen - 4 years @ 2 mil average

Edler - -one year deals at 3 mil and down

Demko - 5 years at 4.5 mil average.

At the end of the KHL season bring in Podkolzin at entry level and Tryamkin - 4 years 3.5 mil deal. Holander's season end - entry level.

 

Horvat and Miller are both signed for another 3 years

 

Sign Gaudette and Motte to 1.5 mil for 3 to 4 years, just straight up contracts

 

Just dealing with these players and contracts, not competitiveness.

Edited September 30, 2020 by Lazurus

[Lazurus]

Today there is the OEL talk. IMO if they are going for that then they need to have the Yotes retain some and take Eriksson.

Otherwise just make Pietrangelo an offer he can't refuse, no they can't do that but I do think there are other possibilities in OEL's price range.

I would offer sheet Sergachev AND Cernak both for 4 mil, two 2nds, a way better deal than Vey for a second and both have way more upside than Gudbranson did. I would offer up OJ in return to lighten and try to make it more of a trade. Hopefully I get one of them

 

If they do make the OEL deal and succeed with an offer sheet, with Sergachev as the prime, instead of a trade then;

Immediately after that I would start negotiating extensions for Demko, Pettersson and Hughes

 .