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Everything posted by EdgarM
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I don't disagree with you ,however the original poster's argument was that Bo was our Best Center. I think he even said he was the best looking, I wouldn't know about that one though.
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As I said before, the title reads:" Bo Horvat is the Canucks best center." and I am discussing the pro's and cons of this so how am I trolling? I already mentioned I like Bo as a player but I just don't think I believe he is the "Best Center" and I stated why. Sheesh, some people are so sensitive having such discussions on a "discussion board" like this. Anyway, it doesn't really matter as management will sign who they want and trade who they don't want or the player will want to stay or want to play elsewhere. At the end of the day, I want my team to win a championship and all of us have our own idea what that is going to look like. Maybe my idea is totally wrong and that is why these discussions exist and you can explain to me why I am wrong. Since the Linden/Bure era, I have only seen a handful of players with that "go to war" mentality in the playoffs. Kess, Burr and the Honey Badger were some that I seen "Upped" their game in the post season and they didn't settle for the "Country Club" mentality. Sorry but I see Miller "going to war" before Bo. Not saying Bo is not a great player but I kinda prefer Miller in what he brings to the table. Maybe its seeing this team consistently bow out in the playoffs why I am so skeptical of some type of players. I am no attention seeker by any stretch of the imagination I am just like many of you who are passionate about the game of hockey and hope that one day the Stanley Cup comes to Vancouver. Preferably in my lifetime too.
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.......Or when the whole team was sucking at the beginning of last season. Consistency is huge, especially when you are looked at as the leader by your peers. I am looking at a more complete player who is more then being good at face offs or scores the odd pretty goal. Sticking up for your team mates is huge as well as well as producing offensively at closer to a point per game.
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I think Miller is our best player with Hughes and Demko close seconds. Petey will be once he fully develops.
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Again because my opinion is different from yours does not make it "dead wrong". Don't get me wrong, I think Bo is great player and he has had some great moments as a Canuck, I just see both Miller and Petterson as better options as the #1 Center moving forward. Maybe that is not true but that is my opinion and I am entitled to my own opinion. I also see how important the role Bo played since coming here. I do think though that Miller has taken over the role, especially on the PK and even on face offs. Bo was the #2 guy behind Hank for sure but times have changed.
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Oh I like the guys who cherry pick stats and use them to describe their narrative. Obviously the comparison is not that obvious and it was more of a comparison to a player who obviously excels at face offs. I don't think I would put Bo's offensive ability up there with Petey and Millers and that is what the point was. Thanks for pointing out those obvious stats though.
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Its called an Opinion "Buddy" and that is why these discussion boards exist. Just because my feelings on a certain player are different from yours "I don't know hockey" ? My feelings on the BEST CENTER should be someone who scores on a PPG pace. You may not agree and thats fine. I don't really care if a player is great at face offs or is great off the ice or what ever else you want to look at it, they are paid millions to win games and win championships. Period.
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Too bad he didn't do this on a more consistent basis, he might be closer to a point a game player.
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LOL! The thread is labeled "Bo Horvat is the Canucks best center." I am just responding to the thread. I am going by past accomplishments of many different teams and many failures. Yes I am a fan who has watched this team for a very long time. We all have our favorite players and I favor the more complete player as opposed to the ones that are exceptional in one or two areas. Players such as Linden, Iginla, Lemieux,Pronger,Scott Stevens,Bertuzzi,Benn,Lindros and Burns come to mind. I think if you are going to pay a player upwards of 7-10 million dollars a year, they better have exceptional atributes, especially if they going to be considered the leader of your team. As you go down your list on the team the attributes get less and less and that is the nature of the beast. You have the checkers, face off specialists, PKers etc. Your top 2 centers better have great attributes, and then some, if you want to win a championship one day.
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Some of us fans out there look at the team first before individual players. In reality, this is the way the team must be looked at due to the fact that every team must follow the Cap. You need to get your moneys worth or you will find yourself with a toolbox that does not have the required tools to get the job done, i.e a championship. I would love to keep a player like Bo but the reality is, that your top paid players must have all the attributes to get the job done. Even more so when the team puts a "C" on your chest. We are talking about our "best center" and you have to look at what they bring to the table and what they don't. Miller ticks more of the "need" boxes and Petey will develope into our top center in time. To have Bo be paid in the 7 million dollar range to be the 3rd line center, just can't fit under todays salary cap, unfortunately.
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Fuse any two Canucks! (and send them through time!)
EdgarM replied to Baratheon's topic in Canucks Talk
I am with you on this one. I first thought the Bure/Brashear was good but then I thought Churla would say that he already had a little Brashear in him already. If you put Linden and Bure together, is there anything he couldn't do? The only player that came close was Lemieux, and he was unstoppable. -
I am pretty sure Miller had covid too but he didn't use it as an excuse not to perform every night. We cannot afford to pay a center the money he is going to command because he is a "Face off" specialist. We need another Sutter/Malhotra to fit that role who is going to play on the third or fourth line. The time of accepting our top players deficiencies should be a thing of the past IMHO.
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I have said this in another discussion that Bo is our over paid 3rd line center. Miller is currently our #1 Center and Petey will certainly take over that role at some point. Bo is our Manny Maholtra with a little bit more offensive ability. I don't think anyone seen Manny as our #1 Center when he was here. Bo is missing too many other attributes that many have already mentioned. He is inconsistent at times, does not play an aggressive role as a leader and lacks that #1 center offensive ability. As a shut down guy, i believe he was utilized as such mainly because there was no one on the team that could fill that role. Hank was never going to be that person and there was no one else really before Miller came along. Petey is still developing. I really think Bo has carried on that "Country Club" mentality as well that has carried over from past leaders. There should be a realignment on this team where we save cap space and change the mentality of this team at the same time. Many seem to forget that when this team was in total disarray at the beginning of last season, Miller was the only one who was carrying this team and Bo was no where to be found. I would say that Miller has been the most consistent center on this team since he arrived , who coincidentally plays in every situation whether it be PP, PK, over time or taking a key faceoff. These are true signs of a #1 Center IMO.
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I find it odd that even after he is found "Not Guilty" he is still being seen as "guilty ". It sounds like he has some character flaws and not an all round good role model as a "Hockey player" but he was found not guilty. I am not going to "assume" anything more and leave it at that. Some here seem to have a hate on for him and it was quite evident when his accuser first came forward. I found it quite interesting that she mentioned this right after he signed his big NHL contract extension and not Years before. I reserved my judgment on this until a verdict was decided. The evidence supported this with her testimony during the trial.
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The Current Construction of the Vancouver Canucks
EdgarM replied to Elias Pettersson's topic in Canucks Talk
Thats pretty much it in a nut shell. That and more grit. -
I get that if he wants a long contract and he wants to be "PAID", sure lets get something for him, but I think that is not the case yet and he is still a Canuck. Same with Bo. I guess we will soon see their intentions and then make the proper deals accordingly. I agree Alf, that Tavares deal was bad for them, poor Leafs
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With Cap Space of 27.5 million next year, whats the urgency to trade him and move on? Bo and Miller are the only significant signings for next year so I am not sure why the "doom and gloom" of absolutely getting rid of him. Am I missing something?
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[Signing] Canucks re-sign Brock Boeser
EdgarM replied to -Vintage Canuck-'s topic in Trades, Rumours, Signings
That wrist shot you speak of Alf is not the same. He seems like a mere mortal in that department the last few years. Yes they are different in that respect as Garland is a bit more of a play driver when entering the O zone. The similarities I was speaking of had to do with their grit and strength at retrieving the puck along the boards or on a one to one basis and points they produce. Neither are going to fight off checks single handedly or come out of the corners with the puck most times. Garland does have that "Ronning" ability to slip out of tricky situations though. They both throw checks although I don't know how effective they are. Maybe this is Brocks year where he has no distractions and that wrist has healed to where he can show us that sniper ability he showed us when he first came here. -
[Signing] Canucks re-sign Brock Boeser
EdgarM replied to -Vintage Canuck-'s topic in Trades, Rumours, Signings
Boeser is a much different player since his rookie season. I seriously thought he was the second coming of Bure in the pace he was scoring when he first came on the scene. He has changed since then, whether his wrist injury did anything or not, but that wrist shot is not the same. Still he is a good player and yes he is not a "superstar play driver" for sure. I just look at a player who is making close to 7 million a season as having more attributes such as size, speed and grit to their game. I see Garland as a similar type player who makes considerably less money. -
The Current Construction of the Vancouver Canucks
EdgarM replied to Elias Pettersson's topic in Canucks Talk
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[Signing] Canucks re-sign Brock Boeser
EdgarM replied to -Vintage Canuck-'s topic in Trades, Rumours, Signings
I don't disagree with you in that the effort is totally there, his foot speed gets the best of him though and you can really see it on the PP when he gets pressured. Petey has the same concern too but Petey is a little quicker which gets him out trouble most of the time. And by the way, I watch EVERY GAME for your information. -
[Signing] Canucks re-sign Brock Boeser
EdgarM replied to -Vintage Canuck-'s topic in Trades, Rumours, Signings
Not to chime in on whether each player is better or not but I agree with your statement above. A player who is valuable in the regular season may not be as valuable in the playoffs and vice versa. Take for example play along the boards. If you go in the corners and come out empty handed, it makes it very difficult for you to be able to score without the puck or make a play. You would be hard pressed to maintain possession of the puck for that matter. Boeser many times relied on a player like Miller to dig the puck out for him and dish him the puck to be effective. If we are in game 7 in the SCF and 1 minute left in the 3rd? The decision of which player I may want on the ice might prove more difficult to decide. -
The Current Construction of the Vancouver Canucks
EdgarM replied to Elias Pettersson's topic in Canucks Talk
Haha, and there it is. Cheers! -
The Current Construction of the Vancouver Canucks
EdgarM replied to Elias Pettersson's topic in Canucks Talk
Yeah I thought Brian Burke was the brainchild for assembling most of that team. Not sure if we have had any good picks for a long time after he left. I think it went dry until we drafted Bo in 2013. That's a long time to go without picking any real NHL ready players worth mentioning.