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Everything posted by Phat Fingers
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Like the way our defensive depth is shaping up. Hard to see where Subban fits into things with Stecher already making an impact on the NHL roster. Guys like McEnemy and Brisbiois also playing the right side. Subban has to play PP minutes to be effective at the NHL level. He is also up against guys like Pedan, who has issues, but can add a physical element and play as a 4th grinder. Pedan will likely top out as a 7/8 NHL defender. I could see McEnemy leap frogging Subban on the right side similarly to how Stecher did. Either way, it's a nice problem to have, defensive depth. Always needed and always has value during the TDL. EW
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Time to start another thread, the we should have drafted ' insert name here' and allow posters that want to talk about and keep tabs on our actual prospects to do so.
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Anyone know how's Juolevi doing? Seems to be a Should have drafted MT thread.
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Samuelson was able to be a fairly productive player. I really want to see Jake with some creative linemates. Part of what I believe is going on is that Jake is forcing shots thru that maybe he shouldn't. He does need to hit, but I am not worried about him being physical. We don't know what coaching he is getting, whether Green wants him to focus on his play without the puck, not putting himself out of position to make a hit... for example. It seems to be a complete tear down and rebuild kinda season for Jake. That's okay, provided that he turns he corner next year. EW
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Okay I yield.... I'll give you the National Post, but not CBS, I said legit sports casters... EW
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He has the tools and I am pulling for him too. I haven't seen him block a shot yet. He could have it in him when he gets sent down next season at the start of camp. That NHL pay check is a big motivation.
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At this point maybe... Still hope for more for a 6th OA pick.
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You earn your reps, good or bad. You have earned yours and now whine about it. WTFC (who the &^@# cares) about their rep on an Internet forum. You troll this thread daily. Whatever good points you add are often lost with the huge hateraid dose you let lose along the way. I always thought giving a troll a negative was like applause. Really, wear it with pride, you have earned it.
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Why would Jake not be an effective PKer? It seems like he has good defence numbers, can back skate better than most d men. He can also create turnovers at a decent rate and if he does get the pick, he can counter attack quickly. He has shown to not be completely wasted in a defensive role. Maybe we should get Jake and Subban to switch positions!!! It it would be a likely role for him, that and being a 3rd line winger as his floor, provided that he improves his fitness. Jake will always be a complimentary player on offence. He has to improve his once feared shot, become more physical and when he is in the o zone, to be a net presence. He will never be a solo offensive driver, but he could compliment a smaller shifty skilled player really well. Think of Ronning when he had Momesso and Sandlack as wingers. They made a decent line, Ronning for a lot more space due to the size of his wingers. Obviously I hope Jake is better than Momesso and Sandlack, but I do hope we have a Ronning in our prospect pool somewhere.
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I am the poster in question and the statement you are referring to is not about pre draft listings, but commentary by analysts on draft day. My statement has nothing to do with the predraft rankings. No one was surprised or disappointed with Vancouver taking OJ. Go back and watch the tape. As for the pre draft rankings, as J.R. has highlighted, the top 2 was set, with number 3 (Puljarvi) considered to be another tier down from the top 2, then 4-6 was another tier down. OJ and the son of Keith along with PLD were in that range. There was speculation that the Oil could take OJ at 4, then CJB went off the board for PLD.... The 4-6 range was a group. So if you have a difference of opinion about my claim, name me one analyst on draft day that questioned Vancouver taking OJ over Tkachuk. I never saw it, but you show me some tape or a post draft analysis from a legit major network analyst (not some geek typing on a keyboard in his parents basement) and I will yield. EW
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It's more like what have you done for me lately;) The CDC needs an infusion of Ritalin. We come across as a bunch of cats trying to catch a laser pointer high on cat nip.
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CHL rights only applies to NHL/AHL. Players have gone back, Jansen was one. I am not sure if permission has to be given, but this is were the rights of CHL clubs have in controlling were players play needs to be limited. It should be about what is best for the player, who risks injury, who is barely compensated, not what's. best for the CHL or junior team.
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Or a year in Europe. I am sure a pro team in Finland or the SEL would sign Joulevi for a year.
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Appreciate the analysis, but there is a bit more to the situation. Stonker may not be wrong, but his isnt right. Depth or lack of at the parent club level is the overriding factor in the rapid rise of prospects. To think that prospects will be better developed in the NHL vs he AHL is counter intuitive and illogical. Baer spent half a season down in Utica. 22 y/o college students and Russian pros are that much more developed. They are usually better prepared to play in the NHL. JB has stated that he was working hard to fill in the 22-24 age gap and feels that is accomplished, in that gap, Baer, Granlund, Trymakin. Stecher Hutton, Gaunce and Guddy. Other drafts players are still in junior leagues. Other than Jake, Demko and now Gaunce, no other player drafted in the top two rounds is currently in Utica. Hard to do a lot with such an anemic roster. This club has a proven track record of developing NHL coaches in the AHL. Green will be another.
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In the arse for making such a good draft pick IMO Boeser looks to be a similar player to Tkachuk without the asshole smirk. Calgary is flush in decent young defenders where we had almost nothing in the system until this year. OJ was a higher team need, and is the best defender of the draft. Tkachuk may be the first horse out of the gate, but there is a long way to go before declaring winners and losers. OJ is going to be great, I think he was JB's best pick since coming to Van. The handwringing sore loser draft analyst hype that prevails on this board is hilarious. BTW, Joulevi and Tkachuk were picked about were they should have been. Toss up. PLD at 3 was the surprise. Not one analyst thought Vancouver should have picked Tkachuk over Juolevi on draft day. PLD, Tkachuk and OJ were all projected to go between 4-6. There was no consensus ranking. Another thought, this team road a decent defence into the ground, by no adding any useful d prospects for close to ten years (save Tanev). We finally draft, what will likely be the best defender to wear Canucks colours so far in our entire history, and posters are 'wah wah, we should have drafted the son of Keith.. wah.' OJ has looked sublime in the film that I have managed to see, increased his points on a weaker team while carrying a pairing and being relied upon to take tough minutes. Whats not like about OJ and why are people talking about another teams player in his thread. Does MT play defence? No, so how does that matter in the evaluation of OJ?
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Wait and see if he does and then post that crap. Can we wait before condemning our second highest drafted player since the Sedins. The kid is just 20. As a fan base, we will rue the day we drive this guy out of town, only to see him flourish somewhere else.
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Yup, I am right there with you.
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Sure, but think of it this way, as Ray Ferraro put it, this is Jakes first year as a pro, last year was such an anomaly, he should have been in Junior. Jake plays last year and has trouble adjusting to the AHL, so what. The only thing making this hard for serous fans is his NHL time last season. Green is fine with him, he is apparently working hard in practise and off the ice. He looks way leaner in that recent interview. Let's say Jake is having an extreme makeover Green style. He is going to be rebuilt from the ground up and have to earn his time. It makes stat watching easier. Next season will show if Jake is legit or not. Early returns are often misleading.
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Stonker, Who is the Maestro Desjardins you speak of, I have never heard of him? So rushing prospects back to the NHL is the proper way to develop them? Especially when the coach you you love so much has stated that the NHL is not a development league. So less practice time, less one on one coaching and tougher competition is the cure? I know you think Willie is awesome and all, but this is a bit much. Jake needs to earn his way back. Him just getting into game shape is not enough. Jake needs to go thru his development away from Vancouver, away from the media and the CDC. Let him get hungry for that pay check and the first class lifestyle he can have if he earns it. This guy needs time, Green is more than capable of developing players in Utica. EW
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Your assuming both are finished products. I am not.
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As of now WN has one goal and 7 more assists than Baer. Both a players that rely on skill, both play alot of left wing. Very Comparable. Far more comparable than Jake and WN. Drafted 3 years apart, the age gap is there, but it's not outrageous They play the same roles and there is not a lot of difference, other than age, between them. One was had for a 2nd rounder and the other was a top ten pick. I did not say I would take Jake at six in a redraft, but I would not take WN. Larkin, Pasternak and Ehlers, absolutely, but I do not like Joffery, and will never like Joffery. What I was getting at was Baer fills the same role on the Canucks as WN does on the leafs. Not as productive, but the team as whole isn't productive. Baer was had for a second round pick. If Jake can be rounded into form, he will fill a much different role that cannot be found for a second round pick. EW
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We have a Granlund! We also have Baer, Bo and Gaunce. All will be good pieces to build a solid four line team.
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I am not saying you are wrong to like Nylander. I do not, and did not think he was the player to go with and still don't. As you alluded too, Baer is in Nylanders spot on our team, plays a better two way game and was had for a second round pick. So without drafting a top ten pick we already have a very comparable player to Nylander that plays a more complete game. IMO WN is a player that needs other really good players to be good. He cannot play defence and IMO will fold like a cheap tent in a tough physical series. A player that is suited to the east but would get eaten up in the west. So even with poor early returns on Jake, I would still take him in the draft over WN. Not over Ehlers, who was my pick going into the draft, or Larkin, or Pasternak. EW
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Toews, Early returns are often misleading. I too would take Jake over Joffrey, who would just get eaten alive in the west. In vancity he would likely be in Utica this season. I wanted Ehlers, but will back Jake for a while yet. Nylander will wilt under the post season pressure. Two years ago Gaudreau lit up the league, now he draws the attention of team defence and his numbers are down. I think Johnny Hockey would kick Nylanders ass in regards to toughness. If I was LL, I would look to sell Nylander for another team need in the long run. EW