Phat Fingers

Alf, if a college player is going to bolt, they will bolt. it’s that simple. character is a flaw or a bonus, and your assuming the he will straight line transfer to an NHL top 9. then why is his skating a knock.. with giant success with college drafted players in this organization, why would Aiden not sign? Cause Umburger was mad the Kessler had a bigger package and sulked… the Abbey road, it’s a great pathway to an NHL contract, just ask Gads.

If Aiden MacDounagh needs to improve his skating to get to an NHL level, then he should sign. Bo is one guy that shows Vancouver has focused on this in player development. Brock is never a fast guy, but his skating was a massive issue earlier. JT Miller went from a third liner to a All star, his bigest improvement was his foot work, his feet never stop moving. Podz has big skating issues that really were technical and look at how he moved at the end of the season. along with wizards at skating like Garland, Peterson, OEL and the best example is Hughes. If skating is your weakness, then this is a place that has helped others overcome it.

Shhh…. They are working through, what is known as the process. Wait until after the draft, ignore that the club just moved to Abbey and had to basically rebuild an AHL franchise from the ground up in one season. Forget that the farm team is in Abbey and every first year.

I would give up a lot to go for Jirmek as the second RHD. garland and the first and solid prospect. Ottawa is at 7.. any chance he falls? or should the Nucks target a RHD RFA with and offer sheet. i just don’t see Seattle or Philly moving their pick. but I could see alot of benefit to moving down and targeting a number of d men who fill all kinds of needs in the late first and early second.. Bischel, Luneau, Pickering, Salomonsson etc… there are solid Centre’s as well which are always in short supply. then offer sheet Dobson and use the extra pick gained by trading down and maybe a pick or two gained from a deal for Pearson and or Garland. but i would be happy to lose the cap fro Pearson and Dickinson, if Dickinson cannot play Center, and see if maybe the third and 7th rounder back if we are lucky can turn into fools gold later… lol.

I am loving this guys shot. I can’t even see the puck until it’s in the net when I watch it over again and I know where to look. wicked wrist shot… Naslund level.. he’s strong on the puck, and has size… does he have the speed to work an NHL rink with no time and or space… that’s the wait and see. Side note… we need a RHD that can bring in that added element to the PP and attack when 5 vs 5. It would open up the Right half wall for Petey like it does for Miller and Bo with Hughes and OEL. Just getting a guy that can play defence and pass it back and forth with a decent shot that creates a rebound that shoots Right would be a game changer and any FA with brains should see the potential for major dividends playing with such dynamic players…

I used to get a once in the life time kinda experience flying in and out of logging camps on the west coast in Beavers… if you don’t know what a flying beaver is… then you have to look that up.. it’s a float plane… so the best and or worst flights to get were the ones that others said, ‘Nope, I will take the boat… a three to four hour trip. that’s when the flight ceiling drops and the pilots fly in between the waves and the land marks, and ‘Island Hopping’ takes on the whole new meaning… i would sit in the front with the Pilot… thinking, better not to survive the crash, but enjoy the landing… others worried. guess what… none of us had any control but the pilot… so hope for a landing….

If we have a suitable replacement from within, then any higher contract non core player is expendable. your post lauded the structure of the flames under Sutter. Defence wins championships and hot goalies. Boudreau was working mid season with what he had, and shifting mandates. Coaches have a lot of latitude and Bruce played to the teams strength, but the lack of structured defence is a coaching and or personal issue. Bruce also could have a weak spot for AHL cast offs that never quite made it. Ala Hunt. Everyone has a weak spot, me it’s women who smile and tell you stories that later turn out not to be true. but we all have weaknesses. With Alvin wanting a SC winning coach, with a successful history of also building players… well then Trotz and or Q are both out there. it’s not a straight up move. it will be the biggest move Alvin makes should he not keep Bruce. Or he can punt. either way, unless we are promoting from within, we are going to need a player capable of playing 20 plus minutes a night in a two way role matching up with secondary PP and first PP ability plus can play all situations and will be in key situations that can stay healthy. How much does a player on either side of the Defence cost who can do the OEL and Myers do via either trade and or FA? cause for all those saying trading OEL will free up 7.3 in cap space… nope. The above asking price on the market for a player that can provide what OEL does is about 6 m starting on the FA market. so we will get maybe 1.3 for a lesser version of OEL and likely as old or older via FA. The RHD is the weak spot. The JB moves when he let Tanev go and brought in Hamonic to save 1.5 in cap looks terrible now… having a Hughes Tanev OEL Myers top 4 would be a huge upgrade for 1.5 million bucks. same with Myers. Who played every game and in every tough game situation. his biggest issues in his career was playing without the puck and staying healthy. Now it’s can he rediscover his offence or is he really found his true niche and a 3 spot Shut down and two way partner on the RHD who is very mobile and huge. Who do we pay to take his minutes? Calgary capitalized on what JB was trying to build here, but his earlier mistakes came back to haunt him, and he tried to cut corners in the post Lock down play offs to go with three cheaper options, the Emerging Demko inherited the position from Markstrom. That worked out fairly well. then he saved 1 million by going with his first drafter player.. over Tiffoli and saved 1.5 m to lose Tanev and hoped Hamonic would play to his prior abilities. So the bulk of the money saved was from the move within. the other two moves were disastrous and the potential to bring in OEL was the reason. JB lacked the staff to handle too many things at once… Montreal and Calgary pounced. but to think that OEL can easily be reapplied by a player, a rookie that has yet to play a full season in the pros… is a big reach at this point. Money can be moved out in Pearson and or Garland as the team looks set to keep Brock. Pearson is 4 million and Podz is taking his minutes. Or Hogz… or Garland. We are tight with having to pay for Four goalies and only getting two this year… a common problem in Van.. good thing we have Ian Clark and factory down the highway. A lateral move that brings in a targeted replacement and lowers costs that can provide the same abilities and minutes of either Myers and or OEL is great. But so far all I hear is ‘cap savings’ with pie in the sky expectations of non proven not even NHL rookies, like everyone can be Hughes or Pettersson. it’s doesn’t work that way. great post.

We would have been murdered, our younger budding super stars would have been run and our amazing goalie would have been meat without the money spent on OEL. What’s the point in winning the draft if you just mangle your stats like Edmonton did and Buffalo and Zona does. we missed by inches, it’s supposed to suck and I want those budding superstars to think about how it’s not as much fun watching the sport you live than playing the sport you love. love to Brock and his family. peace.

With all due respect we took LV to seven games two years ago… it was the last season abs first 25 games that ended JB and Greens tenure, as it should have. The right people would.have been who, what moves did Rutherford and Alvin make other than to keep the team JB built together with a fresh coach?

Myers is staying unless something big and massive is happening with a return of a top 4 RHD. We need two not none. And we don’t need to get smaller. We need to have more than Schenn and Myers be the size too. Poolman cannot play in structure. Not this year. Hughes by his very nature is less structured, Myers is a guy that will always look awkward to the eye, because of his being giant. We need a guy to fit in between Myers and Schenn that can either provide a solid partner for OEL or Hughes. Myers get assigned the other. Schenn and Burroughs round out the RHD with Hughes OEL and Dermott and Rathbone rounding out the left side. we need another top 4 RHD that can play with OEL or Hughes effectively. That allows sheltering of RHD minutes, depth and solid 5 v 5 players to build cohesive play with. I want them to have an effective shot, cause they will get to use it more than ever before in their career if it is effective. Its Manson or a player like him and he is affordable,

Guys, Rutherford and Alvin are smart savvy guys. Rutherfords pedigree pours cold water on every set style question. They also have someone paying attention to the main issues that fans are looking at as issues, they put someone on the outside looking at the organization from the outside. It’s an adaptation of a fundamental principle in Security issues that Israeli faces, that one principle work the issue from outside the chain of command. To avoid the risk to a total ‘group think’ blind spot or spots developing in their state security. They always have one of their own trying to break in and find the weak spots before their many enemies find them. This is also used as a plot line in disaster spoofs. but it comes with the risk that the outsider is often right. A very dangerous thing for the establishment to hear. but I digress…. Alvin and Rutherford don’t just listen to the season ticket holders, they are paying some poor person to listen or track what the die hards are seeing. Considering how bad almost every other management system in Vancouver’s history, largely due to the very long standing media and management spats and feuds, that have even grown to a nation level, or league wide level, it doesn’t take long for the friction to carry forward into the next regimes. JB might have had the shortest tenure of respect for the media as a GM, and because the Media are the lens, that disregard carried forward at times to the fans. JB was a guy that wasn’t the best at communication and didn’t explain his moves all that well. Rutherford and Alvin put on a Clinic. But that’s why they are amongst the most popular in management circles with the media, so too is Bruce, and Grannato etc.. The media around the Hockey world love these folks, they listen and want like what they are hearing because of the way it’s being said. This won’t come out until the team has success, but that Rutherford and Alvin are coming into a largely finished project… that yes, took longer than anyone expected, but it was a Reno and not a Rebuild. A tear down rebuild, that’s ugly and it’s turns off fans and the club ownership choose deliberately to go with the more uncertain timeline but still have a ‘liveable structure’ of an on Ice product and use the natural talents of JB scouting background to be the true success. So the if the Scouting department ‘Drafting and Development’ is the Kitchen then it got all the best stuff first. Save JV and OJ, that clearly happened. Yet not one pick above 6 in the entire tenure of JB, we have superstars that are the very type that win championships. The crapper was kept working, and more were installed. JB’s last flush was a giant and it used them all at the same time. Reference the OEL and Garland for a pile of …. Trade that a new coach not in his first NHL gig, would have known would be an issue, with D pairings not settled in Pre season with a huge influx of new guys and Hughes missed most of camp and Hamonic wasn’t there either. so the tire fire that was the worst defence in the league at getting the puck out of its own zone, I have no doubt that the first 25 games made that stat what it is. Considering we finished behind Zona on zone exits, based on the season Pre and post Bruce, that tire fire could be seen from space. Fans should have been prepared and the Coach should have been too. Or fired… but love the session of Rutherford and Alvin. They are doing exacty what this fans hoped, and the team is coming back and more over, Rutherford just heaped the next seasons success on the guys shoulders who want it the most, Hughes, Demko and Patterson and signalled that they are making every effort to resign Brock, a heart and soul guy in the locker room that clearly is very close with the team and club. He wants to stay. They want him to stay. That means that Brock is the type of guy that puts others first, and that type of character is itself being represented by all parties as it should be. Something that Keenan for instance would be incapable of… and others. By and large the walls are built, the structure is sound. But the finishing touches are needed and I have to say, those touches are of experience hands, and are taught, learned and mentored. I hope that this is a new chapter in the media and Canucks relationship, as there is bad blood that goes back to the first season and or draft and doesn’t ever stop. the first Canada Cup when the fans booed team Canada, that’s still talked about on the east coast, they only remember the bad things out here, they don’t want to like people that live in a better part of the country. They also bought into the Media Hateraid that was the 2012 SCF. They are building from within and focused on the Defence and identified the structure and being able to play in it. That’s not Poolman, that’s not Hunt. Myers OEL and Schenn all play structures with Myers being the most likely to get pulled out. Quinn chased a lot early but really tightened up his play without the puck as the season progressed. Dermott is found money. Burroughs is a player that needs to think about his life after hockey, a tough guy, lovely hitter and respected already for his backbone. But with his size and and fearless play, I want him to think and keep his long term health in mind, when he chooses to drop the gloves and when not too. KB3 like. No one is indestructible. RIP Rypen. It’s going to be a draft and off season to follow, but not anything more that the finish work needed to take the club to the next level, that’s not a playoff team, it’s to being a contender. In my mind the club, the players showed me this year that they have the commitment to be the same team the took LV to 7 games two years ago. Covid is Covid, JV took down the entire year for everyone and will fit in in jail. I love the new look Management and their approach to the media. It’s the first time I have seen it so polished.

Looks like the core is being kept. Pearson and or Garland has to be dealt to move cap and the RHD has to be handled thru the draft or somehow there is money to sign one after Brock is reputed. let’s see if Brock will stick with the club. There is love all around.

I want sure, but that is found money.. awesome.

I don’t know enough about Mason, but he has all the attributes and looks to posses a decent shot, which is a weapon that Hughes could amplify. plus, he has the size. If he is an Upgrade, and can play about 70 plus games, and playoffs, then what’s not to like and or target. Who wouldn’t want an shot to be Hughes Partner. can we lose Poolman and sign Schenn? Then we be a solid team. Hughes Mason, OEL and Myers, Rathbone, Schenn and Burroughs with Woo and others getting some audition’s. draft the best we can to address the RHD and Defence in general as it is such a high valued position. retain the forward core and bring in savvy picks like Podz and Klimovich who have a maturity that isn’t often matched at the same age in Canada. Mason would be a solid addition and the best off the shelf FA target for us that I can see on the D market.

Who, if possible on the FA market can take the second paring match up minutes on the RHD, or first, and won’t break the bank? that and shed cap, try to not give up the future and draft to fill the need. Taking the BPA is relative, to who is left or who falls, taking a mid first on the most promising RHD with the ability to project as a fit for Hughes, and don’t stop until success is achieved. each draft, not every draft pick. If we move up, then take the BPA if one of the two Czech RHD isn’t available if we are end up in the 6-10 range. Our old stomping grounds.

The RHD is a must acquire short of surrendering the future for a stop gap overpriced FA. Brock looked very emotional in the past few games, like he was saying goodbye. I would love to find a taker for Pearson, Poolman and Dickson but without giving up the first, and seeing what we can draft to fit the whole and find a decent RHD on the FA and resign Schenn. unless there is a deal in the works with a Brock for an other player etc…

His cardio, we need him to live a long and happy life

I don’t disagree, but that was part of the Team Winning Percentage in a way, they go hand in hand, like gravity and fat people on skate boards. I am happy the car survived. It was just minding its business under it was hit in the back. Phats, not fats.

That guy looks just like my supervisor lol…

Also, I am dyslexic so can an Admin please the ‘it’ in the Thread or Poll title, the. ‘if ‘ was supposed to be an ‘of’ in advance of the posters that roast me for the error… Award for best ‘Grammar Police’ can be decided at the end by seeing how many point it out and not anything else? Phats..

Rarely start a Topic. Never started a Poll, so if I make an error, just help me correct it… So here is a new idea for an Annual Award, have never seen this particular award given out and I think we should name the award in honour the ‘Gilman’ award, for the ‘Money Ball’ cap and Analytics guy for Mile Gillis, or even better… Or even better, the ‘Gottfried’ in honour and memory of Gilbert Gottfried…. We can take another poll…. Lol? I was going to put Plus/Minus so Fred65 could vote, but I would then have to acknowledge again that he was right about OJ, and I think Video games an no sunshine is a bad way to train effectively in the Off Season, so we kinda agree on something… only kidding Fred65, have a great off season. The annual ‘Apollo Award’ for the most optimistic CDCer who posted here under that name, until he too grew depressed and renounced the CDC or changed his name. I nominate ‘Alf’ More Suggestions for any Annual CDC awards, the ‘Gottfrieds’ or the ‘Gilberts’? as for my vote for the ‘Stat of the Year’ Games Played by the top players for all positions. Myers 82, Miller 80 Pettersson 80!!!!! OEL 79 Podz 79 Garland 76, (with his size, style of play and in our conference on a solid contract and can play a 200 ft game.) Hughes 76. ###Note this happened on the top three D men on the D corp with the most man games lost this year in the NHL### Boeser 71 Horvat 70 The last two, are also great stats. Brock, because he played nearly a full season, and for Horvat, he rarely doesn’t play a full season. Both are really good for the club and the players. Whatever off season and in season training and health regimes that are currently employed by the team are paying off. I think the Sedins are finding a welcome Audience and doesn’t another former team Iron Man own a gym or something? Games played… Pettersson got 80 games in and grew stronger as the season carried on, he looks bigger and that would also coincide with his slow start. He bulked up this last off season. He was staying with the Hughes family and training with Brady and Quinn, eating US food. It worked. But it took some game reps to adjust to the frame, that’s my theory, and it bodes really well for next year, as the last 3/4 of the year were all play games in minds in the Locker Room, according to Luke Schenn, who gets a nod with 66 gp, but 5 goals. He is a welcome player for as long as the club can afford to pay him. Phats.

Ray, OEL is a very good player, and your view of things is just your POV. I will not agree, based in this years play, that OEL was not a fair value deal. As for not Signing Toffoli I 100% agree. Big turd. But trading your goalie when your other goalie isn’t ready yet… So Markstrom passed the torch to Demko. We made the playoffs and to the second round… it took two goalies, or are you mad that we took LV to 7 games two years ago? Tanev, well he is a very good D man when he isn’t your only good D man. Myers and Tanev, that’s a solid right side, Tanev… and … not. So saving money to rent Hamonic was a failure, so was keeping JV instead of Toffoli… but OEL and Garland for a bag of pucks and a first and second… that’s found money.. No major contracts to sign this off season, extensions, yes, but we will clear Holtby and Halak by then, the Florida Assistant GM cap penalty is gone… So what’s the problem, save the first 20 games, which Green and JB should have prepared the fans for the very real un avoidable time that new D pairings take to make effective. 20 games. so with that ‘virgin’ group sorting who goes where and when it takes time to sync up and get into a rhythm. Only Jihadists think that 40 virgins is a blessing… that sounds like way to much trouble for any paradise I can imagine… Experience is a thing that takes time, and experience. So Ray, peace, we can disagree with exactly how bad or good JB was at cleaning up his messes… but watching OEL this year. I never worried about the puck in his stick at anytime. Thats the only D man this year that I can say that for. He steady play is welcome and needed for our group. If you said having to pay 4 goalies potentially for next year while only playing two with Holtby and Halak left overs… then I would agree.

I am not a rocket scientist, but if you send out OEL, what is his replacement going to cost? Also, in what way is OEL or his numbers relative to a 4 million dollar defencemen who is not in a RFA position due for a massive raise? it’s an invalid premise. OEL’s deployment and numbers compare very well to Elders Numbers when he got a 3 year 6 mil contract in his thirties. But OEL has done something Edler never did as a mature player… make it thru the entire season. so at most, OEL is slightly overpriced at the price Vancouver is paying. but his stamina and ability to stay in one piece in this conference with this team, that in itself is a value. Those are credible reasons or grounds to base the value of OEL, based on what we paid Edler a number of years ago, when Elder was older. so at most, OEL is currently, maximum 1.25 mil over budget, but showed longevity this year, and the league and market are always changing. For this season, OEL played, by and large to the value of the contract as compared to and older Edler for the similar types of deployment and held up better. If you can’t argue on those grounds, then supply grounds and argue, not make wild statements without foundation or arguments with supporting examples to be an alternative position one can understand and or debate, or not. Phats.