DrJockitch

It is more that they are small, offensive minded wingers who aren’t great defensively. Not the building of a classic grind line.

I am concerned about the composition of our bottom six but this is not hockey from the 70-90s. Most teams have one of the top 2 lines that can take matchups, one solid defensive line and a third line that can generate some offence (a third line not the third line). There are very few of the 2 offensive lines, 2 defensive lines setups. Good teams almost always now have 3 offensive lines or just 4 all situation lines. It is problematic that 2 of Hogs, Beau, Garland will likely be in our bottom six but not as problematic as in the dead puck era. There are no perfect teams in the cap era. I do think we still need another right shot D and a decent right handed centre away from being a good team. Still feels like we have rebuilt the D twice without finding a partner for Q.

We have about 3 too many forwards and still feels like despite how many rebuilds of our D that we have been through we still haven’t found a regular partner for Quinn. If we can move one or two of the wingers we need to move and/or Myers would be for Dumba as potential partner for Q. Just be fast and violent, don’t worry about offence. Would consider Puis Suter as well as we are likely still short a bottom 6 centre despite our glut of forwards

Remember how often genius is stalked by mental illness and megalomania.

Nice bit of GM’ing. When the deal with 50% retained fell apart they said we will just hold off and ended up saving almost a million cap. Now why they would want this a-hole I don’t know but I guess they need more offence and their forwards are so good defensively they make it work. Not like they didn’t have him before and a Carolina swamp sounds like the perfect spot for that guy.

They lack dynamic offensive weapons and that’s what he is. The rest they can figure out. But getting rid of Pesce and bringing Karlsson in is very questionable.

They should have held a line at $1.1M. Nobody else was signing him.

I hope so. Brock looked like an assassin as a rookie. Great guy that I hope succeeds in what likely is his last 2 year in Vancouver. Always seems like there is something around him, though not his fault. Hopefully his life settles in and it helps his consistency. Last year it was the slow fly by with a little elbow wave instead of engaging. Early in the year he was embarrassingly disengaged. That is on him.

This would start next year after the cap starts to climb. It is less than McDavid took on a % of cap when signed. This is less than was expected to make. This guy has always been about the money and staying and playing as a star in Toronto is likely as good a financial position as you can get in from a sponsorship perspective. If he can somehow win a cup there it will be that at an exponential level. He bets on himself with these short term deals and they are how he maximizes his earnings. I bet the next deal he takes will be a long term one as his value will start to decline so he will try to lock in maximum value for as long as possible at that time.

He has more value than Pettey. He has scored goals at an incredible rate since he started in the league. ‘Pettey is clearly the better 200ft player.

That list seriously undervalues defenceman.

I agree Garland should be moving on but not that Beau is a better player. Nothing supports that. He is a better forechecker, at least as bad defensively, not a better scorer, doesn't generate the 5v5 points that Garland does and doesn't draw the penalties he does. They are similar in that they are small middle six wingers that need a protected role. Frankly would keep Hogz and do everything I could to jettison these 2.

I vote for both

Well, second round pics are a rarity around here and he is one of our few centre prospects, and in our top 5 of prospects. Also we still have a hole at centre ice and he is one of the few who may be able to take it, though likely needs a year or two more of development. He was also rated a top prospect the year before his draft but dropped because of his skating so potentially a lot of untapped talent there. And, well, this is the Atu Raty thread so what are we supposed to discuss how Alf told us how brilliant the OEL Garland trade was?

Raty has good straight ahead speed but lacks quickness and agility in his skating. Horvat was never terrible but did make some big improvements.

Funny reading back on this thread how we got a new Ohlund (come on no similarities in their game) and a first line winger. ‘Alf you were one of the worst here. ‘As bad as OEL was last year it is all the people going on about how good Garland was, a first line winger… Wow, he was bad last year. A guy that is an agitator but just looked disinterested all year. Big contractitis.

This isn’t a problem for athletes to fix. Not fair to put it on them when their home country may banish them and punish their families. Not to mention the nasty habit of Putin detractors dropping dead of poison.

If he is the guy that helped turning around both with amateur and pro scouting then it is big loss. But Benning had the worst pro-scouting that I can remember in a very long time so the baseline was very, very low. Whatever it is that he brought here, hopefully he forgot it when he got to TO. Blow Leafs Blow!

So we are pretty much a development team for players for Calgary and staff for Toronto? I mean they hired Sanford, Nonis, Burke, did the plane run out of gas in Calgary on the way this time so they took Treliving instead of finding the cave Benning is hiding in.

I never called him a cap dump. Said he is a useful player with limits but he is what he is. I think Hoglander is younger, cheaper and will be better. Garland and Brock are both better overall players than Beau and we have a few wingers in the system that can likely bring what he brings. Brock and Garland similarly need some protection but less overall as they are better both offensively and defensively though bring less of a forecheck. Garland scores at 5v5 at good rate and draws a tonne of penalties too. Amongst our middle six wingers, Beau looks to be the most limited and needs the most protected role. Does his forecheck and 20g in a good year make up for his poor defence, not sure.

He showed he can cover on Pettey's line for periods but is too poor defensively to use full time because of how good EP is and his ability to be used against tough matchups. Beau as he is at this point is a decent middle six winger who needs a sheltered role, just like Garland, Brock and Hoglander. Not worthless but something we have better, cheaper and younger versions of in droves.

No, Bo is s solid second tier NHL centre who is a consummate pro.

I have a distinctly mixed opinion of the new management. A lot of good moves and a lot of waisted opportunities. Beau is small defensively poor winger that provides some forecheck, in a good year can score 20-25 but needs a sheltered role. That is not worthless, that is not great but that is something we have in droves in younger or better players.

Try to think like and NHL coach here. Tocchet wants North-South hockey (Read: Dump and chase-sigh). First line is easy. Mik-EP-Kuz. With Mike and EP together this gives forechecking and defensive presence to the line. I think this is the one thing we know in the forwards. Can be your first line, all situation line, can take easy or tough matchup. Beau-JTM-Brock.- This is where it gets tough. We have Beau and we need to use him. He provides lots of North as is decent forechecker and could score 20-22 goals if all goes right, no South to his game at all, defensively questionable. JT is JT. Brock like Beau needs to play and needs to play on an offensive line. Two players showcased with JT and this line is one that will need protection and smart usage. Not putting them out in defensive zone or against elite offensive player. We have those winger, we need to use them and we really will need scoring next year. Joshua-Bluger-Podz-Every coach loves a momentum killing line. This line will suck the energy out of every building including ours. They can be used in tough matchups and won't be expected to provide any offence though Podz could. I see Podz sliding into Kuzmenko's role in close games with a lead. Pearson-Raty-Hogz/Aman/Garland- We need a 4th line and it needs a centre. Only 2 options Raty and Aman. Pearson will give some veteran presence and can slide up to JTM when Beau is struggling. Can't have both of Hoglander and Garland playing in bottom 6 at same time, especially if you want an eraser line like Blugers.

Thing about that is we have Beau and we have to play him. Mik-EP-Kuz is pretty much first line. Beau is a middle six winger but you can’t play him on a shutdown line. So that leaves you second line left wing with JTM and Boeser or Garland. This is a line you would NOT be giving tough matchups or D zone faceoffs but could provide some decent offence. That leaves you with a shutdown line built around Blueger and a 4th line with either Aman or Raty. No idea how to fit 2 5’8” wingers onto a bottom six with a shutdown line but since EP and Mik combined let you use them in tough matchups you have a bit more flexibility with favourable matchups for the 4th and 2nd.