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Everything posted by IBatch
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We do not need to tear it down OR make big trades
IBatch replied to MtnHockeyGuy's topic in Canucks Talk
Bouchard will likely pass the medium bar for 10th overalls within two years ... 7th in 3. People think that all these guys work out, or should work out which is far from the truth. JV would have passed the average games played bar half way through this season, and that's with a couple years of covid. Bouchard was a RHD available and projected to be right around where we picked. We could have done worse. And we have. Sophomore year 42 points almost all even strength, double digits in goals and decent advanced stats. 6'2" and not pint sized. Maybe i just like the name too - remember Bouchard in MTL, and my best man's last name was the same. But for sure he dropped. EDM didn't think they had a chance of getting him at 10 and didn't have a jersey ready for him. Won't know for a long time yet. But he's not looking like the "bust" some made him out to be just because Dobson and Hughes already were in the NHL either. From a positional standpoint he was a smart pick. Also likely had the highest floor - so did OJ and we all know how that worked out. Aside from Housley and Rafalski i've never seen a guy like Hughes size on D and he's even smaller. But i sure remember Housley. What a player he was. -
We do not need to tear it down OR make big trades
IBatch replied to MtnHockeyGuy's topic in Canucks Talk
Totally. What a bum. Edit: Fastest backwards skater in the draft ... not slow. But agree that QHs was the right guy (and i was 100% against Boqvist, found QHs a little more interesting but growing up when guys like Jovo were undersized just couldn't see it working out. It for sure did. That said i wouldn't be surprised if Bouchard has a pretty good career. We might be able to thank Keith for that. Darn it. Edit: When Suter/Weber came into the league just before Doughty and EK...To me he could be the Bowmeester of the bunch. Not as bad as Bogasian turned out (Doughty/vs Bogasian - was a thing just like Bouchard vs Dobson was) - but actually a pretty decent top four two-way D. He's scored some big goals for them so far during the season and during the playoffs. And doesn't get the PP time (yet). Once he does, he might end up like Carlson did in WSH, but not as a 28 year old, a 24-25 year old. Not sure it's time to pass the crow plate around quite yet ... Edit 2: Holland couldn't do it 4 cores in a row in Det. But he's sure managed some things in EDM that shows he's not done yet. COL/EDM could be the most exciting series of the playoffs. COL of course should win. But adding Hyman, Keith and E Kane ... i'm not too sure i'd bet on that series. Plus Smith has a penchant for amping it up - did it once in PHX with a really mediocre at best lineup. If he can channel his inner Bower or Broduer or Sawchuk ... COL might be trading for JT in the off-season lol. -
We do not need to tear it down OR make big trades
IBatch replied to MtnHockeyGuy's topic in Canucks Talk
Maybe we should try trading him for Bouchard? Ha ha ha. -
We do not need to tear it down OR make big trades
IBatch replied to MtnHockeyGuy's topic in Canucks Talk
Maybe we should try trading him for Bouchard? Ha ha ha. -
We do not need to tear it down OR make big trades
IBatch replied to MtnHockeyGuy's topic in Canucks Talk
The last paragraph...I really liked that he didn't blow anything thing up "just to make a move" down the stretch. They ended up playing like a top team and almost slipped in. Considering where our special teams were at the start and how they were the last 25-30 games...wow what a turnaround. There wasn't really player on the roster that didn't play better then their norm on this team the last couple years, or for newer faces this season. IF they come into the season playing THAT way, like the OP brings up, they wont need to make many moves next season. But think they will inevitably lose one of Miller/Horvat/Brock, and won't lose sight of that. But they don't need to do that this year. -
I wanted McTavish or Clarke. Pretty bad actually. When the trade was made i based it on those two guys. McTavish was ranked around where we picked, even a couple spots below us so felt he was a very good target and we had decent odds of getting him. Then like usual, the draft happened and didn't follow the script. No way were we going to trade up to was it 4? To get him. And when Clarke was still around at 7 i was like holy f!ck what did JB just do! Then wad gone at 8. Also based on recent trades - the cost to dump that much cap was a bit of a steal. We lost our Guenther. Won't really know what that means for a couple years yet. We gained a top six forward in his prime at a decent to good cap hit (every way you slice it, Garland played above his cap hit for RWs, and without any first unit PP time). OEL was an Edler replacement. Love Eagle, but OEL will be playing after he retires, and isn't slow. OEL/Myers proved to be a 10-12th overall top four pairing as far as net gain goes. Won't delve into special teams - but as far as even strength goes, that makes them above average. Where we get screwed of course is how much that pairing costs. 13 plus, should put them into the top 5-6 league wide. We lose on that front for sure. If anyone made a trade proposal, exactly like what JB did they would have been shredded to bits. Dumping that much cap, for a 9th overall, and gaining a top four D and a top six player? Astonishing really. How many LE threads did we make lol...Marleau before covid cost what again? And he was 6.5 i think (one year). To me that was actually one of JB best trades on paper without any subjective thinking about our cycle, pool etc, We dumped the cap space that we brought back. And 100% agree that Miller (was it a 20th overall?) and Garland are better players then most picks in that range...Miller by a country mile. Also think it was probably a mistake. Both deals. This team never bottomed out. At some point you need to go for it. JB was one year off on all his assumptions. I was in favour of trading Pearson and just waiting for the cap to go away. Doesn't mean i was right either - maybe that meant they all walked and we start again (couple more losing seasons ... who knows?). Hindsight is impossible to predict accurately. One thing we do have now that JB never had - is assets. Ones we can trade. I think Allvin needs to give this group another year before making any drastic moves. But if he does - then i sure hope he's willing to go all the way. The odds of hitting on all your picks are not in your favour. As in all your first rounders even. OJ was his biggest mistake, close second LE and spending to the cap.
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Reality is OEL would have got the same money as a free agent likely ... maybe 7 x 5 but not much less. Plays in the top four ... last year the contract wasn't that terrible, just another overpaid UFA vet that earned his contract. Was he really much worse then Sprurgeon? Maybe a little. His extra one million or so off-sets what QHs did. I doubt you could find a logical fan on this site or the hockey world, that didn't notice the difference having OEL Myers ahead of him taking those minutes instead of Edler Schmidt and what it did for his game. Heck he's even killing some penalties. Janis is correct it adding Miller and Garland into the conversation. Whatever happens to them going forward also will matter. If we trade Miller (decent chance), whatever we get back has a good chance on beating what out a mid round first. A roster player, grade A prospect (think Giroux and Tippet) plus a late first. Eventually Allvin will balance the books - and part of that is because we don't have many clauses that impact the team (yet).
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[Article] Scott Walker on Heavy Analytics Approach
IBatch replied to Bissurnette's topic in Canucks Talk
Not the only team that went heavy on this area and has kind of flopped. Chakya for sure make a mockery of the analytics community. Dubas, well most of his work was done by Lou. -
[Rumour] J.T. Miller Trade/Contract Talks
IBatch replied to Podzilla's topic in Trades, Rumours, Signings
You bet ... but pretty sure Rod the Bod was CAR Captain, and Staal scored his 100 point season right after spending the lockout in the AHL...second season. He's one of a very few stars to win a cup during their ELCs as well (Toews last season won as well...Crosby and Co won on their second deals, same as LA)...And no way did the Sedins deserve to earn more the Datsyuk at the time. Just a couple seasons into PPG territory. -
Yes and their D was tiny compared to the early 90's. Bert lol. Sure he was big but he wasn't scary. May was a below average fighter of his era. Jovo ... well like i said - the last really tough teams we had - were during the Keenan era.
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Acceptance is easier. Took me forever to accept that the league's direction. No power forwards anymore. No enforcers. Almost no toughness like anyone after maybe 1985 grew up with. Leagues just tame now. This team we have now? 2011 team would have rolled right over it in the alley as well. Which says a lot.
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Lol...not true. It was intense. MIN series was intense as was St. Louis. Vegas was cringe worthy. But still exciting.
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Millers Value (Discussion/Proposals)
IBatch replied to J.I.A.H.N's topic in Proposals and Armchair GM'ing
Support players both of them. Yes they are examples of teams trading within a division ... when's the last time a guy like Miller was traded though? Check out our all time trade record with CAL and EDM. LA was tanking on purpose - TT was a rental and he knew that - cash strapped team like ours couldn't afford him. Schmidt - well.... not exactly a move that moved the needle much was it? Aside from Kesler - we'd have to really really dig deep to find a divisional team wouldn't we? It's not just a good point it's the way things a done. Almost all our bigger trades all-time, have been outside our own division. Since the cap and the fact cycles take that much longer (expansion motivated), we are seeing some trades within own divisions - as rentals mostly - which wouldn't Miller be anyways to LA? Don't see LA as a trading partner. NJ yes. OTT maybe. Likely a US team that thinks they can sign him after - CALI teams are pretty much out of the picture. If he wants to go for cash Seattle is a possibility. No tax state. Tons of cash ... who would we want there? Doubt it though. Seems to like to win. CAL/EDM are also an interesting case study. Check out their trade history lol. Almost non-existent. Isn't Steve freaking Stois pretty much our "high water mark" trade with EDM? What is it with CAL? Edit: Most posters should be worried about signing Miller. I haven't seen an actual poll though. I think that mostly we are worried we end up wasting him. To me anyways, he hasn't been wasted. Helped our team get to the bubble and a taste, and had one of the best individual seasons ever pushing to make the show. I'd be 100% ok making the playoff next season with Miller - and watching him go somewhere else. It happens all the time. It's better then him becoming an anchor isn't it? It's also better then making a trade that doesn't work out at all pre-maturely as well. Which also happens. Best case of course a miraculous trade we make the show anyways and just get better and better. Not many Linden trades ... those are uber rare. Go check out how MTL made out with Roy for example .. not great lol. -
[Rumour] J.T. Miller Trade/Contract Talks
IBatch replied to Podzilla's topic in Trades, Rumours, Signings
Hall is a bit of an enigma. But Giroux is not. Came into the league around the same time as Crosby and is close to a fringe HHOF caliber player - not the same pedigree as Miller. He's being doing it since he came into the league. And is still doing it. Miller had 3 Giroux like seasons. He's had 14. Yes Miller is a late bloomer and had a great year... this is the type of deal Miller should get if we trade him too i agree...maybe one more season like Millers been having would get us that, but Florida didn't want Miller (ok if they did we don't know do we - or that Allvin felt it was enough either, my impression is that the deals just didn't move the needle though, especially given we can use him next season and still get a nice return and or try and sign him). PHI was out ... that's a big difference too. Just hope they are true to their word, as in that they won't let free agents walk for nothing. We either sign him or yes this is something like what we can expect back - but likely with a roster player to help with cap. As for Forsberg - i'm always wary about guys having a career year their UFA year. -
Millers Value (Discussion/Proposals)
IBatch replied to J.I.A.H.N's topic in Proposals and Armchair GM'ing
He's worth a first, a roster player and a nice prospect. Chariot is on a good cap hit and a big RHD. Worth a first. So yes Miller is worth more then him. But don't expect the moon either. -
Millers Value (Discussion/Proposals)
IBatch replied to J.I.A.H.N's topic in Proposals and Armchair GM'ing
To me this will be the major factor in his destination: It usually is. He's lost 3.5 and counting on his contract take home since coming to Vancouver. I have zero illusions that he's both happy to come here (as a result - not making bank behind Stamkos and Point) or that when it comes time, that we will have to shell out massively to keep him, or another team. -
[Discussion] KADRI KANE TYPE OF PLAYERS...
IBatch replied to hockeygod77's topic in Proposals and Armchair GM'ing
Send your complaints to Bettman. Going from a 21 team league (used to be most teams made the show) - to what it's like now. The 80's we had EDM and CAL to contend with ... even LA ... not an easy out. The 90's we were very good...almost a second round guaranteed with Linden on the team anyways. Expansion ruined that for every team that cycles out more or less. The less of course is low tax teams and cities where UFAs all love to take a peak at (that's you NYR, been like that since the 70's). We were always going to go through a lot of pain. 14 years only SJ and DET won as many games as us from 2000. People need to open their eyeballs and look around the league. Maybe check in with CAR. -
Millers Value (Discussion/Proposals)
IBatch replied to J.I.A.H.N's topic in Proposals and Armchair GM'ing
It sounds good but would we actually trade Miller to someone in our own division? And Blake has done the right moves to create a future in LA in their pipeline - how much would he be willing to actually give up? Aside from Kesler (two trade team list - grouchy entitlement trade), when have we ever made a big trade with anyone in our own division? We are almost in direct competition with them as is. ANA soon too. Big player trades start in other conferences, and end in other divisions in your own conference. Hard to find many that don't anywhere. Just a small percentage, they are more common then they used to be - rivalries are almost dead (how many times have EDM/CAL made trades before the lockout and since?...even minor ones)....how many trades have we made with EDM or CAL? Cylces matter to a big degree as well. Maybe a good team would trade with a bottom feeder in their own division ... LA and VAN are just too close to go there at least that's how i see it. We are ahead in our cycle ... but not much ahead. -
Millers Value (Discussion/Proposals)
IBatch replied to J.I.A.H.N's topic in Proposals and Armchair GM'ing
TO's media was their two best prospects (former 15th overall, 2 rounder - both decent forward projects), their first this year and Kerfoot coming back. That's pretty much what we could expect from any cash strapped team this off season or next TDL barring a huge decline or injury. Most likely we will be getting a roster player, a first and a grade A prospect or a couple B's - Bplusses back... -
Millers Value (Discussion/Proposals)
IBatch replied to J.I.A.H.N's topic in Proposals and Armchair GM'ing
I'm not so sure OTT isn't a great fit. They've got tons of tweener assets - won't keep them all and still have a decent/good pool. Dorian and Melnyk said they would be spending to the cap and adding free agents soon... since last summer. The only thing that would nix a big deal with Miller is he doesn't want to be there so that part is understandable - but it could be a big pay day for him. It's hockey and you just never know. Most big UFAas stay with their clubs and don't go to market. -
2022 James Norris Memorial Trophy finalists unveiled
IBatch replied to -Vintage Canuck-'s topic in General Hockey Discussion
Josi just had a season for the ages. Crazy to think about how many very good, to outstanding D's Nashville's produced, even after Suter and Weber left. They've been spoiled that way. But it always came at a cost somewhere else - the fact he managed 96 points not playing for COL or TB is something that can't be overlooked. On any other given year the last decade - both Hedman and Makar would easily win. Reminds me of the quality of D's the league had for 3 decades before the early-mid 2000's. Potvin/Orr/Robinson/Park. Borque/Coffey/Langway/Housley/Chelios/Leetch/Al Mac/Pronger/Lidstrom/Blake /Zubov/Neidermayer etc etc .. it's really nice to see things go full circle again. When was the last time a D broke 90 points? Makar looks poised to be one of just a few all-time, to break 100.. It appears the league skill level is finally catching up to expansion. Of course no redline speeds it up, but even that wasn't enough for 15 or so years.... What an exciting time to be a fan. -
[Discussion] KADRI KANE TYPE OF PLAYERS...
IBatch replied to hockeygod77's topic in Proposals and Armchair GM'ing
I'd say i'd rather win a cup. A ton of other teams and fans (and media types - hi Ron McLean) sure didn't like Burrows or Kesler ... and Cooke/Ruutu got their reps playing with us first and went on to become major douche bags on other teams - same with Torres (not the reps - he was a head hunter before he came here). It's definitely the "eye of the beholder". Kadri is fine. Have him on our team any day. Kane ... that's a tough one. IF we were ready to contend right now he wouldn't be a bad add i'm warming up to the idea this kids hockey is definitely on spot. I do worry about the locker room with Kane. And what he might do with a longer term deal (go back to being a terrible off ice person). It does take all types. Marroon is on his 14th consecutive playoff series - guys like him are rare these days, Reaves is a nuclear deterrent too. I'm sure IF the Oilers win with Kane, their won't be any misgivings from the fans or the players - same with COL and Kadri. -
[Rumour] Devils open to trading 2022 1st-round pick
IBatch replied to -Vintage Canuck-'s topic in Trades, Rumours, Signings
JB never allowed the team to bottom out and spent to the cap ... didn't have much choice to start - i was stoked when we finally traded Bieksa, Hansen and Burrows - and got that aside from Hansen the others had to agree to it. That was 2017 i think .... and that's exactly when we should have let the team tank and made an internal cap despite LE. Mistakes were made for sure - now Allvin and JR have to make a really tough decision .... i think what they will do is give Bruce next season to see what's up still. IF they can make the playoffs and win a round or two then he's got his answer. If they don't he's also got his answer. I'm also tired of half measures. There really isn't one player on this team, including Demko - that isn't an asset to be considered for a trade after next season. Miller to NJ for a second overall and even our 15th overall in the package is a no brainer. If that doesn't happen then unless something too nice to not do comes up - stay the JB course next season and adjust accordingly. I'd be 100% fine with a mini tank for a couple seasons. CAL, EDM and Vegas are in their windows now. As far as LA goes Blake is one smart cookie. He decided to give the cup winning core core guys one more crack at it and traded all their support guys to tank. Pearson, Toffoli, Muzzin was the medicine they needed. They weren't going to win with what they had. Funny how Wilson went the other way, and kept up the endless re-tool. Zero prospects - some cap space to keep working on his endless re-tool. But the end is near. Erik Karlsson lol. Whoops. Evander Kane (not really on him but the signs were there - whoops again). They need to dismantle and rebuild but he just keeps re-upping guys. Meanwhile both ANA and LA are doing it right... Ottawa is too. Of course NYR. Nice to have assets to trade - and trust your fanbase that they'd be ok with some down years. Allvin ... what a minefield he's left with. Not nearly as bad as what JB came into - nobody is claused up (yet). Needs to trade some guys. -
[Rumour] Devils open to trading 2022 1st-round pick
IBatch replied to -Vintage Canuck-'s topic in Trades, Rumours, Signings
Yes couldn't say no to that. First off Miller isn't even in our own conference, that's a huge bonus. And for NJ it makes a lot of sense with a new deal in place. They'd be sorted down the middle and left wing for 4-5 years. They don't need Chychrun, they've already got Luke Hughes. Would make them a much better team now. The other trade partner that makes a lot of sense is Ottawa. They also have a ton of very good young support players that could or could not become core guys. At the very least support players, to me that's where i'd put Brock and Garland right now. On the fringes of being core but not untouchable like Demko, QHs and EP. If NJ offered us their pick - one for one - take it and run run run far far away. I'd almost consider giving us our 15th overall to get this done. Edit: Ideally we trade Miller to NJ, and maybe add Hoglander or something if we can. Can't see why NJ would say no to Miller and our 15th overall.