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IBatch

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Everything posted by IBatch

  1. Did you mean you do think rookies should earn their ice time? Of course they should. Otherwise what sort of culture does that instill? Nothing at all wrong with internal competition- it brings the best out of players. Bob Gainey is famously said that once he got in he was constantly afraid of a younger more skilled/talented player coming in and taking his spot - from his first to last game he played like his career depended on it every game - and it inspired a trophy that probably should be named after him (since that’s a common thing these days). Just like Art Ross could be named after Gretzky same with the Hart trophy ha ha. And the Norris after Orr. Actually not a fan of renaming them but this is one I could get behind - playing against Gainey was like “ a bad night in jail”. Rookies need to be inspired by their coach and their veteran teammates never to get complacent. JV is a good example of this - gets in right away and entitlement seeped in and it stopped his development. Yes we have a fair amount of veteran with 1-3 years left in their contracts. But It’s silly to pencil in Hoglander or Podz at this point - Lind is closer then they are and rarely do you see his name pop up. It’s rare that a 18 or 19 year old step in and earn a top six role. Horvat is our Captain, and he made it because he was physically able, good at face offs - and most importantly we had nobody better for the spot. He played his way into a top six role and the C. Same should be said with everyone else who joins the team, and he’s a great example of doing it the right way. JV and McAan are the opposite.
  2. Ovechkin McDavid Kucherov Drasaitl Crosby Pastrnak Marchand McKinnon Stone Miller Mathews Brock Boeser Approx 85is million exrtra : EP Hedman Carlson Burns Pietrangelo Makar Weber Approx : 40 million 7th Q Hughes. Goalies: Rask. Vasilevsky. Markstrom Approx: 20 million Total 145 million approx cap penalty 40% of this 23 man roster ha ha. Ha ha. So out these guys we actually have three deserving players by position based on points and ability/play...and a couple honourable mentions. Guess we’d suffer some pretty big cap penalties as in probably only half the players could play any given night...
  3. There fixed it for you ha ha. Also no hard feelings - parting shot. Thanks AJ, and the rest of you folks this was fun...is Covid over yet because I was hoping it would be by the time this was done ha ha.. NHL.coms doing a who wore it best countdown which ok I guess...99-60 is done at the moment ... but it’s not fun like this was.
  4. Well said Apollo - Brock was certainly raised right. Class act and mature beyond this years. I’m rooting for him to come out when this is over and earn every penny of his contract and think he will.
  5. I pulled my vote - not because I hate Cooke because I do not - but because I believe BB is more deserving simple as that. I also did it earlier to help a few players get in before others whom I felt were more deserving. The problem lies in the simple fact that I was motivated to do that in first place. If he wasn’t a voting option then this would have never happened. I would be happy to vote for Cooke in the 60-70’s where I feel he should be, given his 187ish PGP thats about right but only because of games played. But won’t have to because by default he will be the 51st greatest Canuck. If we were simply going by games played then where is Sandlak and where is Murzyn? Everyone loves Tanev because he’s recent - very little love at all for Murzyn who drops the gloves and kept Lumme roaming for longer then any other league wide pairing in the 90’s. He was the epitome of selflessness - and often wore the A too. So yeah I’m bitter about that - but I’m not taking it out on Cooke - also have Gelinas, Momesso, Aucoin, Pederson, Larionov etc etc ranked ahead of him including BB. EPs in at 45...so why not BB too?
  6. Every team has vets like Roussel, Ferland, Sutter, Bear, Beagle, LE etc - only a couple teams will be willing to trade for them as cap dumps ... and it the owners are taking these hits - which absolutely they are - why would they want to lose more money by buying them out and then replacing them? I’m pretty sure Covid-19 will have a huge impact on the cap and things going forward- but not so sure we will be shedding payroll and improving our team like quite a few seem to think will happen. Roll-backs are more likely ...
  7. Rousell, Ferland (bad luck, Sutter (bad luck again - never had injury issues before) Myers - well guess what happens when you add a top four guy - Edler and Tanev don’t miss as many games - aren’t dead duck contracts. People seem to think we can add Lind, Rathbone, Rafferty and OJ to the lineup and things will be better. Guess what - they have to beat the vets to gain a spot and so far that hasn’t happened. Without veteran support the players would be in trouble. Sure some of these are bad (Bear and LE) and some of them are and luck...but it is what it is. And the funny thing is we’d just recycle these into overpaid UFAs and roll the dice again. We have to have prospects that are NHL ready. We don’t have many - have a couple worth looks maybe but that’s about it.
  8. Good point. Make this the top 60 greatest Canucks and see were things go from there - you might not be too happy with where the BB votes go but based on the rules a tie means Cooke automatically goes 51.
  9. 9 years for Murzyn and I’ve wasted lots of breath on him. Tanev is 40...Murzyn did everything he did and more. What’s a more valuable position? - third line grinder with average numbers, definitely not great for a third liner (AG, LE, Roussel and Sutter all have higher PGP) or top pairing defensive defenseman? Would be like saying any of these guys is more valuable then Tanev. Lumme could pinch and do his thing because he knew Murzyn had him covered...same thing Tanev does now. Plus he wasn’t injury prone. Missed half a season from the lock-out otherwise would have more games played (I’m sure Cooke lost a year though). Murzyn is Tanevs best comparable - except Murzyn fought enforcers and tough characters like KT, Berube, Odgers, Kruse etc. A couple times a month not twice a year like Gudbranson and way harder quality of competition. So I don’t feel bad about Cooke. CDC completely slept on Murzyn - that I’m a little ashamed of. Edit: Brock will undeniably end up the greatest US forward to ever play for us. Which says a lot given Fraser was pretty darn great himself. And I’m sure others I’m not thinking about.
  10. That’s ok. For those that support Cooke THN did too...had him at 45 three years ago...even if BB and EP make the cut now he’d be safe in their eyes...stated “good grinder - dirty villain in later years” ha ha. They had Aucoin, Murzyn, Odjick and Mitchell in the late 40’s...Odjick huh? Overall I like our list better - some of the order is out of whack but for the most part the right guys got in. Edit: Not re-signing Mitchell (a perennial Pratt award winner while here) and instead trading a roster player plus a first for Ballard (who we later had to buyout - steep price for a 7th defenseman) was Gillis’ worst mistake. I bet it cost us a cup. He was so good with us - then later so good for LA (plus he played against us - like a slap really).
  11. Boeser has had one of the best starts of any of our draft picks - and yet is part of many trade proposals because fans seem to want more. Funny really. I’m sure his first season wasn’t his best - happens so rarely that it’s almost not a thing. He’s improved his passing - and seems a little snake bitten but still was 4th in scoring for R wingers when he went down. On pace for 40 plus his rookie season - almost positive we will see more of that at some point- maybe even next season. Tallon was pretty darn good too but was forever linked to going number two... EP got in and deservedly so - but that makes Reinhart a contender as well for two seasons - both great ones for a Canuck. Think Murzyn is more deserving then anyone left but BB isn’t a bad choice ... at this point the selections get razor thin as Biestra stated he had around 65 guys that could make the top 50 - and you have to make cuts somewhere. Hlinka was good too. I’m sure if BB plays with us two more years he will be in the top 50 for quite some time - 4/5 more years and 15-30 is possible.
  12. Rafferty looks to be Stechers replacement at some point ... he’s paying his dues. Not sure how Hoglander and his 16 points in 41 games compares to EPs draft plus one year where he was the leagues regular season and playoff MVP? We knew ahead of time we were getting something special after he ripped it up his first year after the draft. It would be a complete shock to the hockey world if he came in, won a spot out of camp, and then worked his way up the lineup to get the plumb assignment playing with EP and Calder votes. Doubt he’s supplanting Miller, and unless Pearson falls off a cliff doubt he’s playing with Horvat either. Think a reasonable expectation is he has a shot as a middle six forward, and at best might see games as an injury replacement next season. Dahlen showed a lot of promise too at one point and look what happened there.
  13. First off the KHL is still considered the second best league in the world, then the SHL then the AHL. Second of all OJ is learning but still not the best defenseman in on that team, probably third best. Not to mention when Tryamkin was here he was just fine on the bottom pairing and it’s not like the competition on the bottom right side or left side is that tough now. I’m sure OJ will get some chances - he is in Utica with PP time and given where he went in the draft. But I’m not so sure he will earn a spot next year either - see him more of an injury call-up at this point then anything.
  14. All good points. I used to really enjoy the all-star games - even though we didn’t send many players to them in the 80’s it was still a great way to see how the leagues greatest stacked up against each other West vs East....when they changed the format to NA vs the World is when it started going south ... now it’s pretty ridiculous really - both the format and the participation awards given out so every team is represented. It was great that Scott got in with a fan vote that backfired twice - once when some media and NHL representatives were obviously not happy about it and said as much - and twice when he went out scored a couple of goals and was carried around like he just scored a game 7 final OT goal which was great really, and awarded the MVP. At least they also changed the fastest skater competition by adding pilons which is ok - but let the players start and then started the clock after one stride...although I think they may have fixed that. The skills competition is ok but the games are nothing like they used to be that’s for sure. Anyways this top fifty has been a lot of fun - thanks for posting your thoughts enjoyed them a lot.
  15. This list at times got pretty strange and I changed my vote to the front runner of the best best option a half dozen times. I’m not ashamed of it one bit and glad the poll is public too- I have a greater appreciation for who I might be talking to now. Appolo wouldn’t be voting Cooke if he was older - same with I’m pretty sure most guys that are voting him which is ok. I’m sure they will get frustrated in 20 years or so when someone looks at the stats and says what about Bear? He’s around .5 PPG and played a couple years ha ha. It will happen but sure that’s exaggeration. I didn’t mind Cooke but definitely didn’t think he was playing the game quite right in not backing up his edge play rather letting others fight for him - which isn’t a good trait for a bottom six guy. As far as games played goes well two seasons more of a third liner doesn’t hold water when compared to a top pairing guy in Murzyn. Or everyone else who played around 400 games either. Long enough. Glad Fraser got in at least. Don’t think three years is enough either but would give the edge to BB. He’s a better player - all-star and deservingly so (would have been invited even under the old rules at the time ) Calder runner-up and a huge part of our next core - he’s just getting started. I get people have their favourites - I do too - would take Momesso before Cooke too and he was here for a only half a decade. Anyways - it is what it is and if Cooke gets in I won’t lose my mind ha ha. I’m sure it will be the last time it happens which was also why I was campaigning for the past ten threads to get Murzyn in for a nomination which was hard enough.
  16. That’s cool...I might join you. I’ve tried my best without outright slamming the guy (by stating Sutter, LE, AG, Bear and Goldobin all have better PGP - some by quite a margin and they are both in the AHL and nobody wants them)...funny how Cooke is getting romantically thought of given the votes..his three 10-14 goal seasons - where Murzyn did the same job as Tanev plus fought for almost a decade and won’t get in the top 50. Sure he had some big goals - lucky guy - so did a lot of other Canucks over the years too. Murzyn is 31st in GP and tied for 4th in all-time plus minus and played during the Keenan era too Edit: I just blocked Cooke and voted BB. Murzyn guys join my and 189lbs i
  17. That’s a pretty awesome line-up. Sure Quebec and Ontario could make five teams each that would compare but still that teams got a ton of heart in it (and eventually probably 7 or 8 HHOFers on it too).
  18. Great list - very impressive. Think Robert Dirk was from Kelowna but not 100% sure he was born there... Born in the Kootenays I always heard about the local players from my Grandma and my uncles (one of who was a pretty good hockey player himself). Also have a friend who grew up in BC and played against Neely and Wendel Clark (and called them wimps which is good for a laugh) - fringe player himself had his growth spurt after the NHL draft and missed his chance as result 5-10” all the way to 6’2” 230lbs by 20 ... played in the WHL and Tri-City)...eventually gave up in his mid 20’s but it was fun to watch hockey with him and have him comment against the players he played against - and he’s one of thousands that were very good hockey players - just not good enough to make it and always new it was hard on him - set him back 7-8 years. Tambellini, Travis Green, Ray Ferraro and Adams were the talk of the town during their playing days when I lived in Castlegar for high school...small towns take a lot of pride when someone makes the NHL which is pretty cool.
  19. Horvat could be one to do it / clutch. Miller plays that way now - if he steps it up then man will we be lucky. JV..who knows. EP and QHs have lots of time and hopefully will get lots of tries - both seem competitive enough that’s for sure.
  20. Post Naslund Sedin team means after Naslund.. Luongo virtually shut the door his first crack at it vs an equally impressive Turco and what a breath of fresh air. No arguments that the WCEs weak link was goaltending for sure - even if the Sedins peaked a few years earlier I’m not sure it would have been enough. The point is Linden always stepped it up another notch come playoff time - same with Ronning, Babych, Courtnall and Adams for that matter but especially Linden. Most players take a dip in stats in the post season so not knocking anyone - it’s a rare player that consistently bumps his play in the second season though - and I’m hoping we have some more of those guys coming up now and look forward to finding out.
  21. You bet. I hope the new team we have emerging can imitate that in some respect. Lindens teams almost always got us at least one round - and the ones we didn’t were still well fought series. It’s kind of shocking that with all that firepower the post Naslund Sedin teams only got past the first round once or twice . I’d take mediocre to very good regular seasons and epic playoff performances over presidents trophies any day. It’s also why Linden will be the greatest Canuck ever until the day we finally win a cup.
  22. Mostly for the owners. Players get paid their salary until the end of June regardless where they play or not - a relatively small amount is set aside for teams that make the playoffs which amounts to about 13k if you lose in the first round - to 200k if you win the cup. For most players that is peanuts. I’m sure they understand the implications of a long lay-off....and that winning a cup is something they all want to do...but doubt they are thinking much about the relatively small pool of money put aside for them.
  23. Pretty incredible really..Initially the trade had two main pieces in McCabe (the main players) and Bertuzzi... and the third rounder became Ruutu who went on to have a decent 630ish game career himself. BM (who went on to play over 1100 games himself and garner Norris consideration on the way) became a first overall who Burke traded down for D Sedin in the second best draft table move in our clubs history. Of course Bertuzzi became Luongo...The best part of this is we got Linden back a few years later and he scored 65 points in 64 games for us... It sucked so bad watching what happened to that team when Keenan took over. Those loyal to Linden were sent packing so there is also that - we lost fan favourites Gelinas, McLean, Babych, and Gino. Its impossible not to admire what Linden accomplished as a player for us and how trading him at 27 - after a decade of heart and soul service how much more that ended up giving back to the organization. It’s also why myself and so many others were hoping the Sedins would get moved in their early 30’s to help boost the next core. Turns out that trade from Feb 1998 (the same year I got hitched) - is still going strong in Markstrom. Sure there must be other deals that have also kept on giving too...but arguably two HHOFers plus extras is one heck of a return. And at the time it certainly didn’t feel like enough.
  24. Linden also ended up getting us one of the Sedins. The trade that gave us a big part of the WCE team - and a massive part of the Sedin team in Sedin plus Luongo..and now it’s looking like we could have one of the best goalies in franchise history in JM. Incredible really. Wonder how it compares to Gretzky getting traded to LA. EDM should have become a powerhouse in the mid-nineties but never did. Guess they did get Doug Weight...but whoopy-do really ha ha.
  25. Shame. There is a fair amount of shame on this voting considering it’s the last time we can do this and who’s the front runner. Guys and Gals Pearson is way far ahead of Cooked PGP, so is Sutter, so is LE, so is AG, so is Bear and Rousell and Goldobin, so is everyone else that we can vote for who is a forward...if LE finishes his contract and doesn’t miss games does that mean in five years in a re-do he makes the list? Come on. High water mark of 14 goals and only three years of double digits and one was 10 goals. A lot of other players have game tying and game winning goals. A lot more in a heck of a lot less games played. Shame. What about Aucoin? He’s not even on the list yet. What about Reinhart? If LE finishes his contract and is an iron man because you know he doesn’t hit - does that also make him a top 50 all-time Canuck? Ha ha ... we all know he’s a better PKer and that when the chips are down and the net is empty something great could happen. Cooke really shouldn’t even be available to vote on - yet he’s beating Murzyn who quite easily is a greater Canuck then Tanev who went in at 40. Glad it’s almost done because if this went on much further bit would go see sideways. Mitchell ... where’s his due? Was our best defenseman pretty much every year he was here..and Murzyn wasn’t much different just had stiffer competition. Shame.
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