-
Posts
21,784 -
Joined
-
Last visited
-
Days Won
6
Content Type
Profiles
Forums
Events
Blogs
Gallery
Everything posted by IBatch
-
Gretzkys big fight his opponent told him to hang on and not to worry he wouldnt hurt him. Then the refs separate them and four guys are bee lining with violence in mind with half the bench one foot over the boards. Gretzky stopped them from murder. At least that's how he describes it more or less. Semenko and McSorely (what great goon names!) Had his back but so did twenty other players. The Detroit-Colorodo rivalry was outstanding, same with Calgary -Edmonton, and before that Boston-Montreal and Philly-League. It seems all the greatest teams all stand up for each other no matter what. Detroit-Colorado spanned 1996-2002 and in that span they met in the Conference final five out of seven years and combined for five cups. Over twenty players went on to the Hall of Fame and either the Wings of the Avalanche made it to the Conference final each year. The goons fought, the skilled players fought, the goalies fought, the fans fought and each game was an ultimate treat to watch. Detroit may have won more cups but Colorado had a slight edge overall.... According to THN the players speak in reverant terms about the rivalry, calling it the best hockey they've ever part of. Reference: Hockey's Greatest Rivalries Vol.68 No.SIP
-
Re considered your point. I was secretly hoping we wouldn't play Boston because I was worried about how we would handle their size and defense/goaltending. We all know the result and the feeling of dread we had after being up 3-2 and then Luongo and the team blowing game six. Gillis did the right thing IMO by not adding an enforcer considering the odds of playing Boston at the final were not that high and nobody else in the East that were contenders has that big of a size advantage, certainly not by a large margin. We did have some guys like Rome, Lappareier, Bieksa, Bug Eyes and even Kesler that could play a heavy game. In fact Bieksa completely got under SJs skin and made them pay in game 5 OT. That series was way closer than the result and if we lost in OT SJ could have gotten right back with momentum on their side. My point is we weren't necessarily a soft team, we had guys that played on the edge and that could throw teams off their game, the same way Boston and Thomas did.
-
Gillis's major fail IMO was reacting to losing game seven and not leaving well enough alone. At the time Hodgson was doing amazing as our third line center and usual picked up the slack when the top two line weren't going. Sure Vancouver didn't push back physically, mostly because AV was betting on discipline and the PPs which we did get more of as a result...And pretty much every time Thomas literally and figuratively stood on his head. Luongo wasn't to blame, considering we went to game seven scoring I think around nine goals total, and he started the series with a shut out. The team didn't play scared at all IMO, which to me suggests Thomas made way more of an impact than anything else. Gillis completely $&!# the bed and should have kept things exactly how they were. Who knows maybe our third line would have made the difference like they did so many times before and LA would be out and we would have gone back to the finals. I do agree that toughness played a role against Boston but I can't think of any individual on our team that played scared, including and especially the Sedins. The refs didn't give enough penalties at times especially a roughing call on Marchand and you have to give them credit for not taking retailation calls and sticking to AVs game plan. Boston won mostly because Thomas was pulling a Roy/ W. Parent (PHI) and at the time was undoubtedly the best goalie in the world.
-
Pugilence was on the way out when AV was here and we really haven't had a good fighter since Rypien RIP. Boston had team toughness and good fighters when they one their cup but it wasn't the key component in their championship it was Thomas all the way. ANA is the only team since the 1997-1998 Detroit teams that really used intimidation to win ....They were heavily penalized throughout the playoffs and still won and destroyed Ottawa in the finals. Shanny said that the players on Detroit would pick a key star(s) before each series and either get them our either by intentionally injuring them or get them to quit the series via intimadation. That is one mean and tough team. Had to go and forgot to get to what I was communicating: only three teams in the last twenty years won their cups partially because they were tough, and only one ANA was it the main reason. Skill Trump's toughness and has for quite a while, even more so as of late:CHI, LA and PIT are pretty tame comparatively and won based on skill and defense/goaltending.
-
A bunch of Maroons would solve our toughness issues too. And if they get otherworldly Mcenters we can expect almost thirty goals per piece.
-
Considering WD and the troops fought back hard and got back into it after a nearly ten game losing streak and kept us close until it all but impossible to get in there is reason for optimism with a better coach. Personally I'd rather just get it over with at this point and be terrible for two or three more years to get three or four quality prospects/ future stars. Management would be wise to keep Juolevi and this year's pick down no matter the temptation let them play in Utica. Boesser will make the team which will off set losing Tryamkin plus Guddy back. The worse thing that could happen to this team is becoming a fringe playoff one...We need to suck for a little while longer. Guess we will find out.
-
The league is faster no doubt but it doesn't rival anything from the nineties, eighties or seventies as far as toughness. The hitting is way toned down as a result of removing hits to the head more than anything. Just google Scott Stevens hits. Or line brawls. Or the history of the enforcer. The meatballs that used to fill the fourth and sometimes the third line have all but disappeared. Hockey now is closer to what it used to be like pre-expansion. All four lines are important and roster spots are been given to skilled guys more often than the big guy that can play ok. The same could be said of the trend at the draft table where teams aren't automatically going for size which was the norm for decades. The playoffs are showcasing an awesome product with these players....
-
Absolutely. How many guys on our team have hit guys through the GLASS before? Linden did it more than once and he was on the ice for 20plus minutes a game as well as others that could do the same. Ohlund could hit like a tree. So could Jovo and Bertuzzi. Edler started out hitting too but something changed. During the entire Sedin era we've only had a handful of guys that punished on the forecheck and I cant wait until that changes.
-
Linden is a good example of being tough without much fighting ability... Remember when he was moved from the wing to center in the first place to deal with a big hulking Otto in Calgary. We were a tough team with guys like Hunter Odjick Antoski Momesso Diduck Babych Murzyn ( who won a cup with Otto in 89) and has size throughout the lineup but none of our centers could handle this guy. Linden was a point a gamer on the wing and racking up 30 plus goal seasons at an alarming rate ( I truly believe if he never moved to center and was saddled with a two way game later in his career he would easily have 400 career goals with an outside chance at 500) but nobody could handle Otto. They battled like two bulls all series and we came out on top. A brilliant move on Quins part. Otto hated Linden and I wouldn't be surprised if the feeling was mutual after the pounding he eventually took a couple times when the gloves did come off. A great example of grit and toughness with no fighting ability.
-
I remember giggling a little when we brought in Brashear who at the time was considered a timid reluctant goon from Montreal and wouldn't open up and fight often. I was giggling because I saw a highlight that blew me away the previous year of him punching a guy so fast and hard he couldn't get going - right into the players bench. I knew we had a special enforcer. Then he proceeded to decimate our division-conference-league leading in fight majors and don't recall him losing ONE scrap all year. Guys were often left bleeding and dazed skating towards the wrong box or out for repairs. Tuff Guys magazine named him fighter of the year and the year before he didn't crack the top thirty where as Gino was 13 th. I know Gino's days were numbered especially because Brashear was a better skater and could score in junior...And they were.
-
So true. The game is reverting back to what it was like pre-expansion. There were guys like Ferguson the grandfather of enforcers but he could play. Before the Bullies and the subsequent arms race teams rolled four lines. The original six days the leading fighters would usually have less then ten figths a year. Nothing wrong with that it doesn't mean the players were soft it because they certainly were not it just meant they took care of business themselves when the gloves dropped. Couldn't imagine the Sedins doing this but we are seeing guys do this that you wouldn't normally expect it from.
-
Walker wouldve pounded Dorsett into the pavement before he could get his gloves off - one of the fastest punchers we've ever had. Small guy for sure and he couldn't match up with the heavyweights at the time but same with almost every fighter in the league right now. Personally I wouldn't have brought him up at all because we had much bigger and more intimidating guys than him in the past but he would be a great example of what teams could use now considering he could play the game too. As far as the points go I wonder how many points our fourth line got this year...
-
Sestito reminded me of Bertuzzi when he was on the ice just a big body..Not a great fighter but it was almost like he was holding back so he wouldn't hurt anyone.
-
Hah. You made me dig through the mags (subscriber since mid nineties..If you aren't you should do it best fifty so bucks I spend a year). Yes as I mentioned it was an article about Johnny Gaudreau and on page twenty the graph shows he would be average back in the twenties at five nine the average height in the nineties was 73.06 inches with 6 3 in brackets and the average height in the 2000s 73.42 inches. Again 6 3 in brackets. Guess both THEM and me forgot our times tables when they wrote it and when I read it lol. Sorry for my posts on this it wasn't until today that I realized that that means 6 1.5 is average and two years ago 6 3 stuck in my head given what I read at the time. I thought our team was small after reading it. Vol 68 no.16 So yes these guys are that big. Look at their rosters the goalies bloated things IMO. Looks like we have an average forward group but our defense is much larger with Bieksa and Hamhuis out and Guddy and Try in And Markstrom is no slouch either.
-
Two different messages your data could be old. Goalies are way bigger than 97 the rest probably hasn't changed much. This year's source says 6 3 they wrote a whole article on it and now the players are taller than ever...Though I do believe that is going to change as experts believe skill is going to trump size at the draft.
-
My reference is the Hockey News they state the average NHLER is 6 3 in an issue this year in an article about Johnny Hockey. Their height chart going back to 1910 to indicates this .. Maybe they were wrong but I trusted they fact checked this.
-
The average NHLer is 6 3 now but not sure on average forward. This trend may go down too given size isn't trumping skill like it use to at the draft table and the death of the enforcer at the NHL level. Goalies also inflate this a bit with multiple monsters over 6 3 and hardly a soul around 6 feet anymore. Our size is getting better especially given IMO weight or muscle mass is part of it too and both Horvat and Virtanen have that in spades. Boesser looks bigger than he is and I don't have any concerns with him getting manhandled. Lebate ( and Pedan if played upfront on the fourth line) would change the culture of the front group instantly and remove the soft/small label too exactly the same way Guddy and Try did for our defense this year.
-
I have mixed feelings about him but would be happy if we got him and he's matured. Look at Maroon having a career year with McJesus scoring his 27 the goal last night reminds me that there are others capable of this role. Stewart is one of them. Huge man that rarely loses and is intimating to other big men. Prout and Peluso are also big guys that can play ten minutes without hurting you.
-
We need a Bieksa type player in the front and back end. The Miller / Hansen TO incident was fantastic given they aren't known for this sort of stuff but it showed that the heart of our team is cushy to the rest of the league. No way we would get pushed around like that with an Odjick on our team. I know you could count the number of true enforcers on one hand now but all it would take is one team to go Philly on the league and pick up five or six bruisers that can take a shift and the arms race would be back with a vengeance. No fan from any team likes it when there is no push back or retaliation for nasty cheap plays. Our team could have three of four enforcers and it wouldn't change much in the standings...But other teams would hate playing us.
-
You bet. Virtanen is still young. His confidence and ego took a solid beating but he has the physical tools to dominate the corners and destroy guys with hits. Once his body peaks he will become a force to reckon with, either in the minors or hopefully with us. He could be traded for a new pick too if management decides to cut ties.
-
Crowder and Probert traded wins losses and draws on their fight card with each other dating back much earlier. In his book he spoke with some reverance on his bouts with Crowds. Same with Clark and how he could take a beating and skate to the box on one leg and help with a ref. He wasn't fond of Brashear....Who would be beat him late in his career whenever they fought with rabbit punches to the ear that he hardly felt complaining he was so strong that he would just hold him in tight and never open up and go to toe (and that he promised himself to go to the gym in the off season so he could break his buggy bear style).
-
Bennings done a decent job bringing a toughness to the team with drafting Tryamkin and bringing in Guddy, Dorsett and even Sbisa and Biega. Losing Beiksa hurt a bit. Virtanen was also picked to help with this same with Pedan although both may never make it. Once Guddy is back and firing in all cylinders our defense should have a tree on the ice most of the time which will definitely help playing in our conference and division. However my hope is that Benning doesn't make the same mistakes at the draft table and picks the best player available in the the first round regardless of his position or toughness. ( I am still a bit perturbed that we didn't get Dubious last year it seemed like a done deal at the time with our position and that Benning was beating his drum about a tough forward that could score publicly). After the first round selecting some tough forwards wouldn't hurt. We are pretty small upfront although soon the Sedins will retire and two spots will open up that could be that extra umph the forward group needs if they are big bodies that can skate and score. Personally I prefer to watch a tough team than a soft one, love the hitting and the occasional Doney Brook. We are a much bigger team than we were for years and years and years but don't have a true enforcer which is ok. A nice mix of big punishing guys that can skate well with some skilled water bugs would be ideal...Would be tough to defend against and even tougher to score against. More work to do but definitely headed in the right direction.
-
He is the most likely player we can trade at or before the deadline. Still it will be strange seeing him in different colors.
-
Burrows last gift to Vancouver to Montreal for their 2nd in 2018.
-
Congrats to Lu - moving up in all time wins - Luuuu
IBatch replied to gizmo2337's topic in General Hockey Discussion
Funny. He instantly helped the club and in a coupe seasons he was posting killer stats on the best team in the NHL at the time. Will be a long time before we string that many 100 plus point seasons together again. Best goalie we've ever had by far.