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Everything posted by Patel Bure
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Will Canucks coaching staff survive the season?
Patel Bure replied to Ms.Glitter's topic in Canucks Talk
I'd hire Gallant as coach just on the fact that the guy knows how to use Schmidt in the correct manner unlike Travis Green. -
Sorry I should have clarified. What I should have said was the "modern day equivalent" of those deals (salary cap adjusted and so obviously the cap hits to Petey and Hughes would be higher than what Aho and ZW received). Barzal's 3x7m would a good deal for the Canucks as it would give us a HUGE opportunity in 2022-2024 to make a huge push.
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Yes, I can stay positive. On July 1st 2022....... 1) All of our "bad" contracts will be off the books. 2) Miller, Schmidt, and Horvat will still be on relatively low cap hit deals. 3) Boeser will still be a cost controlled asset as an RFA and likely won't kill the bank. 4) (my hope) is that Petey and Hughes will either have taken 'bridge' deals or will sign 5 year deals to keep the cap hit relatively low (Sebastian Aho and Zack Werenski as comparables) 5) If the Canucks perform poorly this season and next, we get high draft picks that will complement our core in 2022-2023. 6) Guys like Petey, Hughes, Demko, Podkolzin, Hoglander, etc. will be closer to their prime. From a cap perspective, if you truly understand the cap, it becomes obvious that 2022-2023 is the year that management has circled on their calendar. 2022-2023: (my ideal line-up) Miller-Pettersson-Boeser Hoglander-Horvat-Podkolzin ####-Bennett-#### (these "####'s" being in the form of UFA signings and/or one of our picks in 2021 draft / solid two-way players) Motte-Gaudette-MacEwen Lindholm-Schmidt (Canucks sign Hampus Lindholm or even trade/sign him as early as this summer) Hughes-Myers Tryamkin-Chatfield / Juolevi-Tryamkin / Rathbone-Tryamkn (whichever) Demko [Dipietro or CheapVet) A) Holtby and/or Roussel claimed in the Expansion draft. B-) The Canucks moving Edler, Pearson, and Sutter (50% retention) at the trade deadline this year if we appear to be far out of playoff contention (messaged relayed to Edler that the Canucks have no intention of re-signing him and so maybe he'd be willing to waive his NTC).
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Will Canucks coaching staff survive the season?
Patel Bure replied to Ms.Glitter's topic in Canucks Talk
My hope is that Benning stays while Gallant gets hired as coach. -
The logic behind letting Tanev, Markstrom, and Toffoli walk
Patel Bure replied to Patel Bure's topic in Canucks Talk
@VanIsleCanuckFan (and @smokes Here’s my take on it: Benning didn’t really “run out of time,” on Marky/Tanev/Toffoli, but rather, hyper-focused on landing OEL. The reason? Benning is and was confident that they had long term replacements for all of Markstrom (Demko), Toffoli (Podkolzin), and Tanev (Tryamkin) but realized that their BIGGEST long term need was in finding a top pairing “all situations” dman that could log big minutes and help shut down......so in other words, an Edler replacement. Olli Juolevi was supposed to be that guy (which is why Benning and management drafted via positional need rather than BPA here), but it didn’t pan out unfortunately. Still possible give OJ’s age, but looking unlikely at this point. I suspect that Benning wanted to sign Markstrom and Tanev, but only at terms and money that were far below what they could get on the open market. Benning had that luxury because the Canucks had their replacements within the system. Signing these two players at market value (term and money) would have screwed us in the long term. Benning obviously can’t go on air and explain all of this and so that’s he’s going to say something like “ran out of time.” As far as Toffoli goes, the Canucks wanted to keep him and were fielding offers for Boeser and Virtanen with the intention of moving one of these guys. With Virtanen, they were trying to get a low 1st rounder using Kasperi Kapanen as a comparable and were trying to get a 1st and prospect (lost in the Toffoli and Miller deals) with Boeser which also would have allowed them to clear cap space to sign Toffoli. The Canucks received low ball offers on both players instead and so Benning passed. Here is what a lot of people don’t understand, and this is why HF Canucks and many Canucks media members are very “toxic.” 1) Getting young kids into the line-up isn’t always a good thing. 2) Signing cheap vets or PTO vets to good term and money is NOT akin to shooting fish in a barrell for a downtrending rebuilding team. I’m mentioning the above because Benning often receives a LOT of criticism for signing / trading for guys like Sutter, Eriksson, Ferland, Myers, Gudbranson, Beagle, Roussel, Schaller, etc. What a lot of people don’t realize is that a lot of kids would have been pushed into the NHl too prematurely had it not been for these signings (And no, it’s NOT coincidence at all that ALL of these “transitional/extraneous” contracts will be off the books by July 1st 2022.) As it relates to a PTO, the fit has to be good for both the team AND the player in order for it to make sense. A PTO isn’t just going to agree to sign with a team and be thrown to the wolves playing against opposing top players while the kids get sheltered. Why? Because - that would likely spell the end of his NHL career once the year finished. That is why we were able to sign Thomas Vanek. Guys like Bieksa, Hansen, Burrows, Lack, and Garrison were all moved for picks/prospects when management felt that there were kids within the system that could replace these guys. That’s why the Canucks didn’t move Tanev and Hamhuis when people were screaming for it. Kids within the system would have been inappropriately placed into roles that they would have been too green for, and it would have had a negative rippling effect on the development of kids in various positions (including Markstrom who would have been over-exerted even more). In a lot of ways, I think this management group is one of the most misunderstood management group’s in recent memory. -
The logic behind letting Tanev, Markstrom, and Toffoli walk
Patel Bure replied to Patel Bure's topic in Canucks Talk
Thanks man. Back in the summer, I was coming up with some crazy ideas on how the Canucks could keep their playoff core together and no matter which route I took, it always involved us using Podkolzin and our 1st as sweeteners to get rid of our “transitional”/rebuild contracts. Benning could have easily done this and could have easily signed Markstrom, Tanev, and Toffoli if he has truly wanted to, but it just goes back to the original question: Do we want to be competitive NOW and have a very short window, or do we want to begin our REAL window in 2022-2023 and have a boatload of young talent in our system at cost controlled cap hits? Here is what I hope happens between now and July 1st 2022: 1) The Canucks accumulate draft picks for Edler, Pearson, and Sutter (50% retention) at the deadline if the Canucks are slated to miss the playoffs. (Edler waived his NTC as management makes it clear to him that we won’t be re-signing him) 2) The Jake Virtanen/Sam Bennett deal occurs 3) Podkolzin joins us in April in a similar way to how Boeser and Hughes joined us. 4) Tryamkin signs with the Canucks in the off-season 5) Pettersson and Hughes either sign bridge deals or 5 year deals to keep the cap hit relatively low and the Canucks do NOT make the same mistake that teams like the Oilers, Sabres, and Leafs did. 6) The Canucks sign Hampus Lindholm on July 1st 2022. 7) The Canucks sign two good two-way 3rd line players and/or someone emerges within the system. October 2022 opening line-up: Miller-Pettersson-Boeser Hoglander-Horvat-Podkolzin ************ - Bennett - ********* Motte-Gaudette-MacEwen Lindholm-Schmidt Hughes-Myers [Juolevi-Tryamkin / Rathbone-Tryamkin / Tryamkin-Chatfield] Demko [Dipietro or cheapVet] With possible picks from this ugly 2021 draft possibly factoring into the above line up. -
The logic behind letting Tanev, Markstrom, and Toffoli walk
Patel Bure replied to Patel Bure's topic in Canucks Talk
My hope is that it will look something like this: Lindholm-Schmidt Hughes-Tryamkin [young guy + cheap vet] The Canucks will have all of their bad contracts off the books by July 1st 2022 and Hampus Lindholm will become a UFA. My hope is that we go HARD after Lindholm here as we will have the cap space to do so. I’m also hoping that Myers is the ones that gets claimed in the Expansion draft. -
Haha nice dig up. :-). I wrote 2021-2022 at the time but I think management has 2022-2023 circled. ALL of our bad contracts will be off the books when the 22-23 season starts. I see our roster looking more like this: Miller-Pettersson-Boeser Hoglander-Horvat-Podkolzin [New 3rd line] (maybe Virtanen for Bennett?) Motte-Gaudette-MacEwen [Lindholm]-Schmidt. (HL will be the AE replacement) Hughes-Tryamkin [young guy + vet]. Could be Myers or another cheap vet or and one of OJ, Rathbone, or Chatfield Demko [Holtby, Dipietro, or CheapVet] 1) My hope is that Myers is claimed in the ED 2) Hampus Lindholm would be a terrific add and would be our LiNg term Edler replacement 3) Tryamkin = Tanev replacement 4) Hoglander and Podkolzin = Pearson and Toffoli 5) Virtanen for Bennet happens at some point.
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The only thing I’m hanging onto right now is the argument that our results have been “predictable” so far in the sense that..... 1) We destroyed Ottawa in all three games. 2) We are around .500 against other “middle of the road” teams in Calgary, Winnipeg, and Edmonton (one game below). 3) We are obviously dreadful against the two “top 8” calibre teams in our division. Im willing to hang my hat on the idea that “we need a bigger sample size against Calgary, Winnipeg, and Edmonton,” to see where this team is really at but beyond that, I won’t be able to defend this team much if we start getting blown out by those three teams as well.
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The logic behind letting Tanev, Markstrom, and Toffoli walk
Patel Bure replied to Patel Bure's topic in Canucks Talk
1) Schmidt’s style of game will age much better than Tanev’s (Atleast in theory). 2) Benning wanted the boys to get valuable playoff experience and didn’t want the season to be lost due to Boeser’s injury. 3) Canucks are thinking long term and down have the cap space for those guys. Demko, Hoglander, and Tryamkin are supposed to be the replacements for Markstrom, Toffoli, and Tanev while Podkolzin will replace Pearson. Schmidt was the Edler replacement. I still think 2022-2023 will be the year where we become an elite team (ie all bad contracts will be off our books while our young core will be more experienced), but I’ll admit that things are quite painful right now. Ps - I would do Virtanen for Bennett. -
I think the Toffoli and Miller deals have proven that Benning is willing to make 'balsy' moves if he sees fit but I'm just really sad over what's going on right now. I don't want to speculate on what I don't understand, but I think there might be something wrong in the dressing room right now. Are the players pissed off over losing Markstrom, Tanev, and Toffoli? Do they feel that management turned their backs on them by appearing not to give them the vote of confidence? While I understand what management is doing, I'm not sure if most media members do.......and now I'm wondering if the players themselves are confused over management's plan. Just feeling really bummed out by the state of affairs right now. The "Canucks fans" on HF are probably delirious with joy right now so good for them I guess. Ditto for guys like JD Burke, etc.
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I hate to admit it but you might be right here. This isn't even 2015-2018 level stuff that I'm seeing. This almost reminds me of 1997-2000 Messier era levels. I suspect that something is going on behind the scenes.
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Proposal? Time to run at Dunn?
Patel Bure replied to Freeridebc's topic in Proposals and Armchair GM'ing
No to Dunn. The Canucks need a solid top pairing defensive defenseman. Someone that can fill the shoes of Edler. Go hard after Hampus Lindholm when he becomes a UFA. -
The logic behind letting Tanev, Markstrom, and Toffoli walk
Patel Bure replied to Patel Bure's topic in Canucks Talk
“the few good assets we got,” Non-roster -Podkolzin -Dipietro -Rathbone -Tryamkin Roster -Hoglander -Demko -Pettersson -Boeser -Hughes Guys like Schmidt, Pearson, Horvat, and Miller have value as cost controlled “vets” that aren’t even that old, while guys like Motte and MacEwen have good value relative to their contracts as well. While guys like Virtanen, Gaudette, and Juolevi likely have diminished values, they are still young enough and cheap enough for someone to take a gamble on. Pearson will have trade deadline value if the Canucks are out of a playoff spot at the deadline, while guys like Edler and Sutter *might* be moveable as well (Sutter at 50% retention while Edler might be willing to waive his NTC/NMC if he’s told well in advance that the club will not be bringing him back next season). Oh - did I mention that ALL of Eriksson, Spooner, Sutter, Luongo, and Baertschi will be off the books by July 2022? I’m not sure where you’re coming from in your post, sorry. -
The logic behind letting Tanev, Markstrom, and Toffoli walk
Patel Bure replied to Patel Bure's topic in Canucks Talk
Even if he is, the 2022-2023 season will be a HUGE opportunity for the Canucks and Benning should be given massive credit if the Canucks make a deep run in 2022-2023. -
The logic behind letting Tanev, Markstrom, and Toffoli walk
Patel Bure replied to Patel Bure's topic in Canucks Talk
Sutter will be long gone when our real window begins. 2022-2023: 1) Sutter, Eriksson, Beagle, Roussel, Spooner, Luongo’s contract, Baertschi, Pearson, and Edler will all be off the books. 2) Miller, Schmidt, and Horvat will still be on cap friendly deals while Boeser will still be a cost controlled asset as an RFA. 3) Hughes, Demko, and Pettersson will likely be on bridge deals or 5 year deals (aka the “Chicago” model as opposed to the ill fated Edmonton, Buffalo, and Toronto 8 year gazillion dollar deals). 4) Hughes, Pettersson, Podkolzin, Demko, Hoglander, etc., will all be closer to their peaks. 2022-2023 is the year that this management group has circled. Study the Canucks’ cap on capgeek.com and it becomes extremely obvious. -
The logic behind letting Tanev, Markstrom, and Toffoli walk
Patel Bure replied to Patel Bure's topic in Canucks Talk
The Canucks acquired all of these players while they were rebuilding because...... 1) they didn’t have kids in the system that were ready to step into the league. 2) they were trying to insulate/protect whatever kids they had in the system by making sure that said kids were playing in roles that were conducive to their level of play. -Prust was brought in because Gaunce wasn’t ready -Gudbranson was brought in because the Canucks had absolutely NOTHING on their right side D other than Tanev, and young physical “defensive” stay at home dmen are rarely ever made available. Benning gambled with Gudbranson because they would have been able to move on from Tanev (return on assets) if Gudbranson has panned out. -Eriksson was brought in because no one in our system was ready to take that 2nd line RW spot. Hansen was our only good RW while Burrows was washed up. No PTO’s wanted to sign with us that year while Virtanen wasn’t ready. -Sutter was brought in so that he could take on the tough defensive match ups so that Horvat and the twins could take on more offensive deployments (I’ll admit that I didn’t like the term and money given to Sutter at all). -Beagle, Roussel, and Schaller were brought in because Gaudette and MacEwen were not ready at the time while no one could have predicted Pettersson being so good so quickly. -Myers was brought in to solidly the right side D while not being overly reliant on Tanev. -The presence of Ryan Miller helped Markstrom develop in the minors. You can’t just sign a bunch of PTO’s and/or push kids into the line-up during a rebuild. Pushing kids into roles that are above and beyond their levels does no justice to them. PTO’s also have to have a valid reason for signing on a team, in terms of the role being a good fit for them. PTO’s and vets looking to save their careers aren’t just going to sign onto a team and be thrown to the wolves in tough match ups while the organization tries to insulate the kids. Why? Because - Id said cheap vet/PTO gets slaughtered, it’s the end of their careers after one year. Hence - those are the reasons why Benning and his team went out and traded for/signed guys like Sutter, Gudbranson, Myers, Eriksson, etc. It’s also one of the reasons why we were able to successfully sign a guy like Thomas Vanek (ie the role was a great fit for both the team and the player). Long story short - it’s no coincidence that all/most of our bad contracts will be coming off the books just as guys like Petey and Hughes will need to be reupped. This was no coincidence. If you look at the way our cap is structured and what players have been brought in, it will become extremely obvious that 2022-2023 is what Benning and this management group have circled. @kanucks25 -
We will have to agree to disagree here I guess. That Pearson-Horvat-Eriksson line in its entirety was really good for us and took on all of the toughest match ups. With Eriksson gone, the Horvat line is being used in a different way (more offensive deployment) and we haven’t had a match ups line in its place since then. Gaudette is bloody useless in a match ups capacity while Sutter and Beagle simply aren’t good enough to be going head to head against other top lines. As a result, the Pettersson line has been going up against the top lines and they’ve been getting caved in.
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Pearson-Horvat-Eriksson was very good for us last year. They took on almost all of the toughest matchups. Coaching and/or management should have never taken Eriksson out of the line up. And yes - I realize that Eriksson is grossly overpaid and can’t produce offense anymore. Miller-Pettersson-Boeser Pearson-Horvat-Eriksson Hoglander-Gaudette-MacEwen Motte-Sutter-Virtanen Hughes-Edler (Edler plays in Tanev’s old role) Schmidt-Myers Juolevi-Benn Demko Holtby