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ToTellTheTruth

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  1. Not Structure. That is just a phrase that has been introduced to distract from Allvin's failure as a GM to do the real work needed which is to try to change the losing culture Benning crafted here. There have been times when the Canucks have been like that. Most recently when Gillis ran the team and had 4th liners with 10+ goals For months some fans have been looking at January as being a defining month for this group. Who figured the Avalanche would be so bad with so many key injuries, that should have been a loss too or was expected to be. Just false hope. As far as team play, Allvin has made his bed, he pays by points regardless of anything else. This group has had a losing culture for 6 or 7 years now. Everything points to a Carolina victory IMO the only thing they have to worry about is how bad the Canucks have been. That might get them to ease up too much. Most hockey players will not kick a dog when it is down and the Canucks are waaaay down so they might take a win for granted. Probably the back up. But this game should put to bed all the fake playoff spewing. The players have spoken.
  2. I don't see why not? The fanbase knows it was Allvin that didn't do his job in improving the defence. This is pretty much the same as every other year maybe a little worse because of all the "false hope" that the players had for help so there was a let down. Think of a pendulum swinging, great hope but it swings back. The greater the hope the greater the disappointment. Personally am not that disappointed because I didn't see much change in personnel of significance and thought that age would catch up to the older players. I don't know what fans expected, the defence was never going to be better without significant change. They will have one more contract with him, a bridge deal for so many reasons. A two year deal takes him to UFA status and he can get that by going to arbitration, that is all an arbitrator can had out and I think if he only awards a one year deal then Petey is a UFA at the end of that contract. I sometimes can't understand why some fans have a hard time of thinking of a player's desire to play for a cup. for most of these players the Stanley Cup is the ultimate goal. For most the "only one team can win" crud is just that, most have already had success doing something similar in junior or internationally. How many teams win the world cup? Memorial Cup or any of the other ultimate trophies? Done with that. Starting to have SOME sympathy for the players having to go before the camera and explain losing again and again. Another loss to Florida, it was closer but still hard to outscore the opposition all the time. Oh well it is only one game!
  3. Stan might not have wanted the job, but if left to it he would do it like he played the game, balls to the wall. But hiring Rutherford was not a mistake either, Rutherford at his introduction nailed the problems with this team and Allvin seemed to agree with those insights. IMO Rutherford's faith in Allvin was misplaced or Allvin suckered him and he should have pursued an experienced GM. Regardless of the team's bump in success under Bruce that season there was a 4 year history that Allvin ignored and he had no experience with any Canadian fanbase and the interest, knowledge or commitment of those fans. Miller's contract was not imperative at that time, they had a full year to work on that, but it is not a slam dunk that Horvat even wanted to re-sign here either. Miller's contract based on points alone will have spurred Horvat to play differently, more individually to get as many points as possible, this was an Allvin creation or the impression he has given the players. This is also Horvat's last chance at a big contract and by playing as good as he is he made himself a desirable player in the league. Rutherford knew that Allvin dropped the ball right away that is why he was trying to divert attention to Boudreau, training camp and 30 year old Miller's one time 99 point player signing as a center. He knows it was a huge mistake but what can he do? Fire Allvin right away? Pull the rug out from under Allvin and have the fanbase lament another Benning fiasco repeating itself? If Rutherford criticizes Allvin's first three months on the job how much confidence does that create in the fanbase about him? It is the easier to blame an outgoing coach for the team's historical play that was missed or ignored by the new crew. Allvin has never been involved with building a team just doing team maintenance and it looks like that is what he tried doing here but failed in so many areas. The history of the team, fan intelligence, fan frustration and market scrutiny. He did his job like he was in Pittsburgh, maintain the team. With all those assistants where was the consensus? Was it say your piece and then I will tell what we are doing? Allvin will have to do more of what the "wisdom of the masses" knows needing done. This does not make his job easier with the fanbase pushing so hard for change. Other GM's will know he is operating from a position of pressure of the fans. Allvin has to realize the depth of frustration of the fans and the lack of faith in the players as a group. Fans will not be rioting if he fails to win every trade, they are smart enough to know that dealing from a position of desperation or failure the players are viewed as less than elite. On a good winning team Miller's 8 million as a 99 point player, even at 30 yrs old might not be a bad contract but on a winning team now and not a perineal loser. Not this team.
  4. Four GM's and other front office staff and it takes one, the president to look into a possible serious player problem? What the Fra*k, just who does what with that group. Anyone actually watching or keeping tabs on the players?
  5. 7 - 0 Hurricanes Aho with the GWG Canes score first
  6. Turns out to be some what popular thread thanks all. On the Coach stuff. They knew, they hired and vetted Yeo for the assistant role and aske Bruce what he thought, 3 weeks later started saying they didn't know he had a 2 year or rather one and a half year contract taking him to the end of this year. They knew; Canucks: Bruce Boudreau returning as head coach The Vancouver Canucks confirmed Friday that the popular head coach will be back for the 2022-23 NHL season. Author of the article: Patrick Johnston Published May 13, 2022 • 4 minute read Coaching Staff Updates by Canucks Communications @Canucks / Vancouver Canucks July 1, 2022 Vancouver, B.C. - Vancouver Canucks General Manager Patrik Allvin and Abbotsford Canucks General Manger Ryan Johnson announced today changes to the club's coaching staff. Mike Yeo has been brought on as an Assistant Coach and Trent Cull has been promoted to Assistant Coach of the Vancouver Canucks. Jeremy Colliton will take over as Head Coach of the Abbotsford Canucks, while Brad Shaw will be leaving the organization to take an Associate Coach position with the Philadelphia Flyers. "We're pleased to have solidified our Coaching staff for next season with the promotion of Trent Cull and the additions of Mike Yeo and Jeremy Colliton," said Allvin. "These individuals bring a lot of hockey experience and knowledge to the group. We would like to thank Brad Shaw for his contributions to the club and wish him the best of luck in Philadelphia." "I am so excited to help bring this group of coaches together," said Canucks Head Coach Bruce Boudreau. "When I started the conversations with Mike Yeo, it became clear to me that he would be an excellent addition. Working with Patrik to create a well-rounded staff was very important for us as we look to continue to build upon the momentum we experienced last season." In fairness Benning worst contract was Eriksson's very similar to Miller's in salary and term with clauses. But Benning essentially traded 4 tradable assets, vets in their last year that would have value at the TDL and a first, second and seventh round picks essentially for Garland and a two year rental with a poison pill contract. Benning takes the heat for that trade. Hopefully when the OEL type trade happens it is for a one year deal that gains a top draft pick or it is for a player on LTIR because they need the added cap allowance. It almost has to happen, taking on a bad contract, it should be a short term contract that adds to the future and it should be very soon if they really want to put this team into not just contention for a playoff spot but in one and contending for series wins. One year isn't enough to be able to read? Or add? Kuzmenko and Lettermaki future stars? Hey I hear that Jones kid could be a star too. Kuzmenko's agent will want a ransom, what is a 70/80 point winger worth? It was reported 25+ teams wanted him, he came here because this was one of the only teams that could guarantee him top six minutes. A means to an end. He is 27 this year too so too old because this team has not enough young players or prospect depth. Just hearing Dhali saying there is a report out of Michigan that Pettersson doesn't want to re-sign here.
  7. I looked at several forum pages and didn't find any titles that deal with this new management over all. So I thought what the heck. I was thrilled when the owner's finally had enough of the Benning incompetence and cleaned house, a scorched earth cleansing at the top. I thought that with all the new more competent front office staff combined with Rutherford's initial statements there would be finally real change to the team after all they had no skin in the game with these players. Being new they could get away with many moves and create fan certainty about the direction the team was taking, a plan with a future. It was great, new blood with inclusion and an experienced mentor in Rutherford who finally stated what most fans recognized years ago, the team structure at every level was a mess. Allvin was an unknown but seemed to be on track with Rutherford. I was a little startled when noting happened at the first TDL even though Bruce had the team on a hot streak, to the fans this was an anomaly and even Bruce kept saying to not do the "Bruce there it is" stuff and kept saying he hadn't done anything. To me this was just the Hawthorne effect, improvement over a short period of time because the players also got the idea that with an entirely new front office good changes would be made. The trade deadline came and went and with it much trade value. Miller who had been a suspected trade asset for over a year was still on the team. Well that might get changed at the draft or over summer. I still believed they would create cap space as was stated when hired. To my dismay they gave Boeser a raise and then signed Mikheyev and astonishingly signed Miller to an albatross anchor contract as bad as any given out by the guy just fired and totally contrary to statements made at hiring. Did we the fans just get suckered again I thought. Were we being treated like ignorant instant gratification naïve fans? Unfortunately the answer appeared to be yes. There was no need to sign Miller at that time, they had another year to decide that and with the other signings it became clear they wanted to try to continue the failed results of the previous 6 years and that their concept of the fans was a single playoff appearance was a win and would satisfy this fanbase. Rutherford kept saying what fans thought, it needed to be fixed. But he hired Allvin to run the team and as such he stepped back on some of his comments, like even though he hadn't been hired yet he gave the Boudreau hiring the green light and stamp of approval. Bruce had stated all along he wanted to see what he could do with a training camp and it was public knowledge that Bruce had a two year contract. Only Allvin didn't know that so Rutherford had to take some heat off of Allvin for the way he failed to read the fanbase and the team. IMO Allvin listened too much to the Sedin's and thought he could get the band together with some candy for the fans. Rutherford stated he watched the team, that there was plenty of history with this group so a long term learning period was not necessary that there were lots of stats to use. He hired Allvin and the Chipmunks and as soon as Allvin was designated the top dog he had to retract most of his statements, Allvin was running the team and would do it his way. What a disaster. Players like fans were disappointed and baffled with signings and lack of trades. Miller was no doubt prepared to be moved, it had been the top rumour for a year but instead he gets a contract that will disable the team in 3 years and for another 4 after. A contract that Rutherford had stated was to be avoided, long term for aged player. That takes us to today, Horvat is moving, I think that was decided by Horvat in the summer and in a panic Allvin signed Miller and Mikheyev. Rutherford is not the GM, he does not run the team Allvin does, it is Allvin's vision that they are following. The team is worse today than last year in almost every way. Before the was the OEL contract to deal with and now there are two of those, double jeopardy. Two players that will be 35+ yrs old making over 7.5 million each with one, Miller, running until he is 37 yrs old at 8 million. I hate the word hope, to me it is a word used when there is nothing real or an imaginary goal. Sure I hope they win a Stanley Cup but for 50+ years that is all it has been, hope or a dream. Fantasy until it happens But I hope now that there really was some plan to trade Miller where it required cost certainty and that is why he was signed early and not because Horvat and Pettersson have decided to move on so they felt they needed to keep at least one core player. I HOPE they do follow up on the hiring day statements that brought back some fan trust which is rapidly dissolving now. I HOPE there really is a plan going forward because a 12 year old can do math and read contract salary caps, terms and clauses and know old player don't play the same or get better as they age. Right now I believe this management group is on the edge of losing the fanbase again. Essentially 4 GM's and nothing happening, no messages from any of them, no appearances at stakeholder meetings, no meaningful interviews that aren't scripted before hand.
  8. It is okay but I don't think they should be sheltered considering the effect of keeping them till the end had. So at a fan invited meeting the faces of the franchises SHOULD BE ABSENT right? Just exactly what is they do? What team events are they qualified to attend where there are fans? Stand in the middle of the ice and get more applauds for play a decade ago? Anyway what questions were answered at the meeting?
  9. Wow, quite a thread. Everything from gender to religions. I quoted this part because I couldn't find 1 in 7 posters that wanted Miller resigned a full year before he was needed to be especially after the Rutherford's warning about signing older players to long term contracts. Pretty sure most figured he would be traded this year at least because the cap dictated that something had to happen. IMO Miller is the worst type of player to have in the room for a group of young players. Kris(t) he is 31 next year in his first year. 30 yrs old in March of this year. It was keeping Horvat, Boeser and Miller or Pettersson, Demko and others leaving. Sticking with the same core and expecting something different was truly insanity. What do you need a crystal ball for? Hope? The cap is listed, player cap hits and length of contracts are posted, player bio's (injuries) are public although there is some interpretation required, future draft players are known for 2 years ahead, the CBA and NHL bylaws are public, NHL rules public. Even so many stats now probably even for how many bathroom calls during a game no doubt. It isn't rocket science. The biggest stumbling block is the old boys network and back room unwritten rules.
  10. So the fewer Canuck management types the better? Are they kept in a closet with ear muffs on? I was not there but what questions were asked and answered?
  11. They are the face of the franchise and were not development coaches to start off with. Besides fans came out to the very end so wouldn't an appearance be warranted?
  12. No it was a brilliant contract and cap management that helped for signing Kesler, Hamhuis, Edler, Tanev, Maholtra to build a cup final contender. 1.3 million was a considerable amount in 2010, 59 million cap limit. At the time of the signing he could have retired and the team off the hook, Detroit's GM actually stated that outright about some of his back loaded long term contracts and one of the NHL's negotiators signed 3 super long term deals 24 hours before the CBA was signed. I say 3 because he was the owner of Minnesota and essentially Nashville because he lent them the money to buy the team and was still involved with that team. Cap management, these types of deals allowed for extra money for better players and Vancouver was the very best team in the 2010 regular season all the way to playing for a cup. What if the league suddenly says RFAs' are UFA's after their 2nd contracts regardless of term. All those bridge deals suddenly become deadly but were legal at the time. What if the league suddenly states LTIR is only good for 50% of the contracts? Some teams are built around that loop hole now.
  13. Another naïve fan The contract was legal at the time, other teams had the same or worse, Detroit, Nashville, Minnesota, all ended up with the same or had worse recapture issues and more of them. Nashville and Minnesota are still suffering for them. The reason Luongo's name is used is it was Burke who petitioned for it using Luongo's as the prime example. Gillis had scooped him on the Sedins and he was and still is vindictive. That and Luongo saying he had a crappy contract because it was hard to trade. Benning could have traded for Luongo's contract and saved millions at the end. IMO Eriksson was easily the worst money for points contract. A foregone conclusion even before he signed. Concussions, lack of production outside of contract years, his age.
  14. Rutherford is doing the job Aquilini wanted Quinn to do and also be the mentor for Linden as VP but ..... RIP. Rutherford will end up being Scotty Bowman in Vancouver not president but the mentor without the president title. Rutherford had to do an about face when Allvin signed Miller that early. Fan reaction must have been quite the surprise for Allvin who probably got advice from the Sedins' about long term deals. The Sedins were quietly shuffled to a much lower management level. Why were the Sedins not there at least?
  15. Canucks have beat Tampa just once in the last 5 years. Will Lightning strike today? Tampa has four lines, 3 that are far better than anything after the Canucks #1 line. Won't mention the defence comparison or goalie situations Canucks are likely to face a lot of backups the rest of the season but that has been happening for almost half a decade now. This is going to be the straw. Double digits
  16. The writing was on the wall 4 years ago. The cap assured that, well Benning spending WAY OVER the cap and trading away 1rst's, 2nd's and letting FA walk for nothing assured these results.
  17. This is Tampa! 9 - 2 Lightning Kucherov with the GWG Game management will give the Canucks 7 PP's
  18. Both him and Allvin have been saying way too much for my comfort level, that the fans want a playoff, like that is all fans here want, like we are from the southern US where fans go to watch winners only or at least more often. Where they have to be in the playoffs to attract media and fan attention. The idea that fans only want a playoff game or two is scary and that looks like how they are operating. Fans here have had it shoved down there throats that this concept has failed for 10 years,
  19. Back then the NHL did not control the media, nor was the media rights held by a single company that could control the message. You can see now how being honestly critical of poor play and expressing an opinion has been labelled "trolling" mostly because it isn't towing the company line. The loser point was pandered as being a reward for trying hard, but to many media personalities saw through this for what it was, an artificial use of stats to make teams seem closer in talent than reality. I often would post a team could lose all 82 games and still have 82 points or that a team only had to win 11 games all year if they lost the rest in OT. Later I started noticing that teams that were out of the playoffs by the first week of December rarely ever made the playoffs at the end of the season. I posted this and got bombarded with attacks from the controlled marketing departments. But it has become adopted and enough fools actually believed what is spoon fed them. So I started posting what the actual records were, wins vs losses period. No loser points and got much more accurate league standings. Of course this was ignored for years and again I was attacked and banned from forums. I am still a little off with the new media mostly because the NHL and Rogers has inadvertently created a culture of fans that believe whatever is posted and the media started to project whatever message they wanted on what fans wanted. Fans were impatient, ignorant, uneducated, panicky whatever they wanted and it got really bad when this new power was used to create and fuel team support or disgust. The Sedins became thugs, cheaters, weak and divers. That was just an example during the cup run. For years of the Benning era it was obvious where this team was going, that they had no idea of what to do but they controlled enough of the media that if those media shows didn't follow the team lead then they didn't get any interviews or were able to ask questions, refused credentials or invitations to fly with the team. Eventually fans got educated in the school of hard knocks, enough lies were told, Spend to the cap, the team must be good right? They spent all that money. Build through the draft by a scouting guru right? But there were no draft picks or not enough and then they were traded away because that made the team better, but it didn't. It was all Gillis's fault, everything for 8 years until Benning got exposed as totally incompetent with over paid contracts for marginal players with clauses, the shear number of traded away draft picks, the team strangled every year by self inflicted capping out so no work could be done so none was, finally capping it off with letting many FA walk for nothing instead of making trades even though the entire world could see there was no way to re-sign most of those, but there was surprise he let them all go and stated "we ran out of time". Even then it took a flying banner, much booing and finally jersey's thrown on the ice to break the NHL's hold on misleading the market's angst. Even now this new regime has started off with the standard, big contract signing because "He is a 99 point player", selling the contract and player points, followed quickly with the Mikheyev contract and the Kuzmenko signing spending to the cap so future trades are almost impossible but not addressing the team's deeper problems. Then comes the "The fans just want a playoff round" statements trying to make it sound like the fans are idiots, trying to create a false message from fans that didn't take hold this time. The result is once again the team was well out of a playoff spot by December and now is 10 points out. So the last 3 months of "playoff, playoffs, playoffs" hopefully should be put to bed, finally. Now will come the scare tactics, "A rebuild will take a decade", " the team will lose more and not be interesting" but they forget the team hasn't been very interesting for almost a decade and they certainly have not been winning. Petey will not want to stay, something he has already mildly stated and it will take too long because Hughes, Demko and Petey's best years will be gone, used up rebuilding. Big deal, they are not the team, they are just on the team and over the last 50 years there have been lots of players just on the team. Maybe tht has been the problem, too much trying to emulate the original six teams where players play for most of their careers on one team. FA changed that or should have, but then there is the unwritten rule(s) still. The truth of the matter is teams can be rebuilt in very short time, many teams have done that, some twice while the Canucks languished in Tier 4. The cap restricts trades, true it does somewhat especially if the team is hell bent of winning NOW but that same cap problem is a boon for a rebuilding team through the use of retention, which is trading some cap space in a trade. For teams that are at that point of their "now" windows this is a huge extra value in any trade. Not many teams can waste money on retention but this team can afford to and has for a decade, wasted money to achieve nothing. All of this would have been pointed by an independent media and now is with social media taking hold. How about more truth, if it looks like sheet and smells like sheet is it necessary to taste it? As Macrae would say, "they should be playing better, harder so other teams will want them" or Botch, "Is there a plan? or is it another no plan, plan?"
  20. He was referring to the Penquins not his new job. Context is important.
  21. Ya, they are not trying hard enough, a little more work and they can be number one!
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