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Everything posted by kloubek
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To be fair, sound defensive play is not worth 6 million a season - not even close. These days with the skill level on the teams, if you aren't putting up points you're hurting your team. I was not one of the ones to get on him too badly. I could not see any reason why he declined so far so fast, and felt there was a good chance he would come back; we are seeing that now. But I totally understood why everyone was ragging on him. When you are paid that much, you need to produce. Glad to see he appears to be back on track; we need the extra scoring.
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We can dream.
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I wouldn't be too concerned about his position. If we need him at wing, he's going to be wing. If we need him at C (which is most likely) he will be at C. He will end up where he ends up based on his talents and our needs. He's a super smart player so I imagine he will be able to adapt to whichever position he's needed.
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Is he? I thought he was quite comfortable with both positions. But it's true... Elite centers can be hard to come by so if a guy is truly capable of playing center, you generally want him in that position. The idea was more a pipe dream we would get Tavares and manage to have 3 elite players on one line. Not sure we have any other likely elite forward talent in the system. Not like we are gonna have a chance to woo Tavares here anyway. I'm fully expecting Pettersson to be our #1 center.
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I don't dispute his hardnosed play would be a benefit to our team, but I wouldnt call him elite at all. You mention his points would lead the Canucks: 1) He hasnt played like this for a long time. I dont think its any coincidence this is a contract year for him. I bet the moment he gets a new contract his play will decline. He's a me-first guy... not a team guy. 2) To expand on his historical points (which is a far better indicator than his current season) he commonly gets about .6 ppg or something like that. We already have developing players who are capable of that, and its quite a distance from an elite player in scoring. In fact, his prior season points were good for 142nd and 207th. Average that out to about 175th. Considering 30 teams with 3 first line players, thats 90. 2nd line players included thats 180. So in terms of scoring, he's typically bottom of the barrel when it comes to top six players. It could be argued it isnt quite as bad as it seems due to injuries, but that then leads me to... 3) Hes injury prone. Hes never played a full season and I haven't done the math but it appears he misses about 18-20 games a season. This will likely get worse as he ages. The stats I mentioned in #2 also take other players injuries into account. 4) His toi this season is far and above any forward we currently have. His ice time and therefore points would be noticeably lower in Greens system of rolling 4 lines. 5) You know he wont be interested in hometown discounts so he will come at a high salary. 6) Besides all this, I just don't like the guy. The drama that tends to surround him and his showoff antics doesn't embody the kind of player I want to cheer for. Any distraction on or off the ice hurts the team overall so that should be considered a factor imo. Honestly, the only positive is that he's going to be a UFA and can be had for free. Other than that, there are just too many reasons NOT to pick him up. Look. I know why people are high on Kane. He's pretty exciting and brings a lot of grit that we are lacking. Hometown boy is a great story too. I just don't see him as the answer. If we did pick him up the best we could hope for is a situation like Ferland in Calgary. A guy who is clearly less talented than his teammates but has chemistry and the physical game to "work" on the line anyway. That is, however, a statistical rarity. The UFA we need is Tavares. Move Pettersson to the wing.
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I agree that they are worth something, but you gotta be able to play the game. In this day and age of the NHL being high tempo and high skill, there just isn't room on a team for bruisers (even with intangibles) anymore.
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I just don't get why people keep defending him. Guddy is a tough guy. That's it. We can try to look at his draft position and claim he has more to his game than that, but he just simply does not accomplish anything other than that. You know who else hits (albeit not as hard)? Biega. In 21 games, Guddy has 43 hits. (2.05 per game). In 15 games, Biega has 42 (2.8 per game). That's about 38% more hitting. And yes, we all know Gudbranson can hit harder but I'd rather 38% extra (but lighter) hits and at least a tiny bit of offensive ability as opposed to a guy who more often than not kills any momentum down the ice. Add to that the salary he is going to ask for and it's a no-brainer to me to get rid of him. For the record, Del Zotto hits at a pace of 2.3/game, and Edler at a similar rate. Which puts Gudbranson in 4th place for hits thrown per game on our defense. I'm sorry guys - but even if your claim is that we need a hitter on our team like him, he doesn't even do it at the rate which would make that an argument.
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I said "elite"... not "indiscreet".
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...especially when you consider that 3 years ago we had very few nhl-class prospects in the system *at all*. I agree though. I will admit that while I was happy to see the team Benning was building, I was concerned that we didn't have enough high-end talent. I had pegged Baertschi and Horvat to both be 2nd liners and although the jury is still out on that I believe more likely than not that's exactly what they are - so I had no idea where we expected to get the elite talent from that would be necessary to truly help us be a contender. But Benning knew. Boeser was a ridiculous pickup at his draft position and has adapted his game perfectly to the pro level. Pettersson could still falter but it does look like he has elite-level talent and it appears there is a good chance he will be able to translate that to the NHL despite his questionable bulk. (Or lack thereof). So all we need now is a left winger with elite skills and we'd have a #1 line with a skill level to rival most in the NHL. Dahlen might be that guy already - we have to see. I'm super excited to see Pettersson play for us though. Besides Boeser, we haven't see an injection of young talent like this since... what... the Sedins? And they took a couple of years at least to get their careers going, whereas Boeser is a hit right out of the gate. If Pettersson can do the same, we're in for some exciting times.
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Yeah, I'm one of them to be honest. Not so much GAA since that relies heavily in your defense blocking shots, but save %. As good of a measure as it is, it doesn't measure difficulty of shots or frequency of rebounds.
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Well that's an interesting assessment.
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I agree, but it really is too early to tell. Lots of players have looked good at lower leagues but just didn't click in the NHL. With that said, I'd say our prospect pool on forward is darn near complete. Now to focus on d because we're pretty darn lacking back there.
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Eriksson with a sick goal!!
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He does look like a beauty, and since initially watching his highlights I felt he was a special player and have pegged him onto our 1st line since. Everyone needs to keep in mind though that not every player transitions properly to the NHL from lesser leagues - especially ones that play on international sized ice. I don't think it will be a problem for him since he's such a smart player but you never know.... As far as his weight goes, I am not concerned. He's young and has lots of time to put some weight on, and he has the frame to do it. As someone else mentioned, 190 is likely or maybe even 200 at some point. Also as has been mentioned, size isn't really a huge deal anymore; as long as he is strong enough to take the hits and stay on his skates he will be fine. Very excited for this guy.
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That may be true. Ive always worked with the philosophy that your top line should have three top end forwards. But the dominant WCE line has Morrison who simply had good chemistry with Bert and Nazzy and you can see it in action right now in teams like Calgary who put Ferland on their top line when he is clearly the lesser player. Ok.... Fair point. Plus the fact that I do think Dahlen and maybe Goldobin are likely to be top six players and we might be ok as is. Needed high end defensive help though is a no brainer, as you agree. Juolevi is a nice prospect but even if he hits we will still need another high end talent for the 2nd pp unit if nothing else. And since prospects are hit and miss, I'd really like to see two such prospects in the system to be safe.
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Wow - this is pretty much exactly my own thoughts in every respect. I'd say that Horvat and Baertschi should stick together since they've gained good chemistry. I do, however, see them as 2nd line players. To me, Pettersson is a shoe-in for the top center spot, but at this time Dahlen seems to me to be who we are counting on for the left side. I don't see Granlund, Gaudette, Virtanen or even Lind fitting that position. Goldobin... maybe. I wouldn't mind one more high-ceiling prospect for the left in the system. But I feel you are 100% correct on the blueline. We need at least one more high end prospect back there... if not two. To me, that should be Benning's big focus right now - especially since defensemen take longer to develop.
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I think the hate isn't really on Virtanen himself, but more that: 1) He has done little despite being a high draft pick - and part of that seemed to be due to him and his attitude towards what is required to be in this league. 2) A lot of us wanted Nylander to be chosen instead. I think comparing him to Ehlers is unfair since I don't believe many people realized what a great player he would become. I feel Virtanen has really hunkered down and done everything he can to play with the big team and it shows in his game. Like you say, the great thing about a guy like Virtanen is that even if he doesn't reach his potential, he IS still useful for us. Nylander was more of a risk in that regard, and I remember at the time not being completely sold on one or the other because it was still relatively fresh in my mind how our team had been manhandled in recent years so I figured going with the physical player had a lower bust potential. (But yet, I really wanted Nylander's talent) I had high hopes for Virtanen as a 2nd line power forward, but that faded after about a year or two and I revised my expectations to him being a 3rd line player. I maintain that he should indeed be a high end 3rd line player for us at his ceiling... similar in design to Torres - who was a highly needed addition during our cup run. And you know what? That's fine. Any contending team (which I expect us to be in a couple of years) needs players like that, and they actually aren't as easy to find as you'd think.
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I did. And hey... no denying he had a good game. But thats all it was. Good. Lots of our players had a good game. Hell.... Eriksson had a good game. On the flip side, Prior to this Pouliot was...what... 3 points in 14 games?(though he wasn't generally a liability either and played solid d). I will say though that I realize being with a new team and system is challenging so he's done well. Im glad we acquired him, and he has played solid so I don't want people to think I'm ragging on him.... I just don't see the excitement. Again, unless he progresses noticeably past his current ability he really is a guy that fills a spot but not a need. We know this by the debate of where he is on the depth chart. Right now I place him as tied for 6th spot at best or more likely the 7th, and I'm sorry, but on a team with so little blue line scoring that isnt saying much in his favour at this time. Yes hes young and yes he has potential. Both good as well. But unless reaches that potential (and the Pens felt he would not) hes relatively inconsequential to this team. Bow watch him really take this new opportunity to turn the corner with his new team. Id love nothing more.
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Oh, I didn't say that. I am willing to accept that the trade was a good one. I just don't think all this excitement and fanfare is warranted for a guy who imo is a bottom pairing defenseman and has a *potential* of a 2nd pairing guy. If he does turn into a 2nd pairing guy, then we did really really well. But until then, I just see it as a depth trade.
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Biega out for sure, but after that it's gonna be tough. Rotation? I'm sure I'll get ripped for this, but I'm still not convinced about Pouliot. He's done better than I expected, but with a few minor exceptions everything I've seen from him has been pretty average. In those clips from last night, I see decent heads-up play but nothing that should be enough to say things like "I can see now why he was selected high in the first round" (or whatever was said). These are decent, but completely standard plays. The only reason he looks really good to us is because the rest of our defense isn't really that talented so even a good breakout pass makes us sit up and take notice. So I'm happy to see him playing like this and he's great for depth and perhaps still has potential, but so far it's a solid "wait and see" from me at this point. I will be happy to eat crow in a couple of years, but I don't believe he is ever going to be the high-end defenseman we *actually* need. We already have plenty of average guys on the blueline.
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... and his hitting is as good as ever; something 3/4 of that list has difficulty doing at any significant level. Physical play is certainly something we need, given our relative lack of such players. I just wish he would just pick it up a bit. Now he's on pace for just 49 points so he's regressing as the season wears on.
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I dont really see Pettersson as having a low floor. The only major knock on him is his size but he has the frame to build on and will get bigger. In my mind, he's a near surefire top 6 player.
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Yeah I agree. Gaunce is strong on his skates, but doesn't use his size how he should. Certainly doesn't hit anywhere close to the level of Dorsett. Really, I see Burmistrov as being the guy out when Gaunce comes back. Not because he's been horrible, but Gaunce needs to play. If I was coach though, I'd keep Gaunce in Utica for 10 games or so, or less if there is an injury and he could be called up. As far as the Sedins are concerned - if we have room for them (to which I am unsure) I would be ok with them signing another year, but not at 3-3.5. And really, they've made so much money in their career if they did re-sign, I could see them doing it for peanuts just to remain in a mentor role and to show their loyalty to the team once again. With that said, I totally expect them to retire. With the amount of ice time they are getting and the reduced role, I don't think they have any bad feelings about it but I bet it is weighing on them heavily that they just aren't the same out there and just aren't as engaged. Prior to signing I know there was speculation they wanted to go back to Sweden so I'm sure that's still something that is coming up now more than ever for them.
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I'm with you. Jake still can get his timing a bit better, but I think his hitting is generally very good. I'd say overall Jake did what he needed to do to make himself finally relevant in the NHL game. Now it is just a matter of continued improvement and experience. As happy as I am to see his improvement, I still think there is minimal chance he is going to be that elite 2nd line guy we were expecting. Even still, having his skillset and ability to move up and down the lineup is going to end up being a strong key piece of our team going forward.
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I felt that Hutton actually had a lot of excellent tools to be a very effective defenseman. His first year stats mimicked that of some pretty high end defensemen currently in the league. I didn't expect him regress his second year and further still this season. I do agree with you though - I don't believe he's going to continue regressing. There are elements of his game that are clearly improving... scoring just happens not to be one of them right now. I think if he continues trying to play the way he currently is that improvement is inevitable.