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Everything posted by DownUndaCanuck
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I've seen him play, he's got great hustle and always very noticeable but hands of rock, he just doesn't have that finishing ability or massive offensive hockey IQ but is sound defensively. A bit similar to the Mikheyev signing too, Allvin goes out and splashes cash on Toronto's third line winger and he ends up our first line winger. It'll be interesting to see where Beauvillier slots in on our winger-heavy lineup next year. We just lost Mikheyev, Pederson and Bo so obviously he'll play loads this year in our top-6 but he has competition of Kuzmenko, Garland, Mik and Boeser. Don't know if he out-produces any of those guys. I think Tocchet will mix him in there but let's not kid ourselves, he's no 30 goal scorer.
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Sounds like the Canucks have poked around Severson a lot, I know there was a lot of interest for him a few seasons ago when he broke out in NJD. This year he's been very sloppy defensively, almost a bit like Myers, you see him make some bone-headed defensive plays get highlighted by NJD. Luckily they've got such a good system around him, he can make some silly plays defensively and get away with it. Crazy thing is that he's still logging BIG minutes for NJD. Hamilton is obviously a beast for them but I'm surprised to see sometimes Severson logs more minutes than him. 4.1M cap hit at the moment but surely in free agency he could get 6M and he's not even having a great season. I wonder if Allvin will offer him say 5-5.5M. He's not producing much offence, worth around 4-5M but in free agency teams will grasp at him. Only 28 so a 5 year deal is probably what he'll get. Look he's certainly not the best RD we could get (and need), but if he's a freebie you have to consider him. I know there's guys like Mayfield who are tougher defensively and could be had cheaper. My ideal scenario would be to somehow flip Myers and Schenn likely goes as well, and then we snag two top-4 defencemen. Seems like trading for them is impossible but there's loads of good guys in free agency. The big worry is that we just end up with another Myers situation down the line...
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Yep a possible second consecutive Vancouver 1st overall would be nuts, he's blowing up the USHL, scoring more than kids 2-3 years older than him, but of course it's still a long way to go and I think we're just too good a team to bomb hard enough to get the 1st overall, as is NYI. No one really standing out but of course it's such early days, but there is a big strong RD Jiricek around the 9-12th overall spot...
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Surprised to see him play some NHL games this year and quite well too (surprisingly good on the faceoffs). I hope we don't keep rushing him in and back and forth from Abbortsford. Let him play on their top line or 2nd line there for the rest of the year. I think he'll be in the NHL next year for better or for worse, we just don't have a decent 3C option anymore and he'll probably come into training camp better than everyone we have.
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[Proposal] Retool Retool Retool
DownUndaCanuck replied to HKSR's topic in Proposals and Armchair GM'ing
Like the idea of all of them, Winnipeg would be a surprising partner for Miller. We'd have to take some cap back though, he's on a 5M deal for now, Jets have 2M in space right now and a LOT of money coming off the table this off-season so can fit his 8M deal. They don't really have any useless cap though they can send our way. The only money I can see there is Brenden Dillon, an older guy who looks like he's just playing 3rd pairing minutes right now on a 3+M deal for a few years. We'd have to replace it though and give them Schenn back which I'd be happy with. Miller + Schenn for Dillon +++ Then what do we get? Honestly I'd be happy with a prospect or a 1st/2nd round pick. A bit more insane would just be Miller for PLD straight up but you just don't see those trades. Makes more sense for Winnipeg to trade Dillon, get an immediate replacement in Schenn and have Miller around to play alongside PLD for a mad playoff push. That would really put them over the top and next year, they free up a tonne of cap space with PLD leaving. I think we can easily get their first with Miller and Schenn (it'll be a 20-30th overall though). -
I agree, doubt they're picking 12th overall or higher. That being said...Florida holds that spot and that's just 1 point difference in the standings. No matter where NYI finish, the draft lottery could change things a fair bit too. Surely with Bo and his scoring they'll jump up a fair bit (they don't even have a PPG player and most teams have 2), but you never know. Certainly a risky pick to be throwing around given their situation, this was a ballsy gamble by Lou, let's see if it pays off or not. I'd almost prefer the pick this year - we get to rebuild quickly rather than drag it out.
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Bo would be stupid to talk contract extensions before even playing a game with the Islanders. He's still relatively young, wants to play playoff games and win, and has gone to the most intense, competitive division and is on the outside of the playoff race looking in. There must be a sense of "they wanted him real bad so I'll play for them", but signing an 8 year contract with NYI could ruin his career - they're an old team getting older and not a whole lot better, don't have many good young players coming through and are probably peaking now. Lou is acting like a desperate JB. Bo would be wise to play out the season and then discuss contracts with all teams, you hope his agent Morris doesn't just jump at a big shiny number Lou offers. Just aside for me personally I'd rather pay Bo 8x8 than Miller, but obviously these are heavy contracts later on in the players' careers, but I think with the speed and added offence in the league Bo will stay around a 30-40 goal scorer for at least the next 2-3 years. We see so many players in their early to mid 30s having huge career years, I wouldn't be worried about him dipping. Miller is a lot older, got a massive deal and is still scoring at a 70pt clip. Bo's on pace for around 90 points this season and dropped a bit to 51 goal scoring pace, I think he can and will keep it up into his 30s, then probably regress to a 3rd line center around 31-32 which is when the contract really hurts. As for the pick, it's an interesting one. I'd rather we get a top-10 pick in this draft than a top-5 pick in the next. Sounds insane but next year's draft is apparently not very deep. A guy like Fantilli or Carlsson probably goes first overall in the next draft (or maybe even the last few drafts). Would rather load up this year but again it's up to Lou. If they somehow bomb and miss the playoffs this year and end up with say a top-10 pick in this upcoming draft, next year is really going to hurt. I bet a big decision for Lou will be whether they think they can re-sign Horvat or not. If they can't ,boy are they going to suck next year.
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[proposal] Boeser to NJ
DownUndaCanuck replied to Ted Lasso's topic in Proposals and Armchair GM'ing
I doubt they give up on a 7th overall pick so soon. Plus, if we're trading with NJD, we've got to be thinking defence, they've got such a log jam over there they can afford to let two quality top-4 guys walk in free agency and not lose a beat which is insane. Seigenthaler, Severson, Hamilton, Graves kind of make up their top-4 but they've got Nemec and Hughes likely to play next year (if not in the AHL). Severson is still their leading minute man, even if they say they won't re-sign him, and Hamilton is one of the best defenders in the league right now. That leaves a massive BC boy like Bahl sitting and wondering, 22, 6'6, former 2nd round pick, isn't getting a look-in at all I say we go for him. Lekkerimaki for Bahl? I'd do that. Winger for defender who fits our age bracket with Hughes and Petey. It's more of a future trade though. -
The road to an actual future (Proposal/Long Read)
DownUndaCanuck replied to KKnight's topic in Proposals and Armchair GM'ing
I'd rather not trade Demko, then we're going full tank and not just for this and next year but we're going to build a losing culture for the foreseeable future. With Demko in net we still have a chance to provide a chance and a good hockey team on any given night. I think kids coming into the league need that. You can't build a winning culture around a team like Arizona or even Buffalo (who have struggled) by just getting bombed nightly. Losing 1 goal games here and there at least gets the kids in it and the feeling that they can win, and when they eek out the odd moral victory thanks to huge goaltending, it'll do plenty for their development. That's why I say we keep Demko. Rebuild or not, we need our guys coming in to be playing meaningful games and Demko does that for us. Plus, if we miraculously build a solid team in the next couple of seasons, we can talk about playoffs. We have a lot of older guys on our team who other teams should fancy and should trade them before they get past their use-by date. I really think there's a market for Myers, especially if we retain. 2 years left on a 6M deal, if we buy him out he costs us 5M in cap space next year and like 100K the subsequent year. Might as well retain 1 or 2M. Toronto desperately need defence but don't really have cap to give us back Boeser surely can't be too hard to trade, don't know why this is dragging on so long. Surprised to hear they're thinking about Garland as a cap dump but 5M is a lot of cap in today's league for someone who can't score 20 goals. Schenn will be the easiest guy to move. I don't think they'll be able to find a partner for Miller. In all these deals, we should be looking at taking bad cap back, but it'd be nice if it was just 1 or 2 years max otherwise we're in the same situation. Teams who want to get better now and have a bad deal expiring. Guys like Erik Johnson would be perfect, 6M wasted on the Avs blueline. Miller for Johnson would do me just fine, they can throw in a pick if they want but I'd take that. They get their 2C for the next few years to play under McKinnon, Johnson doesn't get extended/retires next year and we free up 8M in cap space. -
Allvin has taken on so many projects during his tenure. Bear, Studnicka, Stillman to name a few. Bear has been the only one who's playing up to his potential. This notion of buying low but players who aren't really cracking their own lineup, hoping they'll grow into better players with us is a bit silly. You've got to give quality to get quality, but this might be the start of say a 3-5 year plan. Don't sugar coat it - Beauvillier is not a prime piece of this trade, he's really just a cap dump, NYI didn't really have anyone else they could afford to throw us in the 4-5M cap range to accommodate for Bo's cap hit. As far as I'm concerned he's a cap dump. Sure, he's a former 1st rounder but he's playing like a 2-3rd rounder. 35ish point player, bottom-6 winger, he's basically a younger less defensively aware Pearson or less offensive Garland for a cap price of in between. Not great, not terrible. He's absolutely a project though - I think if he hits 40+ points and plays well defensively he'll replace Pearson and may get an extended contract. If he plays the same as he has his entire career, he doesn't deserve another contract, or if he does, a price drop to around 2.5-3M. We just can't afford our 3rd line wingers to be getting 4-5M. Raty is a funny one, he's a bit of a project but still oozes potential and is very young. Not many project prospects out there who are 20 years old. He had a great year after his draft, PPG in Finland, then has come over to the AHL and scored at a 0.5PPG which is decent. I just hope we don't mess up this trend of development. It only seems like he's a project after he was expected to go top-3 in the draft and slipped, so I guess he's been a bit of a project ever since he was drafted. The Canucks aren't the best at player development in all fairness but we'll see what happens. Organizationally, we're about to have one of the best draft picks in the last 10-20 years with possibly a top-10 if not top-5 pick in one of the deepest ever drafts full of centers. I doubt we get Bedard (but if we do this conversation is over), but if we get a top-3 pick we have a future elite center who may be better than Petey (Fantilli, Carlsson or obviously Bedard). If we get a top-5/6 pick, we get a very decent top-2 center in Yager, Dvorsky or Smith who can play pretty well as a 2C under Petey. Where Raty and even Klimovich slide in then depends on how good our next pick is. Raty may be a great two-way center at 2C, but if he doesn't produce as much offence as say Will Smith, he'll be a fantastic 3C.
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We wouldn't let him walk, his value would have gone up for desperate teams at the TDL but whatever, glad we got it done I suppose. The only benefit of the timing is that Allvin can really focus on getting rid of some of these over paid wingers now. If he doesn't this season is another fail despite the decent Bo haul.
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People keep talking about Bo getting injured and costing us the trade, he's lost like 30-40 games to injury in the last 9 years. Chances of him having a season ending injury were pretty low but I get the panic. If he did cop a nasty injury though I wonder if we could have negotiated a much cheaper deal, surely he'd be forced to take Allvin's initial offer (it was probably around 7.5M)?
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Wonder what Weekes knows, he said we didn't really shop around the trade, thinks we left value on the table to get the deal done quickly... Happy with the value coming back (but really wanted a defenceman over a center and winger) but I bet Allvin didn't squeeze this trade as much as he could have, he went the conservative route to just get it done. Not the worst thing in the world either, this rebuild needs to get going, but makes you wonder...
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Rienbacher definitely fits the bill the most for us, big strong stay at home RD but he needs a couple of years to cook. As a 20-21 year old we could throw him into our top 4 and maybe alongside a peak 25-26yo Hughes. If we get the 13oa and he's still available we have to snag him but I worry he'll be gone.
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If we're trading Demko this is officially a full rebuild because we're tanking hard and not winning anything for the next 3 years. Keep him around and we've got a stab at the playoffs next year. I've got a sneaky feeling management are doing a stealth tank which I'm all on board for, but even then it'd be nice to keep Demko around until we have at least a young goalie getting groomed (Silovos is way off here).
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Yeh but he's got Allvin written all over him. I like Reinbacher, Gulyayev or Dragicevic who has over a PPG in the WHL - the rest are tricky to predict and compare, playing all over Europe. RD or LD, we need defensive prospects desperately.
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[Discussion] Which Horvat Deal Would you do?
DownUndaCanuck replied to AngryElf's topic in Proposals and Armchair GM'ing
Want quantity ans defence. 3, 2, 1, 4 -
If Horvat is worth a mid round 1st, former 2nd (who realistically is maybe worth a late 1st if we're being optimistic) and a bit of a project cap dump then I'd like to think Boeser is worth a cap dump and a late first. Boeser for Dumba + 2nd? Boeser to CAR for Staal + 1st? Boeser to NJD for Severson? I'd take anything to be honest, use the 6M in cap space to sign a solid UFA defenceman like Gavrikov or Graves
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I doubt we win the lottery pick (my goodness imagine if NYI do) but top-3 is not out of the question, we have good odds for jumping up and snagging an elite center like Fantilli or Carlsson (so in Allvin's case, Carlsson). Then with a 13-15OA pick surely we take a defenceman like Gulyayev, Reinbacher or Sandin-Pellika (again, Allvin says SP). That's not a retool, that's a good rebuild. Petey, Carlsson, Raty at center. Hughes and SP on defence. That's a nice young core to build around. Worst case scenario, we pick in the 5-8th overall spot and get a decent future top-6 center like Smith, Dvorsky or Yager. I doubt they'll end up as elite top line material but will give Raty some competition down the line and leave the Canucks as Petey's show. Snagging Fantilli or Carlsson though would get us that much-desired 1-2 punch of elite centers every team wants and Raty may be one of the better 3Cs in the league then.
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Kind of how like Lou ends up with Bo and Schneider lol. But seriously I think Klimovich and Raty are at very similar places in their development, same team now and they're scoring in the AHL at around the same clip. Should make for some good healthy competition.
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Really hope he flourishes into the top 3 prospect he was touted to be. We haven't had the best luck with developing prospects so I wouldn't mind him in the NHL under Tocchet as early as the end of this season/next year. Is he now our best prospect, better than Lekker or Podz or Rathbone? I'd probably say so. I'd be happy if he ends up a consistent 2nd line two way 60pt center. He doesn't have to become a superstar, just support Petey at 2C.
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(Rumour) 4 teams interested in J.T. Miller
DownUndaCanuck replied to combover's topic in Trades, Rumours, Signings
When you look at teams who need help up front, it's really NYR, Detroit, Carolina, Minnesota, the Avs and the Preds. NJD don't really need him, although they seem interested in Boeser, and they certainly won't have 8M in cap next year so think they're out. NYR have a lot of kids they need to re-sign and don't really have a cap dump they can send us back. Detroit have a bucket of cap space and lots of cap coming off the books but have to re-sign Larin who is probably going to get 8-9M. I doubt Miller's sloppy defence is what Yzerman would want but cap-wise they're one of the few teams that would work. I wonder if we could get away with Miller for Puis Suter/Sundqvist and a 2nd round pick? No way Stevie Y parts with a first rounder this year. Carolina are interesting, they have around 7-8M in old players coming off the books this year and Miller would complement their young centers nicely. Wonder if there's a Miller-for-KK trade out there, I'd do it 1-for-1 even. Heck, I'd do Miller for Staal + 1st or 2nd in a heart-beat and let him walk next year but doubt they trade their captain. They'd be a much better team for it though with an instant 70pt player. Minnesota are interesting, they really need a top-6 scorer. They have Boldy's 6M extension kicking in next year but likely will let Dumba's 6M walk. I'd do Miller for Dumba plus a pick (1st or 2nd? Probably again only get a 2nd). They have just about enough to fit Miller's extension in, and they'll need someone to replace Zuccarello who's playing well out of his contract and age bracket soon. The Avs are a mess with their cap. McKinnon gets a 6M raise next year. They have about 16M coming off the books but will have to sign a lot of players. I wonder if we can do a Miller for Erik Johnson swap and they throw us a 1st or 2nd for the cap dump. They'll be right up against the cap next year so will just have to sign a bunch of cheap <1M guys to their bottom-6, but Miller would look real good at 2C there and give them what they've missed since Kadri left. Nashville don't really have a cap dump for us or the cap space for 8M next year, with so many big ticket forwards already. So there you have it, I think Carolina, Colorado and Minnesota are most likely. There are only a few teams there who have cap dumps who could come back to us, you'd like to get a 1st out of them but I think they'll be really hard to pry off teams. Colorado should take a swing at Miller and give us Johnson and a 1st for him. Obviously we let these cap dumps walk in the off-season, take the 20-32nd overall pick and sign a UFA defenceman in the off-season and a cheaper center.