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Everything posted by Jester13
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I hear what you're saying, and I completely agree that it's not as rewarding as it once was, four decades ago. I think it's a misconception, though, that parents back in the 70s, 80, and even 90s would be owning their own house right away in their 20s. My parents sure weren't able to, and they had to scrimp and save for a handful of years as well in order to get ahead, even as a nurse and bank manager. But what do people expect, that you can spend money on a bunch of luxuries with a modest income and afford a home of any kind? It doesn't really work like that with a modest income - it never has - especially as a single person. Find a significant other and suddenly you're saving 30k a year, and after five years you have 150k saved. And that's kind of part of my point, is that "young people" today think they should be able to have it all, and because they can't then they're f&$#ed compared to past generations. Every generation has had to make sacrifices to get ahead in relation to the times they live in. If a house is too expensive where someone lives, but they reeeeeally want a house, then look towards moving somewhere they can afford one, as countless others have done throughout each generation, such as my parents, and my grandparents, and my brother and his family, and us, and friends, etc. etc. etc. I have friends in Coquitlam and PoCo who started with nice condos and have made lots of money on them, in addition to building equity, and there are lots of communities in the Lower Mainland where this is still possible as great investments, so again it's quite self-defeating to think this way, considering that lots of people are out there making it happen. Is it as possible as a single person on a modest income? Not really, but has it ever been? Not really. Move the Island and you'll see many more opportunities, and enjoy a much more improved lifestyle as well.
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(Rumour) Virtanen on the trade block
Jester13 replied to Wayne Glensky's topic in Trades, Rumours, Signings
I would make that deal in a heartbeat. Seems like a good hockey trade straight up. -
And this is a great way that you've put it. As I've also been saying it another way, I agree that times are different now, but I disagree with the sentiment that "young people are f&%$ed." It's just simply not true that they are. I'm a young person and I'm crushing it with my wife, and we both make modest wages after paying our own way for everything, university and all, and we didn't even start the process until we were 26. Keep telling yourself that there are too many barriers in your way and you'll forever stay stagnant.
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It's even more difficult if you're making 60k a year and you don't have a significant other. If you or others are trying to buy a place alone and making that much per year, then you might want to re-evaluate things. Maybe try investing your money into something more feasible. Remember, the housing market is an investment, not a right. Further, saving 15k/year for five years, alone, turns out to be 75k. Buy the entry level condo and suddenly you're paying less than rent and building equity. Save for another five or ten years, find a significant other, keep living within your means, yada yada. Building your way up is not easy, and it's certainly different than years past, and it takes time and sacrifice, but we don't live in the 70s and 80s anymore. Thinking you are entitled to be able to buy a house all by yourself while making 60k per year is what's out of touch.
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Also, since when should all young people be able to afford a home in their 20s? My parents were in their early 30s before they purchased their first home in the mid-70s. Imagine graduating university at 22 and working and sacrificing and saving for 10 years just how much that young person would have as a downpayment in their early 30s. Imagine how much in their mid-30s.
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I understand that, but my point was showing just how many places are for sale much lower than the poster's claim that you can't find anything less than 600k, and this is a very small area. Go even farther outside of Vancouver and those areas and there are even more places available for much less than they were claiming.
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Condos, apartments, whatever the place is, there are lots of places out there to pay less than rent, build equity, and maybe - likely - even have go up in value over a five year term. Yup, sounds about right. I know a single woman who owns her own condo in Vic West. She bought it a couple of years ago and has already probably made 30 to 40k off it. She makes around 80k a year. There are places out there to make money on the investment and work your way up the property ladder. Is it as easy as 30 years ago? Of course not. Is it possible? Sure is.
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I hope you're not referring to me as a baby boomer haha. Take that 60k/year and find a significant other who also makes the same or more. Keep your expenses down and save as much as much as you can. In only a few years time you should have a sizeable downpayment to enter the market. And when you do enter the market, buy a good investment so that you can make money on it. If your plan is to have a house one day then do it every handful of years and you'll get there. If you're only willing to live where condos start at 600k then you're doing it wrong and don't want to make the necessary sacrifices to make it happen. Do you drive or take public transit? If the former, are you willing to take transit and save all that vehicle expense? How about not paying for streaming services for a few years? Do you make dinner every night with leftovers for lunch the next day, or do you eat out often?
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Yup, times have changed, indeed. My first response was to the comment that "young people are f%$#@ed", which I just simply don't agree with. Here's another similar sentiment that people spread all the time, "Student debt is out of control", or "I don't want to take out student loans." Student loans are an investment in self. Tuition and fees for a degree in BC is around $26,000 for four years. There are awards to apply for, bursaries, work study, co-op(!), etc., and it's very possible to finish with much smaller student debt, and a job through co-op. Yet we also hear about all the barriers to going to school yada yada, or that there are no jobs out there. It's simply not true. The self-defeating mentality is a huge detriment to society.
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I agree with your point. The first outcome is different, but my point is that the trajectory of the investment is still the same. I live in Victoria, so there are some old condo buildings around Greater Victoria for cheap. What's worse, the first outcome of the sacrifice, or not starting the sacrifice in the first place because it's not easy and paying more rent than a mortgage for life?
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Yeah, if you don't put down 20% then you pay mort insurance of around $10k'ish. But people can absolutely get a mort with the minimum 5% for anything below 500k. The stress test is a good thing, as it helps mitigate, at least a little, people who would be stretched too thin to getting something they may not be able to afford. The housing market and industry is absolutely insane, but all of the people I went to uni with can easily afford something. Many know how to make it happen whereas others simply don't have the basic knowledge of how interest rates and mortgages even work in the first place, and yet they still complain about not being able to get ahead.
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A small, dated detached home, but they also had some help from family. And then their next place was nicer, next one nice still, etc. Granted, first homes these days are likely condos, but then the next place is nicer, next one nicer still. So all this goes to show is that getting into the housing market pays off as a solid investment over the years, but many complain because their first home is not their ideal dream home. I know people who could easily buy a three bedroom condo for their family of 4 (two infants) for $350k. Yes, it's old, but their interest+condo fee+property tax for the year turns out to be $1115/month. They won't sacrifice in-suite laundry and not having a yard and a bed for parents to sleep in when they come to visit once a year. Instead they rent a house for$2300/ month. They will spend an extra$72k in a five year term for in-suite laundry. With principal, they could be ahead$120k. And they have complained that they can't afford a house. Anything under 500k can put down the minimum 5%. If someone can't save 20k for a DP and pass the stress test then they shouldn't think they should own a home. As I said earlier in this thread, owning a home is not a right, it's an investment. There are many who know this and many who don't.
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My mom was a nurse and dad a bank manager for their careers, and they still had to sacrifice for around 3 years before they could afford their first home, and they still needed help from their parents. My wife and I had no help, took transit for 10 years while we saved for school, went to school, started saving for our DP, and voila, we own a gorgeous place with a matching vehicle. Does it take longer than years past? Yes, for sure. But the world economy is so different now. There are those who complain, and those who find a way to make it happen for themselves. I've never been the self-defeating type, but I see many people who are, and they all have one thing in common: they never get ahead because they don't think it's possible.
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Nice, good for you guys. Sounds like our path, square footage and all hahaha. Definitely speaking in general, but you do get my drift. But who says a Co.do down payment is 80k? A 400k condo down payment is 20k, so why not start there instead of wanting a detached home right away? Times have changed, but it's all relative on what someone can actually afford and what they're willing to work towards. But many young people do look at their friends or other people in general and wanting a detached home, and they don't even end up starting the process of small sacrifices for big rewards. I speak to such young people in their 20s and they're crying about this, but I keep telling them, "You're in your 20s." It's not easy, but it's certainly possible, as long as they want it bad enough.
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I hear people say this all the time, but I honestly think that sentiment is only proven true for those young people who don't want to sacrifice their wants in order to get ahead. Austerity can see young people save a lot of money year after year, until finally they have a down payment, but I see way too many of said young people who don't want to give up dinners out, alcohol, etc., and instead complain that they can't have their home now. Every generation before us has either had family help or just put in years of sacrifice, but instant gratification has been on the rise for a while now, so...
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Baby boomers are helping family with down payments, lots and lots of young professionals with money, the lower mainland and Island are desirable places to live, foreign buyers, and crazy low rates = the present. We just locked in five years at 1.59, so that says a lot. But the question is whether things will, in fact, burst when the BOC eventually has to try and curb inflation.
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Jim Benning's mid-season press conference
Jester13 replied to -Vintage Canuck-'s topic in Canucks Talk
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(Rumour) Virtanen on the trade block
Jester13 replied to Wayne Glensky's topic in Trades, Rumours, Signings
We've tried everything else, so I vote yes.