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Everything posted by Baggins
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Joni Jurmo? He’s our best prospect in the system, he should make the team
Baggins replied to Odd.'s topic in Canucks Talk
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Is Elias Pettersson Happy In Vancouver? | 32 Thoughts (Sportsnet)
Baggins replied to Canuck You's topic in Canucks Talk
They won the Presidents Cup the season after losing in the finals. Kesler's "attitude" had nothing to do with it. Gillis not scoring a single hit in the draft his entire time here and the team aging out had a lot to do with it though. It took too long to build a team around our best talent, plus crap drafting, created a small window for contention. -
Is Elias Pettersson Happy In Vancouver? | 32 Thoughts (Sportsnet)
Baggins replied to Canuck You's topic in Canucks Talk
I remember Kesler and Bieksa going at it coming off the ice and it continued on the bench. And they were good friends. I'm old enough to remember players dropping the gloves and chucking knuckles in practice and then laughing about it in interviews afterwards. -
Is Elias Pettersson Happy In Vancouver? | 32 Thoughts (Sportsnet)
Baggins replied to Canuck You's topic in Canucks Talk
In your dreams or just mysterious voices in your head? I never once heard him say he wanted out. I did hear him say he wanted to stay in Vancouver several times in interviews before he re-signed though. If he actually wanted out he'd have simply demanded a trade or just waited for free agency. He wouldn't sign a 7 year extension just for giggles. -
[Signing] Islanders re-sign Bo Horvat
Baggins replied to -Vintage Canuck-'s topic in Trades, Rumours, Signings
Miller is a playmaker and discounting how important he is to the powerplay is sticking your head in the sand. Bo has had almost identical PP time per game and a fraction of the result. Horvat is actually the Ryan Kesler in this scenario, the 2nd line C getting 1st unit PP. Special teams are often the difference between winning and losing. Miller is both a good playmaker and a goal scorer, yet oddly he gets stuck with more PK time than Horvat. Bo is a likeable guy but I still believe Miller is the better overall player. Btw, the guy lining up in the defensive zone gets opportunity off the rush if he does his job well. Kesler had 70+ point seasons in the defensive role along with Selke noms. Why do you think Miller was lined up with Petey and Boeser when he arrived here? The season before Miller had 47 pts in 75 games while Horvat had 61 pts in 82 games. Miller spent much of his time 3rd line in a checking role that previous season. So why was Miller given the top line duty over Horvat with the two youngsters? -
[Signing] Islanders re-sign Bo Horvat
Baggins replied to -Vintage Canuck-'s topic in Trades, Rumours, Signings
I'm 50/50 on it. I do believe you need players with that fire in their belly on the team and you don't even need to wear a letter to be a leader. Yzerman is a prime example of the quiet captain that led by example and was highly regarded around the league. Shanahan was a vocal player with some fire. He said Yzerman was a lead by example captain that didn't really say much in the dressing room, but on those occasions when he did speak up everybody listened and took it to heart. Leadership is more than just the captain and a mix of lead by example and some fire is needed on a team. My one knock on Horvat is he doesn't throw his weight around nearly as much as he should. He's always kind of middle of the pack in hitting on the team. But this season he's hitting even less than usual. Petey has more hits per 60 (2.63) played than Horvat (2.17) this season. Players shouldn't chase hits, but when you have size and it's there you need to finish that check. It can lead opposing players to rush their passes and make mistakes. -
[Signing] Islanders re-sign Bo Horvat
Baggins replied to -Vintage Canuck-'s topic in Trades, Rumours, Signings
Actually he often back checks and has "some" emotional outliers. When the team was ravaged by covid who spoke out that the team wasn't healthy enough to resume playing? They got more time from the league. I've never heard Miller "whine". I'd rather a player get angry at teammates than pretend it's all rainbows and unicorns. I'm old enough to remember teammates dropping the gloves and throwing down on each other in practice. Then laughing about it afterwards. I'll take the fire over vanilla kumbaya anytime. -
[Signing] Islanders re-sign Bo Horvat
Baggins replied to -Vintage Canuck-'s topic in Trades, Rumours, Signings
Since Miller arrived.... Miller 251 GP - 92G 169A 261Pts (+5) PP Pts - 103 GW Goals - 14 OT Goals - 6 Hits per 60 minutes 5.59 FO% - 55.0% Average ES Time per Game - 15:33 Average PP Time per game - 3:39 Average PK Time Per Game - 1:29 Fights - 5 Horvat 244 GP - 103G 95A 213Pts (-15) PP Pts - 64 GW Goals - 13 OT Goals - 2 Hits per 60 minutes - 3.11 FO% - 55.9% Average ES Time per Game - 15:27 Average PP Time per game - 3:34 Average PK Time Per Game - 0:55 Fights - 2 Tell us again how little JT does. -
[Signing] Islanders re-sign Bo Horvat
Baggins replied to -Vintage Canuck-'s topic in Trades, Rumours, Signings
For the balance of this season. Big whoop! We got a good return on the deal so I could care less about retaining a little salary for a few months. It still opened cap space for next year when it will really count. Not to mention 8.5 x 8 years was too much. -
[Signing] Islanders re-sign Bo Horvat
Baggins replied to -Vintage Canuck-'s topic in Trades, Rumours, Signings
I wish he'd up his production so he could be traded without retention or added payment. -
[Signing] Islanders re-sign Bo Horvat
Baggins replied to -Vintage Canuck-'s topic in Trades, Rumours, Signings
My opinion, if you're not going to do anything but talk, don't bother being the first guy there. -
[Signing] Islanders re-sign Bo Horvat
Baggins replied to -Vintage Canuck-'s topic in Trades, Rumours, Signings
I still remember last season Podz getting absolutely crushed against the boards in a questionable hit. Bo was closest and first guy there. He didn't even grab the guy by the jersey and push him around. Just stood there and gave him a good talking to. At least Miller will dop the gloves and defend the young guys. -
Joni Jurmo? He’s our best prospect in the system, he should make the team
Baggins replied to Odd.'s topic in Canucks Talk
How often are scouts wrong? Particularly 5th rounders. Scouts are wrong on top 5 and 10 picks. Every player drafted "has promise". It's why they are drafted out of thousands of players each year. Not many in later round see promise axctually come to fruition. It's a crapshoot with a real element of luck. Even moreso as you go deeper into a draft. You never truly know if a players traits and sjkills will translate to the NHL. Look at Linden Vey as an example capping out at a level below the NHL. Great AHL numbers, and goes over to the KHL and finishes top 5 in the league in scoring. But for some reason he just couldn't make that step into the NHL. Great player at a level below though. You could have just as easily said "why" to Forsling at 22 as you did with Clendenning at 22. -
[Signing] Islanders re-sign Bo Horvat
Baggins replied to -Vintage Canuck-'s topic in Trades, Rumours, Signings
How's your math? Horvat - April 5, 1995 Miller - March 14, 1993 Bobo is TWO years younger than Miller and is signed a year longer. Miller will be 37 when his deal runs out and Horvat will be 36 when his does. Miller had a rough start to this season along with Pearson, Boeser, OEL and Burroughs. But there's not a lot of difference between Miller and Bo defensively in general. Where Miller has a distinct edge over Horvat is physical play, agressiveness, and playmaking. Personally I think Miller is the better overall player and will be considerablty better when they're in the final years of their contracts because of the traits he has and Bo lacks. -
[Signing] Islanders re-sign Bo Horvat
Baggins replied to -Vintage Canuck-'s topic in Trades, Rumours, Signings
So if he had signed a reasonable 8 year contract here he would have had to move all over the country for some reason? Term was on the table here. It was about the money. -
Joni Jurmo? He’s our best prospect in the system, he should make the team
Baggins replied to Odd.'s topic in Canucks Talk
We had a comlete lack of young players on the team and nothing worth a "bag of pucks" on the farm. Clendenning had limited NHL experience but had done well in the AHL. A gamble? Just as any prospect is. Any 5th round pick is a longshot to make the NHL and are several years away if they ever do. That trade was a good gamble. It was a good risk on Bennings part, as was Vey, to try and get some young players onto the roster quickly. *Edit* I'll add this - of 30 players selected in the 2014 5th round a whopping 3 have played more 100 NHL games. That's after 8 years. That's why Benning was looking to add some young players via trades. -
Joni Jurmo? He’s our best prospect in the system, he should make the team
Baggins replied to Odd.'s topic in Canucks Talk
Forsling wasn't in Vancouver. He played in Sweden for two seasons after being drafted and was traded to Chicago just 7 months after the draft. Vancouver hadn't even signed him to a contract when he was traded. -
Joni Jurmo? He’s our best prospect in the system, he should make the team
Baggins replied to Odd.'s topic in Canucks Talk
The problem with Forsling is he took too long to get there. Chicago traded him to Carolina. If you don't make to the NHL as a regular before hitting waiver eligible you're not likely to make it with your original team. Florida picked him up off waivers from Carolina. He's not the first to take too long and won't be the last. Look at Chatfield. It took him to 26 to make the NHL after signing two years at the league minimum on a two way contract. Calgary not only exposed Martin St Louis to the expansion draft in 2000, when he wasn't taken by either Columbus or Minny they bought out his contract. With not much interest in the offseason he signed as a ufa with Tampa (the 2nd worst team in the league) and the rest is history. There will always be late bloomers and it's not often they're still with their original team when it finally happens. Next season Rathbone will be waiver elligible. He's highly unlikely to clear waivers considering his AHL numbers. So he's approaching that make it or be traded stage. He may make the NHL, but I'm not sold he'll make the NHL here. -
Why would there be? Horvat has 9 years of pure vanilla pc answers to questions from the press. Horvat may not have "wanted" a trade but it certainly appeared he was willing to walk if he didn't get the money and term he wanted. What I read was he was offered 8 years in the low 7's and was looking for 8 years at 8+. What I find ironic here is many are upset Miller got 8m until 37 and believe it won't age well, yet are upset Horvat was moved when seeking a deal of 8m (or more) that would run until he's 36. I like Bo, I really do. He's a good player and really likeable guy. I have no problem with this trade though. I do think JR wanted both to sign, If he could only keep one I believe he kept the right one. Time will tell on that.
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Kesler didn't have any goals and he's a shooter (41 goals that season tied with Daniel) unlike Henrik who is more a playmaker. Does that make losing his fault? Ehrhoff, Higgins, Salo, and Raymond didn't score goals either. If you watched the series Hank had Chara on him the entire time. He was either cross checking his already injured back or hacking his ankles constantly in the B's end. He followed Hank around like a dog on a bone. As much as I hated his method (there should have been multiple penalty calls) he did a great job on Hank. And you continue to ignore just how good Thomas was in the series even in his losses. Even if Daniel scored a goal every game we'd have needed Lou to play like a Vezina goalie to avoid losing or get real production from Kesler and the depth players as well. You cannot win with one player, nor can you blame one player. The list of injuries simply ran too long and too deep for the "team" to overcome. Particularly when facing a red hot goalie. If I had to credit (blame) one player alone for the Canucks loss/Bruins win, that player would be Thomas.
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Actually he was already playing with the rib injury when Messier gave him a cheap shot. It certainly didn't help his ribs any though. I can't remember who but one of the players talked about everybody being inspired to play hard from hearing Linden scream getting shots for the pain before game 6 and game 7. So I think it actually happened in game 5.
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It was the accumulation of injuries. Not just one. They overcame losing Samuelsson early and Malhotra missing from the playoffs. Played injured - Henrik - back Kesler - shoulder and groin Higgins - broken foot Edler - broken fingers Ehrhoff - shoulder Bieksa - knee Out - Malhotra Raymond Hamhuis Samuelsson Rome (suspended) Samuelsson was a big loss in the second round. Losing Hamhuis in finals was a huge blow. He was our best defensive d-man, top D penalty killer, and contributed offensively as well. Our two offensive d-men were both playing with injuries that effected shooting/passing. Our D was gutted with injuries and Rome's suspension certainly didn't help that. But the flip side to our low total goals, and something that largely goes ignored, is Thomas also set a record for saves in a SC final. So it's not like scoring opportunities weren't there. Thomas was red hot in the finals and kept the Bruins in every game. Against a hot goalie + too many injuries and we still made it to game 7. I still believe if we got there just somewhat healthy we would have beat the B's. After the first two games, and losing Hamhuis, I honestly believed our only real hope of winning was Lou playing like a Vezina goalie. Lou did for 3 of the 7 games. Thomas on the other hand played like a Vezina goalie in all 7. We outshot the Bruins 246 to 225 in the series. We outshot them 37-21 in game 7. Good teams overcome a key injury or two. The Nucks laundry list of injuries was just too long to overcome. There were just too many injuries.
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I'll take the leagues opinion on rules over fans. Fans tend to side with their favorite player regardless and against players they don't like even when legal. Many here argue Rome was innocent. He wasn't as it was a late hit. Both of the hits you are arguing about fall within the rules as written because both were 'into the body' rendering head contact incidental. Both were stopped in their tracks which a good indicator it was into the body. Watch the Player Safety video on hard legal checks. The most obvious tells of an illegal check is the the player being hit spins around and continues forward and the hitting player continues forward on his path. There's examples in the video of that and also legal checks where the head is the principle point of contact.
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Head contact isn't illegal when hitting into the body. It simply becomes incidental to delivering a full body check. Targetting the head, without hitting into the body, is illegal. Rome's hit would have been perfectly legal had it been timely. The Karya hit was almost 7 years before there was a head contact rule leaving head contact irrelevant to the play. But even today it would be a legal hit as it was into the body. Rome was suspended for interference not illegal head contact. Both hits were into the body making head contact incidental to delivering a full body check. Leaving only one question in both cases - was the hit late. There are two questions in illegal head contact. First - was the head the priciple point of contact. Second - was it a hit into the body (full body check). If the answer to both is yes it's a legal body check according to the rules. It's only illegal if the answers are yes to the first and no to the second.