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Everything posted by Provost
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A 1st round pick and three 2nd round picks moved out from a "rebuilding" team.
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Wow... trading way a bunch of high draft picks is what a rebuilding organization looks like? You should tell that to basically everyone else in hockey that think differently. There is a reason why everyone outside the market thinks we lack direction
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Wait so you throw away this year... but the last year that was also truncated by Covid right when the team was in free fall (with a losing record in Feb/March before the season was canceled) is evidence of progression and shouldn’t be thrown away? If you have to massage the data to make up a narrative, that is your issue. We have better young players, and worse veteran players than when Benning took over the reins. That is a pretty logical outcome of consistent put picking near the top of the draft... and having to bribe UFAs to come to a bad team by offering them more money and term than anyone else is. None of that changes that we have been one of the worst teams in the league for years. That once you factor in the other basement dwellers only spending to the cap floor, Benning uses cap space more inefficiently than any of his peers.... even with two of our best players having been on cheap ELCs during a big chunk of that time.
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I have been following the team long before Benning and will be long after (probably a lot less than 5 years). Don’t conflate one GM with the team... that is just objectively wrong. That also doesn’t change the fact you were just making stuff up to invent a false narrative. I guess I just like the team more than you do because I actually want it to be better.
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I clearly said a consistent direction and building towards an identity. There is none of that. Each year Benning does a 180 on what the team needs are... and then he signs players that don’t even fit what he says he wants. The team has no identity. I like the style Green says he wants, but he doesn’t have the horses to do it. Also no steady progression... you have to remove years and make excuses to even get a hint of that. Here are their league finishes since Benning took over; 8th, 28th, 29th, 26th, 23rd, 17th, 24th .616 .457 .421 .445 .494 .565 .446 No one can take any meaningful linear progression out of that unless they are just inventing things and trying to parse things out to tell a false narrative. That is just tiny minor variation and randomness. Out of 7 data points... 4 of them were year over year improvements and 3 of them were year over year declines... including the most recent year. If you want to remove an outlier, it is clearly the truncated bubble year.... not this year when they got the same results that they have gotten for the other 4 previous years.
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Sure they would. They just need to start the season with guys still in the minors and less than a 23 man roster and/or guys like Johnson and Gourde buried ... then put Ferland on LTIR and then fill up the roster again. That one trade allows them to just do normal LTIR maneuvering to easily become cap compliant at the start of the season. LTIR isn’t disastrous like you are suggesting. About a third of teams in the league were operating under LTIR last season. I think you know how it works and are just trying to be contrary for some reason.
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Folks understand that LTIR allows teams To operate over the cap and it doesn’t create actual cap space. What it does is allow is giving Tampa room for players they already have under contract... which they don’t have now. Tampa is at around $88-89 million once they fill out their roster spots. They also have a bunch of players with trade protection. If they trade Killorn they only get down to 84 million in cap obligations and would still need to shed another player that they don’t want to shed. If they trade Killorn and get Ferland or another equivalent LTIR player back... that means they can spend to that $84 million (assuming they maximize the LTIR which shouldn’t be an issue). That is what was talked about. Whether Tampa would end up needing to do that is entirely beside the point. That was the explanation of how the process and LTIR would work to their advantage. Of course teams would rather not be in LTIR if the could. It is simply a matter of that being a lesser evil than losing a player they value or having to spend assets to move committed money off the books... which is the situation they could find themselves if Seattle doesn’t throw them a lifeline.
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I will take random ways to parse up things to hide failure for $1000 Alex! We are worse than when he took over. As the players he was left with started leaving the roster, the team just kept getting worse and worse. We got a couple extra wins a year as our division went from the strongest to the weakest in the league and we got to play terrible teams more often. How about 1 season in the last 6 that the team managed to squeak above .500 It is really pretty hard to be below .500 so consistently when you factor in the loser point from OT means that even losing teams can be above .500 and that mark doesn’t get you close to the playoffs. We have had one of the very worst records in the league during that stretch... and the teams worse than us were often taking on dead cap hits just to hit the cap floor while we were capped out the entire time. That means Benning managed to get the worst value per dollar spent of any of his peers. He isn’t good at his job. We have a way to measure that... they are called wins.
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What benefit would there be for the other team? That would likely cost us more than just offloading Eriksson on his own. The other team loses LTIR space they could use to sign or bring up a replacement player AND they have to absorb $6 million in cap hit for Eriksson who is likely sitting on the bench.
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It doesn’t matter if they currently have LTIR players of their own... once they got Ferland they would have one. This only works in the offseason as they can use one of their existing contracts as the LTIR replacement. During the season it wouldn’t work because they would have to be cap compliant already... now they don’t have to be until the end of training camp.
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You are wrong... they can “buy” LTIR space by taking on a permanent LTIR contract to help exceed the cap and retain players they may otherwise need to buy out or dump. They pick up Ferland (if he was determined to be permanently on LTIR) and then use a guy like Cernak as his “replacement” above the cap. I am not saying they would, but that is how it works and what the benefit is. Ferland for Killorn effectively gains them $8 million in cap space... not just Killorn’s $4.5
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[Signing] Canucks sign Vasili Podkolzin
Provost replied to -Vintage Canuck-'s topic in Trades, Rumours, Signings
Everyone on this board is a fan of the team and loves it. Virtually every argument I end up on in this board is around posters denigrating other fans for their viewpoints. This junior high immature clique mob mentality of “you only belong if you think and act like us” honestly needs to be shelved. A fan can love the team and players and not like the job Benning has done. A fan can love Green but think his assistant coaches need to be replaced. Fan can exist in objective reality and still be hopeful. It was patently obvious who started injecting negativity on this thread and it wasn’t the Vigneault guy... yet you are there with the mob trashing him because you agree with that negativity and not his response. -
[Signing] Canucks sign Vasili Podkolzin
Provost replied to -Vintage Canuck-'s topic in Trades, Rumours, Signings
Nobody said they did. Please cite where I suggested that. I mean you wouldn’t just be making up random stuff to invent an argument. It is the organizational brass that can decide that evaluating young players at the end of a lost season is more important than winning a couple games. Hoping we don’t magically start winning after we get eliminated isn’t the same as saying you think that the players are trying to lose. -
[Signing] Canucks sign Vasili Podkolzin
Provost replied to -Vintage Canuck-'s topic in Trades, Rumours, Signings
Ok, now you are just getting honestly silly. “A higher chance” means a higher chance. Chance = probability not a certainty. Words literally have definitions, there are whole books devoted to explaining that. The people who wanted us to lose a couple more meaningless games at the end of the season simply valued that higher chance more than the outcome of those games. That is about looking forward in a positive way... not about trashing the team. If you think Benning is a good amateur scout... then wanting him to have a higher chance of picking the player he wants seems pretty reasonable? -
[Signing] Canucks sign Vasili Podkolzin
Provost replied to -Vintage Canuck-'s topic in Trades, Rumours, Signings
?? Where did I trash Hoglander? The guy has shown to be a top six contributor? I recall being pleasantly surprised at how well he was doing so soon as I wasn’t sure he would be on the roster last season (back when we all assumed Toffoli was going to be re-signed in that spot). That isn’t a negative take by any stretch. -
[Signing] Canucks sign Vasili Podkolzin
Provost replied to -Vintage Canuck-'s topic in Trades, Rumours, Signings
That doesn’t even make sense... and literally no one said that anyone we could potentially pick was a home run. Please quote what you were referring to because it seems like you made it up to invent a straw man argument. The comments were that it is better to have a higher chance at a lottery ticket than to win a couple of extra meaningless games where we were already eliminated. A higher pick means a better chance of getting a player you want... pretty simple. Power is probably going to be better than whoever is picked at #9-10, that doesn’t seem complicated or controversial to me. -
[Signing] Canucks sign Vasili Podkolzin
Provost replied to -Vintage Canuck-'s topic in Trades, Rumours, Signings
Except I was responding to a quote that literally said it was a home run pick. You are also just predicting the future, no one knows how he is going to turn out. Feel free to be positive and excited... I am too. Slamming other posters because you believe you are really able to tell the future is just inane really. -
[Rumour] Sam Reinhart open to a trade back to West Coast
Provost replied to a topic in Trades, Rumours, Signings
I actually read his comments as wanting to improve right away rather than tear down and rebuild all over again with picks and prospects. It probably mostly depends on whether they can keep Eichel onboard and think they can surround him with different players. Like if we could fashion a deal for Ristolainen and Reinhart for Schmidt, Beagle, and our 1st (assuming we don’t win the lottery), plus maybe we have to throw in either DoPietro or Juolevi... they get a good roster player and then could flip that 1st round pick for a good young NHLer under club control to immediately make over their roster next season. -
[Rumour] Seth Jones to test FA
Provost replied to KariyaSakicAnderson's topic in Trades, Rumours, Signings
No need to trade for the player... if he wants to test free agency then he wants some control over where he goes. Just make the offer when he is a free agent and don’t use assets. -
[Rumour] Sam Reinhart open to a trade back to West Coast
Provost replied to a topic in Trades, Rumours, Signings
Later picks are always better, but you also have to consider the other side... they aren’t going to want to settle for a pick that doesn’t happen for a year that will net them a prospect that “might” help them a further 2 years down the line. A guaranteed #9 overall is a lot more enticing, especially when you have to send money the other way to afford it under the cap. We aren’t even sure that Buffalo wants futures. They might want to do a hockey trade and be moving futures out to improve in the short term. They have been bad so long the fans and other players probably aren’t ready for another full rebuild. -
[Signing] Canucks sign Vasili Podkolzin
Provost replied to -Vintage Canuck-'s topic in Trades, Rumours, Signings
I guess you can’t comprehend the negativity that he was responding to? -
[Rumour] Sam Reinhart open to a trade back to West Coast
Provost replied to a topic in Trades, Rumours, Signings
It does seem to make some sense if we don’t win the lottery in the draft to use the pick as currency. We need cheap ELC players but we also need to start improving quickly before getting more of a reputation for being a mess around the league. Of course, depending on how the market views 1st round picks this year... they could hold less value than normal and it could even make sense to picks up more 1st round picks instead of sending any out. -
[Signing] Canucks sign Vasili Podkolzin
Provost replied to -Vintage Canuck-'s topic in Trades, Rumours, Signings
This prospect hasn’t stepped foot on an NHL rink... so anyone calling it a “home run” has zero evidence to support it. Anyone calling out other posters because of their own invented “home run” narrative is just being ludicrous. We are at least a couple of years before being able to judge the merits of the pick. -
[Signing] Canucks sign Vasili Podkolzin
Provost replied to -Vintage Canuck-'s topic in Trades, Rumours, Signings
I don’t see you being concerned with the posters who were originally being negative that he was responding to... It is legitimately dumb to take a positive story of a signing and use it as a victory lap to take shots at other posters... because apparently managing to sign an RFA absolves Benning of all the other mistakes he made. That was clearly what he was responding to and not the signing itself.