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Canucks to propose building $20-40-million practice rink at False Creek


nitronuts

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Not like a park, swimming pool, rec centre, playground, etc... It's nothing like that.

Yeah, like I said, if the rink is the priority for the City then great, you can make it work. But if the City knows in the NEFC area it needs playgrounds and/or swimming pools and/or water parks and/or whatever ahead of a rink, but it takes this rink, then that's an issue.

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Ya, but if they put in a rec centre instead of a park, it's not the end of the world to alter the plans a little is it?

I can see where developers might try to take advantage of it by trying to pass off things that are almost entirely their own benefit (say a green space with no public access) could cause a problem. The secret is to not let them. If it's a public benefit, then negotiate that some of the money it costs to make it goes towards their public ammentiies fee and you both win. If they jerk you around, tell them to take a walk. If they plan on having a residents only time and have it open to general public the rest of of the time, well, you count a portion as public interest, if that so interests you.

In this example, it should interest the city of Vancouver. I would be doing a happy dance at someone proposing to build public sports facilities!

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Isn't that taking a hard line---what you just said they should stop doing?

You can't have it both ways. You can't play nice and try to get them do what you want while at the same time expecting them to do anything less than make as much money as possible. Nor should you try to stop them, that's their job. But that's why you have to play hardball, if you don't, they just walk all over you. Again, see the mythical Creekside 'park' as a perfect example of that.

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Get the creekside park in writing, or better yet, the land ceded to you ahead of time, to fix that next time.

Only need to take a hard line if they are being unreasonable. A hockey rink that counts as a public benefit isn't unreasonable.

Sometimes you need to take a hardline. You don't ALWAYS need to take a hard line.

Some cities NEVER take a hard line. Vancouver ALWAYS takes a hardline.

Call me crazy, but I would avoid taking a hardline, but do it when needed. It's not rocket science. In fact, it often very easy to come up with ideas that are mutually beneficial. Sometimes they can make more money by helping you out.

I didn't know cities were so inept at negotiating. Maybe hire some developers to work for you if that's the case.

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You make it sound so simple. It isn't. Trust me, I deal with these developers all the time. They are only interested in the bottom line, that's it. Now there's nothing wrong with that, but as the City and on behalf of the public you have to try and squeeze as much out of them as possible because if you don't they won't give anything. So 'negotiations' often turn ugly quick.

I mean define 'unreasonable'. When do nice negotiations turn 'unreasonable'. It's a vast gray area...

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hmmm...personally, we need some more "exciting" and "vibrant" areas in the city. The area around BC Place and GM Place is suppose to grow as an entertainment district. And considering this is the city centre of a major metropolitan area, this shouldn't be just another "peaceful" area like a suburb.

Dragonboat is getting some permanent facilities with the new Creekside Park expansion.

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If the small time rinks are so unrockin' why the public ads trying to get parents to chill out?

Last I checked there was plenty of fun to be had inside the building.

And being right next to transit and dense developement, and with all the existing parking in the area, and the high price of land that you know they would rather toss a tower on, what are the odds it's going to be surrounded by a sea of parking?

Come on.....

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