Peter Zezel Posted November 8, 2010 Share Posted November 8, 2010 <br />Ballard Salo<br />Hamhuis Bieksa<br />Ehrhoff Edler<br /><br />That's one sexy top six going into the p-offs.<br /> ^^Agreed^^ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wallstreetamigo Posted November 8, 2010 Share Posted November 8, 2010 Salo when healthy is our top defencemen bar none. But he will get injured again this season thats almost a for sure. My hope is that he'll be there for playoffs. That being said can we afford to let Bieska go? If he keeps on improving he would be better 6th defencemen than Rome or Alberts. But time will tell and I'm open to losing players for the betterment of our team. The issue is that both Salo and Bieksa cannot fit on the active roster under the salary cap, unless another significant contract gets moved or Salo is out until the end of the regular season (salary cap is not in effect in the playoffs - at least that is my understanding). It is not guaranteed that Salo will get injured again. That is an assumption based on his history. It is certainly possible, but cannot really be stated as a certainty. The same could be said that Bieksa could get another leg cut or Ballard could get another concussion, etc. 3.75 million for a 6th guy is not going to work under the salary cap. That is reality. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barry_Wilkins Posted November 8, 2010 Share Posted November 8, 2010 The funny thing is... If Bieksa completely turns around, scores 20 goals and 80 points, has a +/- of +50, lays out hits every night and quarter backs every powerplay... people wouldn't think "Great, he finally came to be an excellent defenseman and an invaluable member of the team" Oh no. They'd say "His trade value is high! Let's trade him!" The funny thing is that your scenario only comes about in Alice In Wonderland or As You Like It. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bbllpp Posted November 8, 2010 Share Posted November 8, 2010 <br />The issue is that both Salo and Bieksa cannot fit on the active roster under the salary cap, unless another significant contract gets moved or Salo is out until the end of the regular season (salary cap is not in effect in the playoffs - at least that is my understanding).<br /><br />It is not guaranteed that Salo will get injured again. That is an assumption based on his history. It is certainly possible, but cannot really be stated as a certainty. The same could be said that Bieksa could get another leg cut or Ballard could get another concussion, etc.<br /><br />3.75 million for a 6th guy is not going to work under the salary cap. That is reality.<br /> I am a bit worried for Ballard. When I saw him go head first into the boards after that hit from behind I cringed. A concussion is no small matter especially if he has had more than one (not sure if he has). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barry_Wilkins Posted November 8, 2010 Share Posted November 8, 2010 Better a simple mind than a confused one. And hey! I didn't even need the help of an internet pic library to come up with that witticism! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wallstreetamigo Posted November 8, 2010 Share Posted November 8, 2010 2 of Ballards 5 ES GA have come from playing against the 4th line This is because most other teams put together a 4th line that can pot a goal once in awhile rather than the useless junk AV favors on our 4th line. Rypien, Shaefer, etc. At least Glass looks like he might be able to generate something in the right situation. Bolduc, Desbiens, etc. the list goes on. It is pretty bad when I am wishing that MG would sign Ryan Johnson to boost the offense on the 4th line....... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hank&dan Posted November 8, 2010 Share Posted November 8, 2010 Thank god google images can come up with lame comebacks for you. It's obvious you can't muster up the brain power for your own. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bbllpp Posted November 8, 2010 Share Posted November 8, 2010 <br />This is because most other teams put together a 4th line that can pot a goal once in awhile rather than the useless junk AV favors on our 4th line. Rypien, Shaefer, etc. At least Glass looks like he might be able to generate something in the right situation. Bolduc, Desbiens, etc. the list goes on.<br /><br />It is pretty bad when I am wishing that MG would sign Ryan Johnson to boost the offense on the 4th line....... <img src='http://forum.canucks.com/public/style_emoticons/default/wink.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt='' /><br /> lol. I've been thinking about Johnson lately too. Doesn't it just make you sick that Halpern signed for 600k in Montreal. Don't know the details but can't help feeling the Canucks missed the boat on that one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barry_Wilkins Posted November 8, 2010 Share Posted November 8, 2010 Agree with this post from start to finish. The one H&D will most likely comeback at you with is Ballard but he hasn't been impressive at all yet. In fact offensively and defensively I think he has been our worst dman so far. I know he is recovering from surgery and a concussion which is why I am not throwing in the towel and I do believe he can play a lot better. Saying that, if Ballard doesn't get better and Bieksa is traded, him and his $4.2 will be the next target for the trolls like H&D. How many Canucks games with Ballard in have you watched? He's been very capable this year so far. Steady, and I'm especially impressed since he's learning a new system with new players in a new city in a different country. All done with coming off surgery and a concussion. I can only imagine the great things he'll do once all those issues are behind him. The only glaring error I remember him making was his collapse at his own blueline to let a Red Wing into the zone uncontested. FAR steadier than Bieksa defensively, the latter who's consistently been on the 2nd PP unit, scored 20 minutes of ice time, and has 3 assists in 13 games to show for it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hank&dan Posted November 8, 2010 Share Posted November 8, 2010 How many Canucks games with Ballard in have you watched? He's been very capable this year so far. Steady, and I'm especially impressed since he's learning a new system with new players in a new city in a different country. All done with coming off surgery and a concussion. I can only imagine the great things he'll do once all those issues are behind him. The only glaring error I remember him making was his collapse at his own blueline to let a Red Wing into the zone uncontested. FAR steadier than Bieksa defensively, the latter who's consistently been on the 2nd PP unit, scored 20 minutes of ice time, and has 3 assists in 13 games to show for it. Thought I'd add Juice leads the team in giveaways in his many minutes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter Zezel Posted November 8, 2010 Share Posted November 8, 2010 <br />The issue is that both Salo and Bieksa cannot fit on the active roster under the salary cap, unless another significant contract gets moved or Salo is out until the end of the regular season (salary cap is not in effect in the playoffs - at least that is my understanding).<br /><br />It is not guaranteed that Salo will get injured again. That is an assumption based on his history. It is certainly possible, but cannot really be stated as a certainty. The same could be said that Bieksa could get another leg cut or Ballard could get another concussion, etc.<br /><br />3.75 million for a 6th guy is not going to work under the salary cap. That is reality.<br /><br /><br />I could be mistaken here but, don't we just need to lose 108,607 dollars in cap room to fit salo on the roster. According to <a href='http://www.capgeek.com/charts.php?Team=29' class='bbc_url' title='External link' rel='nofollow external'>http://www.capgeek.c...rts.php?Team=29</a> I could be wrong here but if not, by by ryan parent. I retract my statement. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barry_Wilkins Posted November 8, 2010 Share Posted November 8, 2010 Maybe you should look at the +/- before making stupid judgements. Jack McIlhargey was a plus 36 one year. I believe the immortal Jeff Schultz led the league (or close to it) last year. Your point? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bbllpp Posted November 8, 2010 Share Posted November 8, 2010 <br />Thought I'd add Juice leads the team in giveaways in his many minutes<br /> He's also tied for 9th in the league for D-men in take-aways compared to tied for 21st in the league for D-men in give-aways. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sharpshooter Posted November 8, 2010 Share Posted November 8, 2010 As always, you keep ignoring my point that Bieksa was not asked to earn his playing time this season. He was handed that playing time right off the hop and did nothing to earn it in the preseason or early in the year. AV has given Ballard zero opportunity to actually show his worth. At the same time, he handed that opportunity to Bieksa with no expectation that he actually earn it. That is fact. Your argument that ice time is only given to players who earn it is incorrect. I imagine if Ballard was given the opportunity early and Bieksa was not, you would be singing a different tune on this point. And as always, you always speak with hyperbole. I was not ignoring your point...because you didn't make a point specifically saying that Bieksa was either asked or not asked to earn his playing time this season. I never said he wasnt, but unlike you apparently, I recognize that both Bieksa AND Ballard can be important to our PK at the same time. It is not an either-or situation. No point about being asked there. In fact you assert that they both are equal to the task of the PK and so there isn't an earning process taking place to decide one over the other. I would say Ballard has also been better in more games than he he has been worse. A direct, objective comparison between Ballard and Bieksa (stat-wise or otherwise) will not really be possible until AV decides to start giving Ballard a chance to show what he can do. Comparing a guy who gets all the prime ice time to a guy who gets all the leftover shifts is really not fair. That was my point. The fact that at the very least Ballard has been as good as Bieksa defensively with the gross difference in the quality of ice time and situations actually speaks louder than anything. Ah, see that was your point. Not that Bieksa was never asked to earn his minutes...but that Ballard was getting too many sheltered minutes on the third pairing...and you think that means it's "left over" minutes, as opposed to managed minutes for a player who is coming off hip surgery and then a concussion. AV will start to give Ballard more minutes, once he earns them or if there are other injuries. He is not the better defenceman currently, not because he isn't a good defenceman, but because he hasn't earned his way off of the "managed minutes" third pairing....which has nothing to do with Bieksa or Ballard's worth over or under Bieksa's Besides...Juice didn't really have to be asked or not asked...the coach saw fit to compliment his game with a pairing with Hamhuis, because Bieksa has already shown to be an offencive minded dman from his historical play under the same coach. AV doesn't need to evaluate what he already knows. There is no point to be made about asking Juice to earn minutes or even handing out minutes...because he was paired with Alberts for his ability to play with anyone, when paired with Alberts and then with Hammer; for his offencive balance to that pairing. Bieksa is versatile, hostile and mobile...and to think otherwise, is ig'nant denial. And as always....shut up hater. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sharpshooter Posted November 8, 2010 Share Posted November 8, 2010 Better a simple mind than a confused one. And hey! I didn't even need the help of an internet pic library to come up with that witticism! A picture says a thousand words. And for a simple mind that became simply amused, a simple picture seemed simply sufficient. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sharpshooter Posted November 8, 2010 Share Posted November 8, 2010 Thank god google images can come up with lame comebacks for you. It's obvious you can't muster up the brain power for your own. Says the Wizard of Witlessness Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-NucksFan Posted November 8, 2010 Share Posted November 8, 2010 Perhaps Ballard isn't getting quality minutes yet because he is not physically ready to handle them just yet and they are trying to take the cautious route with him. Personally I think once he gets goinghe will benifit the team. When and if Salo comes back it will take him a lot of games to get into game form ( if he does at all ) I'd rather keep Bieksa if he keeps improving and see if Salo is ready for the Play-offs we could use him then for sure considering the way this teams' D drop like flies at that time of the year. I just don't see getting rid of Bieksa for that exact reason, Gillis wanted to be deeper than ever on D because of what's happened in the past at Play-off time. Remeber the good old days a couple years ago when the team was in Toronto and there was a whole row of Canucks fans standing and cheering with letters on their chests spelling out " BIEKSALLENT " ....sigh, good times, lol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marinated.pea Posted November 8, 2010 Share Posted November 8, 2010 I don't understand how y'all don't tire of this back-and-forthness We get it. Some of you like Bieksa. Some of you don't. There's really no point reiterating it again and again or resorting to insulting each other. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bbllpp Posted November 8, 2010 Share Posted November 8, 2010 <br />I don't understand how y'all don't tire of this back-and-forthness <img src='http://forum.canucks.com/public/style_emoticons/default/huh.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt='' /><br /><br />We get it. Some of you like Bieksa. Some of you don't. There's really no point reiterating it again and again or resorting to insulting each other.<br /> But it's so much fun! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hank&dan Posted November 8, 2010 Share Posted November 8, 2010 He's also tied for 9th in the league for D-men in take-aways compared to tied for 21st in the league for D-men in give-aways. Good point. But, how many giveaways (11) resulted in a goal for the other team VS how many takeaways (9) resulted in a goal for the nucks? I think I could take a pretty good stab at the answer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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