Buggernut Posted June 25, 2011 Share Posted June 25, 2011 Yes, a large percentage of Germanys economy is based on exports to other European countries. If they lose purchasing power Germany loses Billions. German banks would fail due to loses in the hundreds of billions as other EU countries default on their debts. Mass devaluation of the Euro ensues...civil unrest follows. The effects would be disastrous here as well. The world is too small a place for it not to affect everyone greatly as trillions of dollars worth of economy just disappears. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WHL rocks Posted June 25, 2011 Share Posted June 25, 2011 Would that be Germany's problem then? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
key2thecup Posted June 25, 2011 Author Share Posted June 25, 2011 German, Greek tensions ignite in war of words It seems old resentments are taking on new life in the blame game over the Greek economic crisis. While Europe has again agreed to bail Greece out with emergency loans, German popular resentment over footing the bill for what they see as lazy, shiftless Greeks is rising. So is Greek fury at Germany, which is seen as the real force behind the European Union and is bleeding Greece dry for its own economic benefit. In Greece, there are cartoons such as the one by Stathis Stavropoulos for the newspaper Elefterotipia, in which a weak and pallid Athena lies exhausted on the ground, while a swollen Valkyrie carrying a German eagle shield sucks on a tube of her blood. The bubble: ''Do you have to take my blood in order to give me just a little milk?'' Even more savagely - and in a swipe that would also upset many Jews - Stavropolous this week drew two Germans in World War II uniform. One says: ''What about those who earn under a thousand euros?'' The other replies, ''They can wear a yellow star.'' But Germans are also claiming victimhood, furious at what they see as Greece's lack of gratitude for their taxpayers' money. On Tuesday the German tabloid Bild ran a picture of a Greek banner calling the German Chancellor, Angela Merkel, and the French President, Nicolas Sarkozy, ''Nazis'', with the yellow stars of the EU flag rearranged into a swastika. ''We pay - still we are abused!'' it said. ''Germans in general don't like us, and in general we don't like them either,'' says the Greek economist Christos Papadas. The pollster Stratos Fanaras, of Metron Analysis, says there has been a marked hardening of attitudes towards Germans in the past 12 months: ''Almost two-thirds believe Germany has not played a constructive role in the crisis. Some feel Germany is trying to force Greece out of the euro zone. ''This is a recent development. Over the last 30 years, German-Greek relationships were very good.'' Alan Posener, the political correspondent for the German centre-right newspaper Welt am Sonntag and one of the nation's most influential bloggers, says there is a long-standing problem with stereotyping that usually simmers beneath the surface. ''There is a view in Germany that Mediterraneans are lazy slobs who basically don't have the German, Teutonic, Prussian, Lutheran work ethic. That applies to the Italians, the Spanish and the Portuguese. There's this old, old prejudice that their problems result from laziness. ''I think that's unfair. I think you have to hold governments responsible, not people. You could say they elected the government but no one has ever told the Greek people the truth about the economy. Papandreou's election platform was giving things to people.'' He says Germans also resent Greece's unwillingness to take the pain of reform at a time when Germans are having to tighten their own belts. Germany joined the EU on the basis that there would be no bailouts, ever, Mr Posener says. Now it is footing much of the bill, at a time when Germany's retiring age has just gone up to 67, but Greece's retiring age ''is absurdly low, around 57''. ''There has been an element of free-riding on the EU here [by Greece]. But part of the reason for the Greek unwillingness to reform is to do with the fact that they have been recovering from fascism. The fascists had a very strong welfare program and democratic governments were too scared to cut back on it.'' In Greece, the strains have revived old bitterness about the German occupation during World War II, with Greeks resenting the fact their former overlords are now economically dominant. Says one welfare worker, ''They killed and starved a million Greeks and now there is a Siemens washing machine in my bathroom. At least it stops them producing weapons.'' Some Greeks argue that the biggest tax evaders there are German companies, that the centre for corruption in Europe is actually the EU in Brussels, and that Germany does not have the moral high ground when it comes to repaying debt. Mr Papadas, a lecturer at the Agricultural University of Athens, says a large loan forced on Greece by Hitler during the war has never been paid back. ''Today it would pay all the debt together, considering interest.'' But Greeks must also take responsibility for their mess, he says: ''It's our fault that we borrowed so much money. It's our fault that we haven't spent this money productively.'' http://www.smh.com.au/world/german-greek-tensions-ignite-in-war-of-words-20110624-1gjjy.html#ixzz1QKD3u1tC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OgS.MVP Posted June 25, 2011 Share Posted June 25, 2011 Its time to let Greeks sort out their own mess. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WHL rocks Posted June 26, 2011 Share Posted June 26, 2011 Hey key2thecup why don't you just post a link to the internet ? LOL That's a lot of reading. One or two articles are doable but I think you got a little carried away. First a 25+ min video and then a all those articles? who's gonna go thru all that. Anyways China's premiere Wen is in Europe with a check book. They will have to step in and write a few cheques to protect their own interests. http://news.xinhuane.../c_13950020.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Offensive Threat Posted June 26, 2011 Share Posted June 26, 2011 Then let them weigh the pros against the cons in piggybacking the likes of Greece and decide accordingly. There's not going to be any Abe Lincoln of the EU to wage war on them if they try to break, is there? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FeStealth Posted June 26, 2011 Share Posted June 26, 2011 If Germany decided to leave the EU there would be no legal or militarily sound option to stop them. Beyond that who would even be able to use a show of force to stop them? England (trying to distance themselves from the EU it seems) has the only real military that could match Germanys in the region. Only Britain and France have serious nuclear capabilities. Germany is in possesion of about 60 B-61 thermonuclear-gravity bombs that are owned by the US but treaties between the US and Germany agree that in times of direct conflict Germany can use them. They would have to be dropped from planes or free flight artillery launched as Germany has no actual missiles to use. Still, in densely packed Europe 60 nukes is a lot. But thats a worst case scenario on an apocalyptic level. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hobble Posted June 26, 2011 Share Posted June 26, 2011 Just relocate Greece to Winnipeg... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WHL rocks Posted June 26, 2011 Share Posted June 26, 2011 Just relocate Greece to Winnipeg... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
German_Canucks_Supporter Posted June 26, 2011 Share Posted June 26, 2011 Germany won't leave the EU! But this is just about all we know for sure right now. With all the money our stupid banks have put into Greece, we would be in massive problems if Greece went bankrupt! But on the other hand, we have no intention to dump any more money into that giant black hole of corruption, mismanagement and ineffective administration. To be honest: I have no idea about what could be the right solution. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Offensive Threat Posted June 27, 2011 Share Posted June 27, 2011 To be honest: I have no idea about what could be the right solution. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buggernut Posted June 27, 2011 Share Posted June 27, 2011 If Germany decided to leave the EU there would be no legal or militarily sound option to stop them. Beyond that who would even be able to use a show of force to stop them? England (trying to distance themselves from the EU it seems) has the only real military that could match Germanys in the region. Only Britain and France have serious nuclear capabilities. Germany is in possesion of about 60 B-61 thermonuclear-gravity bombs that are owned by the US but treaties between the US and Germany agree that in times of direct conflict Germany can use them. They would have to be dropped from planes or free flight artillery launched as Germany has no actual missiles to use. Still, in densely packed Europe 60 nukes is a lot. But thats a worst case scenario on an apocalyptic level. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kyledude Posted June 27, 2011 Share Posted June 27, 2011 The EU is a failing experiment. It's basically 2-3 strong economies propping up a bunch of welfare states. It's completely unsustainable at this rate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
key2thecup Posted June 27, 2011 Author Share Posted June 27, 2011 Germany won't leave the EU! But this is just about all we know for sure right now. With all the money our stupid banks have put into Greece, we would be in massive problems if Greece went bankrupt! But on the other hand, we have no intention to dump any more money into that giant black hole of corruption, mismanagement and ineffective administration. To be honest: I have no idea about what could be the right solution. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
key2thecup Posted June 27, 2011 Author Share Posted June 27, 2011 Anyways China's premiere Wen is in Europe with a check book. They will have to step in and write a few cheques to protect their own interests. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FeStealth Posted June 27, 2011 Share Posted June 27, 2011 Is it me or does China lending money to the EU (and obviously to the US) kinda resemble the Opium trade of way back when? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
German_Canucks_Supporter Posted June 27, 2011 Share Posted June 27, 2011 Hey German assuming your in Germany, how do the mainline people feel taking austerity cuts and paying debts of your fellow EU members? Is the whole EU thing still popular over there? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Coach Posted June 27, 2011 Share Posted June 27, 2011 The slaves of Europe are being groomed....Spain, Portugal and Greece will all be labour for the next 25 years. The Order is coming along. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buggernut Posted June 28, 2011 Share Posted June 28, 2011 The EU is a failing experiment. It's basically 2-3 strong economies propping up a bunch of welfare states. It's completely unsustainable at this rate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DonLever Posted June 29, 2011 Share Posted June 29, 2011 Why is the Greek Conservative Opposition against the austerity measures is beyond me. Aren't conservatives supposed to be fiscally responsible or is that a myth? Or the Greek Conservatives opposing the measures just for the sake of opposition? What do the Greek politcial opposition want anyway? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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