Why the Liberals won and my response to NDP criticism about the oil and gas industry

[Heretic]

Almost as fast as healthcare and faster than education.

So yes, steeply.

[inane]

Oops meant to say inflation.

So not as fast as healthcare but faster than inflation.

Put your own description on it.

[TOMapleLaughs]

It will for our lifetime.

[inane]

Some articles on this:

http://thetyee.ca/News/2009/02/11/SchoolDollars/

http://thetyee.ca/Opinion/2010/04/29/EducationBrownout/

Plus your assertion that the budget is steeply going up...not sure how you can say that given the recent budget from the Libs.

[ronthecivil]

Some articles on this:

http://thetyee.ca/Ne.../SchoolDollars/

http://thetyee.ca/Op...cationBrownout/

Plus your assertion that the budget is steeply going up...not sure how you can say that given the recent budget from the Libs.

[ronthecivil]

Well my wife would like to know where that money is going...

It's not going to the teachers, as they haven't had a raise in like forever and are almost the lowest paid in Canada...

It's not going to more teachers as since Christy was education minister, they have laid off almost 20 teachers per year and not replaced any of them....

It's not going to school supplies as students have to provide their own, including something as basic as kleenex...

It's not's going to technology as BC is way behind Alberta and the rest of Canada when it comes to things like SmartBoards...

It's not going to fix their old computers...my wife says it seems like half of the ones in the schools she taught at this year don't work at all..

So please tell us where all the "steep" budget increases have gone?

[Heretic]

From your own first article...

So the amount of funding has gone up while enrollment dropped.

And while I get the fixed costs of keeping the school open are the same it's more an issue of having to make some hard choices. For example, if you have two half full schools, close one and make a full school. This is done, but not on the scale it needs to be since it's a political time bomb.

Obviously there needs to be some structural changes to how things are done. I would start instead of having a few small schools having much fewer giant schools where children will meet people from a greater range than just those in their neighborhood and the availability of extra programs be they for gifted students or special needs and as you move down the system specialized training including first steps into trades for people do inclined could be implemented.

[inane]

From your own first article...

So the amount of funding has gone up while enrollment dropped.

And while I get the fixed costs of keeping the school open are the same it's more an issue of having to make some hard choices. For example, if you have two half full schools, close one and make a full school. This is done, but not on the scale it needs to be since it's a political time bomb.

Obviously there needs to be some structural changes to how things are done. I would start instead of having a few small schools having much fewer giant schools where children will meet people from a greater range than just those in their neighborhood and the availability of extra programs be they for gifted students or special needs and as you move down the system specialized training including first steps into trades for people do inclined could be implemented.

[inane]

Inane's articles give a decent line of reasoning.

Why do we even have computers for kids at all? Make them bring their own. There's a huge bureaucracy and expense eliminated!

If there's a few poor students that can't afford their own laptop I will be the first to start donating extra computers I end up having. (In fact I already keep my sister and neice supplied with computers. My sister bought the first one on her own just a couple months ago).

[aGENT]

Well my wife would like to know where that money is going...

It's not going to the teachers, as they haven't had a raise in like forever and are almost the lowest paid in Canada...

It's not going to more teachers as since Christy was education minister, they have laid off almost 20 teachers per year and not replaced any of them....

It's not going to school supplies as students have to provide their own, including something as basic as kleenex...

It's not's going to technology as BC is way behind Alberta and the rest of Canada when it comes to things like SmartBoards...

It's not going to fix their old computers...my wife says it seems like half of the ones in the schools she taught at this year don't work at all..

So please tell us where all the "steep" budget increases have gone?

[ahzdeen]

So...it will be okay for your child in grade 3 to walk 30 blocks in Vancouver just so there can be fewer schools?

[inane]

Same problem as health care. The money goes in to the bottomless pit of a broken and poorly administered system.

What we need to have happen is a complete overhaul from top to bottom of both. Reduce the bureaucracy and administrative costs and have funding going more directly to the students/patients. How this wan't made more of an election issue is beyond me.

Do a ~6month study of systems around the world that are highly ranked, pull the good from them, tweak to fit our circumstances, make a plan to implement changes and begin to implement them. Should start bearing fruits withing a couple years.

[Heretic]

Here's some info about the "costs" of big schools vs small schools:

"One of the most effective ways to improve student achievement and curb school violence is to reduce the size of the nation’s schools. Hundreds of studies have found that students who attend small schools outperform those in large schools on every academic measure from grades to test scores. They are less likely to dropout and more likely to attend college."

http://www.ilsr.org/rule/small-schools-vs-big-schools/

"Arguably the big school approach championed by Conant and others has not succeeded in this country, at least if judged by our low graduation rates. In 17 major urban areas, these rates are under 50th, as reported in a 2008 U.S. News and World Report article about the presidential candidates' plans for America's failing schools."

http://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/what-americans-build-and-why/201104/big-school-small-school-does-school-size-matter

"There is remarkable consistency among the research studies that have been reported on school size; smaller is better. To understand these findings one must appreciate the pressing need of children, especially the younger ones, for structure, social stability, and community support. It appears that smaller schools strengthen interpersonal relationships and sense of community. Smaller schools are also associated with stronger parental committment and have higher rates of parental involvement. Here again, it is consistently reported that this improves educational efficacy, no matter what its form (Henderson, 1987). Noting that many rural schools tended to be smaller, researchers asked whether it was the ruralness or the size that was important. Once again it was determined that it is the size that counts (Lindsay, 1982)."

http://pixel.cs.vt.edu/edu/size.html

[aGENT]

There are plenty of studies out there, there's no shortage of rationale or research for a change.

The union and the Province don't want to do that. Both are equally at fault for this dysfunctional system and it's only getting worse.

Just one of many resources/videos : http://www.ted.com/t..._paradigms.html

[inane]

I did not mean that there's a lack of information already available.

I meant more of a study of picking what works best, what's most applicable to us given realities (budget, average incomes, geography etc) that are particular to us. Something that works in Japan may not work here for instance. We shouldn't just blindly emulate. We need to find what works elsewhere, and how to/if it can be made applicable here.

[aGENT]

You're assuming those in power want to change anything, they don't. The Province wants to keep grinding down teachers and education, the unions want to keep the status quo as well.

[inane]

I'm not assuming anything. I'm quite aware neither side truly wants change, merely stating what SHOULD happen IMO.

Have you been possessed by Wet?

[ronthecivil]

Here's some info about the "costs" of big schools vs small schools:

"One of the most effective ways to improve student achievement and curb school violence is to reduce the size of the nation’s schools. Hundreds of studies have found that students who attend small schools outperform those in large schools on every academic measure from grades to test scores. They are less likely to dropout and more likely to attend college."

http://www.ilsr.org/...vs-big-schools/

"Arguably the big school approach championed by Conant and others has not succeeded in this country, at least if judged by our low graduation rates. In 17 major urban areas, these rates are under 50th, as reported in a 2008 U.S. News and World Report article about the presidential candidates' plans for America's failing schools."

http://www.psycholog...ool-size-matter

"There is remarkable consistency among the research studies that have been reported on school size; smaller is better. To understand these findings one must appreciate the pressing need of children, especially the younger ones, for structure, social stability, and community support. It appears that smaller schools strengthen interpersonal relationships and sense of community. Smaller schools are also associated with stronger parental committment and have higher rates of parental involvement. Here again, it is consistently reported that this improves educational efficacy, no matter what its form (Henderson, 1987). Noting that many rural schools tended to be smaller, researchers asked whether it was the ruralness or the size that was important. Once again it was determined that it is the size that counts (Lindsay, 1982)."

http://pixel.cs.vt.edu/edu/size.html

[ronthecivil]

A few poor students? Ron, you are so unaware of the reality of the situation in BC.

Education is the foundation of our society. You're basically advocating for free market private education, and if you can't afford it, well, you'll get what you get.

[inane]

If we can't afford the costs $$$ then the "costs" mean nothing.

If you can't afford a better system find a system you can afford.