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Jake Virtanen | #18 | RW


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6 hours ago, Provost said:

Ok... I can take back my last comment.

 

He looks completely lost again.  

 

 

Roller coaster GIF on GIFER - by Moogujin

 

 

Rollercoaster Jake, Roll the dice Jake.

 

You never know what you're gonna get.

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5 hours ago, Junkyard Dog said:

Roller coaster GIF on GIFER - by Moogujin

 

 

Rollercoaster Jake, Roll the dice Jake.

 

You never know what you're gonna get.

Yep :)

 

it is kind of stunning how different one guy can be from game to game.  The coaches must get so annoyed.

 

Like the first game he really looked like he was keeping up with the play mentally.  He was in the right spot for defensive plays.  
 

The next night he looked like some random guy who had never played a hockey game before.

 

I wonder if they are going to give someone else a try in that spot.  Baertschi would likely be more effective and if he actually had a good stretch of a  few games you could showcase him for a trade.  Some team is going to realize they need some more secondary offence or that one of their prospects isn’t ready and they need another winger.

 

 

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8 hours ago, KyGuy123 said:

Not doing a good job of seizing the opportunity to prove you can stick in a top 6 role.

You are judging that one a two-game sample in a very odd year at best?    Give the guy at least a few more games before you condemn him.    Based upon that two game sample you could draw all sorts of conclusions, good or bad, on almost any player that is not aligned with reality but with Jake people seem to be ready to draw a negative one.

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29 minutes ago, Rob_Zepp said:

You are judging that one a two-game sample in a very odd year at best?    Give the guy at least a few more games before you condemn him.    Based upon that two game sample you could draw all sorts of conclusions, good or bad, on almost any player that is not aligned with reality but with Jake people seem to be ready to draw a negative one.

This isn’t the first time he’s been given a top 6 spot.

 

yes he scored 18 last year in a depth role vs weaker d pairings. 
 

That’s what he is. If he’s on your top 6, you’re not a good team.

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16 minutes ago, Zhukini said:

This isn’t the first time he’s been given a top 6 spot.

 

yes he scored 18 last year in a depth role vs weaker d pairings. 
 

That’s what he is. If he’s on your top 6, you’re not a good team.

See, any other 3rd or 4th line kid would get "he scored 18 goals with lesser minutes and non-offense oriented linemates/situations" but you talk about weaker d pairings.    He is what he is but the kid keeps having to live up to a different bar it seems.   In today's NHL, 18 goals (projected over 20 over a full season) have you in top six or knocking at the door in terms of production for many, many teams.     There is more than just goals to the equation for sure.    

 

I personally don't think he is ready for a top line assignment but I also don't think he isn't suited to a top six role in the right situation.   Canucks may or may not be that situation for him but geez the lack of acknowledgment that this kid is a legit NHL player who will have a long career continues to astound me.   It is like this guy ran over dogs for many people here.

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Just now, Rob_Zepp said:

See, any other 3rd or 4th line kid would get "he scored 18 goals with lesser minutes and non-offense oriented linemates/situations" but you talk about weaker d pairings.    He is what he is but the kid keeps having to live up to a different bar it seems.   In today's NHL, 18 goals (projected over 20 over a full season) have you in top six or knocking at the door in terms of production for many, many teams.     There is more than just goals to the equation for sure.    

 

I personally don't think he is ready for a top line assignment but I also don't think he isn't suited to a top six role in the right situation.   Canucks may or may not be that situation for him but geez the lack of acknowledgment that this kid is a legit NHL player who will have a long career continues to astound me.   It is like this guy ran over dogs for many people here.

If he was 21 or 22, sure 18 goals on the 3rd line is great to project him to be a top 6 forward. 

 

Hell I'm sure he'll be a top 6 forward and pot 25 goals in the East. But if he ever gets close to that in Vancouver from here on in, man I guess I don't know anything about hockey. 

 

We've been waiting 6 years for "Playoff Jake". That's the excuse everyone said to be patient with him, and he checked out harder than I thought would have been possible.

 

 

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2 minutes ago, Zhukini said:

If he was 21 or 22, sure 18 goals on the 3rd line is great to project him to be a top 6 forward. 

 

Hell I'm sure he'll be a top 6 forward and pot 25 goals in the East. But if he ever gets close to that in Vancouver from here on in, man I guess I don't know anything about hockey. 

 

We've been waiting 6 years for "Playoff Jake". That's the excuse everyone said to be patient with him, and he checked out harder than I thought would have been possible.

 

 

The bar you have is more your problem than the reality of the player.    The Canucks have only had a small playoff sample in that time in what could at best be considered an "odd" scenario.    Anyway, you have written him off so that's fine.    Curious why you would then continue to discuss him?

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1 hour ago, Rob_Zepp said:

You are judging that one a two-game sample in a very odd year at best?    Give the guy at least a few more games before you condemn him.    Based upon that two game sample you could draw all sorts of conclusions, good or bad, on almost any player that is not aligned with reality but with Jake people seem to be ready to draw a negative one.

It’s been 6 seasons..... He’s a liability on and off the ice. Definitely has lost faith in his coaching staff and teammates. There is no quick conclusions that are being drawn here as I thought he would pull through! #worstcrewever

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37 minutes ago, Rob_Zepp said:

The bar you have is more your problem than the reality of the player.    The Canucks have only had a small playoff sample in that time in what could at best be considered an "odd" scenario.    Anyway, you have written him off so that's fine.    Curious why you would then continue to discuss him?

What bar exactly is that? I've come to terms with the fact that he's not a physical 3rd liner, who's being pushed up a lineup that has Tyler Motte on one our PP units. 

 

The small sample applies to everyone, lots of players had a great playoffs, lots didn't. Jake didn't. Neither did Myers and Boeser aside from the Minnesota Series. Brock  and Myers have come into this season looking engaged. Has Jake?

 

I cheer for the crest not the namebar. Didn't realize it was a pre requisite to like every player on the roster? Hell I dunno if it's allowed, but I'm not the biggest fan of having both Beagle and Sutter on the roster either. Although in fairness sake they have been the most consistent line through 2 games. 

 

 I'm discussing him because he's a roster player for the time being, I guess we'll see how that goes though. 

 

 

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I do think we need to give him time in the season, but I will say if he doesn't seize the opportunity this season, he might need either 1) to be considered as a bottom 6 forward and play as such or 2) he might need a change of scenery and a reality check. I really want to see him do well, but I also understand the question of "how long do we have to wait?" So much potential but he might also need that "hard love" in my opinion.

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1 hour ago, KyGuy123 said:

Definitely has lost faith in his coaching staff and teammates.

Cool, good inside info.   Any other gems from the locker room you seem to either have bugged or from hanging out with the team?    

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1 hour ago, KyGuy123 said:

Definitely has lost faith in his coaching staff and teammate

What did they do to earn Jake's lack of faith in them?

And how do you know Jake feels this lack of faith in his coaches and teammates?

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19 minutes ago, -AJ- said:

He's quite frankly running out of time. Hoglander has already pushed him out of the top 6 (once Miller returns) and depending on how good Podkolzin is, he may find himself under pressure to hold his 3rd line job too.

Obviously, it's up to Jake. It all boils down to how badly he wants it, and is he willing to pay the price? It's still early this season and to be honest, although he hasn't lit it up, it's not as though he isn't an effective NHL player. 

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2 hours ago, KyGuy123 said:

It’s been 6 seasons..... He’s a liability on and off the ice. Definitely has lost faith in his coaching staff and teammates. There is no quick conclusions that are being drawn here as I thought he would pull through! #worstcrewever

Excellent take! Ive had enough of FAKE Virtanen or should we wait for the playoffs where he really shines lol

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3 hours ago, Rob_Zepp said:

See, any other 3rd or 4th line kid would get "he scored 18 goals with lesser minutes and non-offense oriented linemates/situations" but you talk about weaker d pairings.    He is what he is but the kid keeps having to live up to a different bar it seems.   In today's NHL, 18 goals (projected over 20 over a full season) have you in top six or knocking at the door in terms of production for many, many teams.     There is more than just goals to the equation for sure.    

 

I personally don't think he is ready for a top line assignment but I also don't think he isn't suited to a top six role in the right situation.   Canucks may or may not be that situation for him but geez the lack of acknowledgment that this kid is a legit NHL player who will have a long career continues to astound me.   It is like this guy ran over dogs for many people here.

Just looking at about a 5-6 week stretch in the middle of the season when he went on a heater is really cherry picking things when compared with a huge sample size of rest of his career including the way the rest of his season and his playoffs went.  There is a lot more than just scoring goals, especially if you are allowing just as many goals against and have a ton of defensive warts.  In another post you mentioned that this year's playoffs was too small a sample size.  You take out the same 5 week playoff length from that good statistical blip in the middle of the season where he scored most of his goals... and everything says this guy isn't really much of a player.  Why do you disregard 5 years of play and give lots of weight to a particular 5 weeks?

As for a long career because of scoring 18 goals.  Baertschi scored as many goals and points in a season in as many games, the next year he was again on an even higher PPG pace than before and higher than Jake has ever had... and Baertschi ended up in the minors.  One 18 goal scorer isn't even on the taxi squad and getting a chance.  Over their NHL careers which are a similar number of games... Baertschi has outperformed Jake in basically every metric both offensively and defensively.

One of them keeps getting chances and one isn't in the league.  There isn't a double standard here, at least one that goes against Virtanen.  The only double standard seems to be that former 1st round picks get a whole lot of opportunities.

When players like Eriksson, Roussel, MacEwan, etc keep getting slotted into the lineup ahead of a guy... it is pretty reasonable to detect a lack of trust from the coaching staff.  Maybe Virtanen "gets it" on a next stop in the league like Kassian did... but maybe not.  Maybe he is just a dummy

Edited by Provost
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2 years of coming into camp under coaches standard. Gets called out publicly by the GM after a poor playoffs. After all that he comes in this year without much drive in him again. If anybody needed to come out of the gates flying it was Jake.

I've been one to back this guy up waiting patiently for him to mature. Obviously it's just not going to happen in this city.

He doesn't fit in the top 6 simply because he's not smart enough. Hogs is already passed him & Podz will undoubtedly do the same.
I'm not sure he fits in our bottom 6 either as he's not hungry or gritty enough. He seems to play to not get hurt or scratched or bruised or mess his pretty hair up in anyway. Motter, Macewan, Roussel, Gaudette, even Beagle bring more to the table than Virtanen does. 

His strengths is in his skating when he has open space and his quick hard shot. Just like in junior where he could use that more regularly with his physicality. Unfortunately that kind of space & one dimensional play doesn't translate to the NHL or even AHL as we've seen & his physicality play has pretty much disappeared. 
This guy is not willing to put in the work/hustle, throw the big hits  drive to the net and in your face hockey that he needs to do to be an impact player he could be.  Kind of a pretty boy attitude which isn't working or flying with his team mates, GM, etc.

Address change might be the only thing that wakes him up.  

Just my humble opinion after 9 years of watching him develop. 

PS. Truly still HOPE Jake can prove me wrong, but I'm starting to lose faith just a bit as you can see. 

Edited by CoolCanucklehead
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Green talking to Jake at the beginning of the season:

 

TG: Ok Jake this is it.  Your last chance to prove yourself is this year.

 

JV:  I thought last year was my last chance.

 

Lol.

 

 

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