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Jake Virtanen | #18 | RW


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49 minutes ago, Law of Goalies said:

Can you proofread your post? First part you say that you don't expect him to be a top 6 player but the second part, you disappointed he only has 4 goals as a top 6 player, so what is it buddy? 

 

And also, him being overweight at training camp is so two years ago, stop living in the past. 

 

As another poster said, if he wasn't top 10, this thread wouldn't have been this long. It is not cherry picking when you are ignoring his draft status, it's just appreciating him as a serviceable, middle 6 forward. 

 

 

Serviceable player who shows up every 10 games? He is worth no where near 2.5 for what he brings. 

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3 hours ago, rotiman187 said:

Serviceable player who shows up every 10 games? He is worth no where near 2.5 for what he brings. 

I'm sorry, my bad, I misunderstood you. I thought you are more than a scoreboard and stat sheet watcher, I guess I was wrong. If based on scoreboard and stat sheet, yes, Jake is not worth the 2.5. But if you bothered to watch the actual games, even dating back to last year, you wouldn't be making these comments and he is worth the price tag. 

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14 hours ago, rotiman187 said:

Yes i dont expect him to be a top 6 quality player, but its alright to have  4 goals, 0 assists in 30 games from a top 6 pick right? Don't be suprised now JV isn't in the lineup come next season. 

I sure see a lot of this "top 6", "top 6", nonsense. Have you guys never heard of the concept of "sunk cost"?

 

Once you have acquired assets, it does not matter at all how much you paid for them, because there is nothing at all you can do to change that; all that matters is how much value they have now.

 

What draft picks or other assets we used to acquire Jake or Lind or Jasek or any other player have no bearing whatsoever on their value to the team. 

 

Any post that uses their draft position from years ago to measure their current value is beyond silly.

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3 minutes ago, WeneedLumme said:

I sure see a lot of this "top 6", "top 6", nonsense. Have you guys never heard of the concept of "sunk cost"?

 

Once you have acquired assets, it does not matter at all how much you paid for them, because there is nothing at all you can do to change that; all that matters is how much value they have now.

 

What draft picks or other assets we used to acquire Jake or Lind or Jasek or any other player have no bearing whatsoever on their value to the team. 

 

Any post that uses their draft position from years ago to measure their current value is beyond silly.

unfortunately Jake has been a bit expensive on both ends, his pick position and his current deal. When you look at players making similar money its pretty easy to argue we're not getting full value in comparison: https://www.capfriendly.com/comparables/jake-virtanen-10232

 

But then there are other guys like DeBrusk that are also having down years. 

 

So which is it, a weird off year, or is Jake ultimately an OK 3rd liner? I suspect we've seen peak Jake and its time to accept that or just move on. 

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1 hour ago, WeneedLumme said:

I sure see a lot of this "top 6", "top 6", nonsense. Have you guys never heard of the concept of "sunk cost"?

 

Once you have acquired assets, it does not matter at all how much you paid for them, because there is nothing at all you can do to change that; all that matters is how much value they have now.

 

What draft picks or other assets we used to acquire Jake or Lind or Jasek or any other player have no bearing whatsoever on their value to the team. 

 

Any post that uses their draft position from years ago to measure their current value is beyond silly.

Thanks for the obvious. I know we are stuck with him at the moment, but he is making bare minimum effort to help himself and the team. Youd think being in trade rumors would light a fire under your bum , not JV. 

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58 minutes ago, rotiman187 said:

Thanks for the obvious. I know we are stuck with him at the moment, but he is making bare minimum effort to help himself and the team. Youd think being in trade rumors would light a fire under your bum , not JV. 

Yes it is obvious. Although you seem to have missed the point when you state that "we are stuck with him", which is equally silly. So why do you keep spouting that "top 6 quality, top 6 pick" nonsense?

 

The only reason for whining about Jake's draft position is to take a shot at Benning. If you want to whine about how incompetent the guy who acquired Petey, Huggy, Brock, JT, Schmitt, Hogs, Pods, etc. for us is, maybe you should post it in one of the endless "We hate JB and we always will no matter what he does" threads.

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39 minutes ago, WeneedLumme said:

Yes it is obvious. Although you seem to have missed the point when you state that "we are stuck with him", which is equally silly. So why do you keep spouting that "top 6 quality, top 6 pick" nonsense?

 

The only reason for whining about Jake's draft position is to take a shot at Benning. If you want to whine about how incompetent the guy who acquired Petey, Huggy, Brock, JT, Schmitt, Hogs, Pods, etc. for us is, maybe you should post it in one of the endless "We hate JB and we always will no matter what he does" threads.

Excuse me for wanting a high pick to turn into decent player. You can go and look at my history, i supported JV all the way through until this year.  Funny how some fans such as you protect him so much and in return he comes out every night and floats around. 

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Hearing the Canucks have talked to the Panthers about a possible trade scenario involving Jake Virtanen & one of Florida’s depth D— possibly Markus Nutivaraa. 26 year old D carries 2.7M AAV next season but $3.3M actual dollars. Almost mirrors Virtanen’s $3.4M dollars in 21-22.
 
 


 

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Jake has had a rough start to the season but the last 15 games his confidence has improved and His defensive game has also improved as well.  he doesn't look lost in the D-zone anymore.  His physical  game has also improve (Third in hits).  He is finely having consistency in his game as well.  The hyper focus on Draft position is not realistic.  The draft will always be a bit of a gamble trying to determine what an 18 year old teenager is going to be when he is 25 or 26.  No one gets it right all the time but JB seems to have been right more than he was wrong when it comes to the draft. B)

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13 minutes ago, dpn1 said:

Jake has had a rough start to the season but the last 15 games his confidence has improved and His defensive game has also improved as well.  he doesn't look lost in the D-zone anymore.  His physical  game has also improve (Third in hits).  He is finely having consistency in his game as well.  The hyper focus on Draft position is not realistic.  The draft will always be a bit of a gamble trying to determine what an 18 year old teenager is going to be when he is 25 or 26.  No one gets it right all the time but JB seems to have been right more than he was wrong when it comes to the draft. B)

Even draft position aside, he's been horrible. Doesn't do what a third liner is supposed to do, and I'm not convinced his recently improved form is going to be consistent. If he does better elsewhere it's not because we didn't give him a chance. 

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4 hours ago, 4petesake said:
Hearing the Canucks have talked to the Panthers about a possible trade scenario involving Jake Virtanen & one of Florida’s depth D— possibly Markus Nutivaraa. 26 year old D carries 2.7M AAV next season but $3.3M actual dollars. Almost mirrors Virtanen’s $3.4M dollars in 21-22.
 
 


 

Hind site is crazy. Jake was chosen 6th overall in 2014. Nutivaara was chosen 189th in 2015. Markus has obviously exceeded expectations, and Jake went in the opposite direction. 

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4 hours ago, 4petesake said:
Hearing the Canucks have talked to the Panthers about a possible trade scenario involving Jake Virtanen & one of Florida’s depth D— possibly Markus Nutivaraa. 26 year old D carries 2.7M AAV next season but $3.3M actual dollars. Almost mirrors Virtanen’s $3.4M dollars in 21-22.
 
 


 

Would this really be good value?

 

Id rather keep pushing for Debrusk or Bennett if that’s still possible.

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If JV wasn't a Benning pick, he would have been gone long ago.  

 

Remember Brendan Gaunce?  A late 1st rounder, got size, defensively reliable and with better stats in the AHL compared to Virtanen, thus should have earned a spot on the Canucks more than Jake.  Probably could have easily been retained as a 4th line winger/centre since he already know the Canucks system.  But he was a Gillis pick, thus when he reached RFA, he was gone.  Not saying his career would have been better or whatever, but when you're a prospect from the previous regime, you have minimal leeway.  

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2 minutes ago, DeNiro said:

Would this really be good value?

 

Id rather keep pushing for Debrusk or Bennett if that’s still possible.

I don’t know enough about Nutivaraa to say but he wouldn’t be my preference. If JB wants a defenceman I’d rather someone with a little toughness I think. 

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8 minutes ago, Lancaster said:

If JV wasn't a Benning pick, he would have been gone long ago.  

 

Remember Brendan Gaunce?  A late 1st rounder, got size, defensively reliable and with better stats in the AHL compared to Virtanen, thus should have earned a spot on the Canucks more than Jake.  Probably could have easily been retained as a 4th line winger/centre since he already know the Canucks system.  But he was a Gillis pick, thus when he reached RFA, he was gone.  Not saying his career would have been better or whatever, but when you're a prospect from the previous regime, you have minimal leeway.  

Really. Then why is Gaunce not in the NHL then? What about Horvat? 

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On 3/21/2021 at 8:15 AM, Law of Goalies said:

That's exactly it. Everyone turns a blind eye to other players. Even though Miller has been scoring clutch goals, he has been giving away the puck way too many times (esp with blind passes and up the middle) while when Jake does it once (even if he tries hard to steal it back) people complain and say he is the worst player ever. 

Because Miller can carry a line, make plays and score. If Jake could do it, we would not be complaining but he can't, so we are. Got it?

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Just now, runtzguy said:

Really. Then why is Gaunce not in the NHL then? What about Horvat? 

Horvat isn't a fringe player, Gaunce is.  

Virtanen is barely above a fringe player now.  

 

Think of how many opportunities JV received and how many opportunities Brendan received.  

Effort, discipline and defensive reliability has never been an issue with Gaunce.  

How often has many kept harping about Jake's compete level, his inability to read the play, how he's rarely ever on the ice for key situations?

If it's based on merit, Brendan definitely got the short-end of it.  

 

Gaunce's ceiling and skill level is arguably lower than Jake's, but if Gaunce was acquired or drafted by Benning, he would have been given a longer leash.  

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21 minutes ago, DeNiro said:

Would this really be good value?

 

Id rather keep pushing for Debrusk or Bennett if that’s still possible.

Tbh i don’t know enough to say it’s good value but if he’s a good d man who is steadily improving, at 26 that’s not bad. I think if we do trade him we’d be better off getting a defencemen for him. 

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