Jake Virtanen | #18 | RW

[flickyoursedin]

why not? Both those guys are better than anyone he would play with in the WHL. You know he's not going to magically lose all his skills playing on the 4th line right? Many many young guys start there.

But I'd rather him play over 20 minutes a game on the number 1 line and number 1 power play developing his offence and confidence. Rather than playing like 8 minutes a game in a grinders role.

[baumerman77]

if he plays in the WHL, he will be on a team made up, largely of 17-18 year olds.......so yes, he will he playing alongside 16-18 year olds. Whereas if he's in the NHL, which he is clearly able to handle, he will be playing and practicing on a team with the twins, Hamhuis etc etc. I don't see how, if he has the skills and body to play at that level, that wouldn't be a better place for him to develop.

In the WHL, he's going to destroy some of those kids, physically, and he's going to be on the radar of every ref in the league because he is so physically dominant. I just think going back to Jr is going to be detrimental for him

I do not think the Hitmen are a well run club either and, if I were JB, I wouldn't trust them with the development of one of my prime time assets.

I guess I disagree with you about the current state of his skill. I don't think he has the skill to be anything more than a 4th liner this year. He had a rather unimpressive +1 season offensively only at 1 PPG (even when accounting for poor deployment). Moreover, he didn't show much offense in the AHL with 1 assist and 11 shots in 10 games.

why not? Both those guys are better than anyone he would play with in the WHL. You know he's not going to magically lose all his skills playing on the 4th line right? Many many young guys start there.

Sometimes this actually can negatively affect guys. Remember pretty much 95% of forwards drafted into the NHL were always "the go-to guy" offensively for their teams all through their development. Sometimes asking players to change their style of play and their role can hurt their confidence and change their playing style going forward. I feel power forwards are often rushed into the NHL just because of their size and then they realize that their skill was largely a product of the size gulf they had growing up. And once they reach the NHL, especially if they do it at an early age, that advantage dries up and they search for a new style or just outright falter.

[Georgie Best]

Jake eh keep it up bro, looking sharp out there you got tons of support bud, draw from that good energy

[stawns]

I guess I disagree with you about the current state of his skill. I don't think he has the skill to be anything more than a 4th liner this year. He had a rather unimpressive +1 season offensively only at 1 PPG (even when accounting for poor deployment). Moreover, he didn't show much offense in the AHL with 1 assist and 11 shots in 10 games.

Sometimes this actually can negatively affect guys. Remember pretty much 95% of forwards drafted into the NHL were always "the go-to guy" offensively for their teams all through their development. Sometimes asking players to change their style of play and their role can hurt their confidence and change their playing style going forward. I feel power forwards are often rushed into the NHL just because of their size and then they realize that their skill was largely a product of the size gulf they had growing up. And once they reach the NHL, especially if they do it at an early age, that advantage dries up and they search for a new style or just outright falter.

I get ehat youre saying, but this is their prized pick, theyre not going to force him to be a grinder and forget about him. They will continue to teachl and develop his skills and ease him into those roles. Tons of great players, especially physically mature ones, started out their careers as young guys on the 4th line, Joe Thornton most notably.

He would get at least 10 mins a night qbd the team would be in full control of his development, unlike sending him to Calgary where they will have zero control. You keeping bringing up his play last year........do you honestly want him to be back in the same situation? What if the coach doesnt like him and squashes his game and the Canucks have absolutely no say in it.......would you take that chance in the most critical year of his development when he is more than capable of playing in the NHL full time?

[stawns]

I should add.......normally Im always on the "send him back to Jr" bus, but I dont trust the Calgary organization to do whats best for Virt.

[baumerman77]

I get ehat youre saying, but this is their prized pick, theyre not going to force him to be a grinder and forget about him. They will continue to teachl and develop his skills and ease him into those roles. Tons of great players, especially physically mature ones, started out their careers as young guys on the 4th line, Joe Thornton most notably.

He would get at least 10 mins a night qbd the team would be in full control of his development, unlike sending him to Calgary where they will have zero control. You keeping bringing up his play last year........do you honestly want him to be back in the same situation? What if the coach doesnt like him and squashes his game and the Canucks have absolutely no say in it.......would you take that chance in the most critical year of his development when he is more than capable of playing in the NHL full time?

Well I don't feel that he is "more than capable of playing in the NHL full time and yes I would want him back in that situation in Calgary. It isn't ideal but nevertheless I feel it is the best option. Players get put in bad spots all the time in junior and the really good ones find ways to succeed. The jump between junior and the NHL is huge. If a guy can't dominate juniors it is pointless to try him in a much harder league.

We are putting unreal expectations on him just because he was drafted 6th overall. Honestly, Horvat and McCann probably had better +1 seasons than Virtanen (a case could be made for Gaunce too). Let's not base expectations on him being a high draft pick or him being a home town guy or him being a certain type of player.

[Derp...]

Did you see the game tonight? At least twice I saw him win a puck battle before or right near centre, streak down the wing going wide on the defender, and still get the puck on net?

I think that's pretty much the definition of pushing the puck back.

Only in Vancouver do they poo poo and second guess the home grown power forward that dreamed to be on the Canucks and is doing everything he can to do just that as a 19 year old.

Right so, he can skate down the boards going wide, but that's not really a great option on an organized breakout. controlled zone entires are important in the NHL if you want to be top flight. Just saying he has more to learn when comes to that part of the game, and he's not going to learn it as well in junior most likely.

[stawns]

Well I don't feel that he is "more than capable of playing in the NHL full time and yes I would want him back in that situation in Calgary. It isn't ideal but nevertheless I feel it is the best option. Players get put in bad spots all the time in junior and the really good ones find ways to succeed. The jump between junior and the NHL is huge. If a guy can't dominate juniors it is pointless to try him in a much harder league.

We are putting unreal expectations on him just because he was drafted 6th overall. Honestly, Horvat and McCann probably had better +1 seasons than Virtanen (a case could be made for Gaunce too). Let's not base expectations on him being a high draft pick or him being a home town guy or him being a certain type of player.

I think expecting him to play 10 mins a night, use his body to create space and force the other team to keep their heads up while pitching in 8-10 goals isnt putting too much on his shoulders.

I do, however, think sending him back to Jr where people are going to expect him to absolutely dominate and get 90-100 points is putting too much on him.

Again, normally I would agree sending a 19 year old back to Jr......just not in this case.

[Alflives]

Well I don't feel that he is "more than capable of playing in the NHL full time and yes I would want him back in that situation in Calgary. It isn't ideal but nevertheless I feel it is the best option. Players get put in bad spots all the time in junior and the really good ones find ways to succeed. The jump between junior and the NHL is huge. If a guy can't dominate juniors it is pointless to try him in a much harder league.

We are putting unreal expectations on him just because he was drafted 6th overall. Honestly, Horvat and McCann probably had better +1 seasons than Virtanen (a case could be made for Gaunce too). Let's not base expectations on him being a high draft pick or him being a home town guy or him being a certain type of player.

Don't you think that Judging Jake on only point production is a misrepresentation of his skill Set? Guys like Shinkaruk, Nylander, Vey, and Ehlers I agree points are there, or they bust. Virtanen brings a heck of a lot more to the success of the team. IMO:)

[Realtor Rod]

Don't you think that Judging Jake on only point production is a misrepresentation of his skill Set? Guys like Shinkaruk, Nylander, Vey, and Ehlers I agree points are there, or they bust. Virtanen brings a heck of a lot more to the success of the team. IMO:)

Smarter people than us are making the decisions and hopefully they see what he brings to the table as necessary and rare.

[Alflives]

Smarter people than us are making the decisions and hopefully they see what he brings to the table as necessary and rare.

They are definitely smarter about hockey than all of us on these boards, so I expect Jake will be on our team.

[Realtor Rod]

They are definitely smarter about hockey than all of us on these boards, so I expect Jake will be on our team.

If he isn't, we have to trust their judgement, but I watched Jake quite a few times in Calgary last year and he was not utilized correctly IMO. Hopefully they can get him dealt.

[baumerman77]

Don't you think that Judging Jake on only point production is a misrepresentation of his skill Set? Guys like Shinkaruk, Nylander, Vey, and Ehlers I agree points are there, or they bust. Virtanen brings a heck of a lot more to the success of the team. IMO:)

Well Virtanen is suppose to use his physical tools to produce offensively. That obviously hasn't been the case in his development so far.

I think this entire "if he isn't scoring he's doing other things" narrative is misguided. I've seen him go periods and games without doing anything physical or offensive.

He looks like he'll develop into a Raffi Torres type player. That's not a bad thing but I bet many Canucks fans are hoping for more.

Edited October 1, 2015 by baumerman77

[Alflives]

Well Virtanen is suppose to use his physical tools to produce offensively. That obviously hasn't been the case in his development so far.

I think this entire "if he isn't scoring he's doing other things" narrative is misguided. I've seen him go periods and games without doing anything physical or offensive.

He looks like he'll develop into a Raffi Torres type player. That's not a bad thing but I bet many Canucks fans are hoping for more.

where was Raffi drafted? We're there small skill only players drafted around him who busted?

[Alflives]

He was picked 6th overall, he scored 45 goals that season. We should, and do expect point production at some point. You can find straight grinders in the later rounds.

Not that skate like him, and have his hands and scoring touch. He will score, but that's not important for him now.

[baumerman77]

One issue I think that should be receiving more attention is the amount of minor penalties he takes. Many of the penalties like hooking are really odd. I'd expect I high total from a slow center but not a fast winger. I think the amount of penalties he takes would negate any of the offensive positives he'd bring to the fourth line this year.

Virtanen and Torres have followed a similar development path. They are also very similar stylistically. I think he is the closest NHL comparable. Others say E Kane but I think Kane has more offensive ability.

[WonderTwinPowers]

One issue I think that should be receiving more attention is the amount of minor penalties he takes. Many of the penalties like hooking are really odd. I'd expect I high total from a slow center but not a fast winger. I think the amount of penalties he takes would negate any of the offensive positives he'd bring to the fourth line this year.

Virtanen and Torres have followed a similar development path. They are also very similar stylistically. I think he is the closest NHL comparable. Others say E Kane but I think Kane has more offensive ability.

Kane had 26 points in 66 games his rookie year, I could see Jake putting up roughly that same amount, maybe slightly less. As he gains confidence he'll start to hold on to the puck a little longer, that's what happened to Bo as he gained NHL experience.

[stawns]

One issue I think that should be receiving more attention is the amount of minor penalties he takes. Many of the penalties like hooking are really odd. I'd expect I high total from a slow center but not a fast winger. I think the amount of penalties he takes would negate any of the offensive positives he'd bring to the fourth line this year.

Virtanen and Torres have followed a similar development path. They are also very similar stylistically. I think he is the closest NHL comparable. Others say E Kane but I think Kane has more offensive ability.

While I agree there are similar elements to their games, Virt is much more skilled and agile than Torres was. Hes got his head together more than Torres did......does.

[baumerman77]

Kane had 26 points in 66 games his rookie year, I could see Jake putting up roughly that same amount, maybe slightly less. As he gains confidence he'll start to hold on to the puck a little longer, that's what happened to Bo as he gained NHL experience.

Too late already, Kane did that in his +1 season. In his +2 season he got 43 points. I can't see Virtanen doing that.

[SpeedCanuck]

One issue I think that should be receiving more attention is the amount of minor penalties he takes. Many of the penalties like hooking are really odd. I'd expect I high total from a slow center but not a fast winger. I think the amount of penalties he takes would negate any of the offensive positives he'd bring to the fourth line this year.

Virtanen and Torres have followed a similar development path. They are also very similar stylistically. I think he is the closest NHL comparable. Others say E Kane but I think Kane has more offensive ability.

Just stop it man all you have done is whine about him since he has came here. I agree he has not earned a roster spot right now and honestly has not played his game at all this preseason.

He looks tentative with the puck and rarely wants to skate with it which is what he does best. He does not look as confident as he should be and its really showing. With that being said he is barely 19!!! Look at Getzlaf junior career, everyone develops differently stop trying to say he is or isn't something and just wait before b******* non stop.