BlackBeard Posted November 7, 2016 Share Posted November 7, 2016 he was there during the Utica playoffs run. didn't score any goal though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alflives Posted November 7, 2016 Share Posted November 7, 2016 7 minutes ago, BlackBeard said: he was there during the Utica playoffs run. didn't score any goal though. He played tough, then got injured and sat the series they lost. He was very much missed during that final series. He's a heavy guy, and was generating fear in the other team's d. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlackBeard Posted November 7, 2016 Share Posted November 7, 2016 25 minutes ago, Alflives said: He played tough, then got injured and sat the series they lost. He was very much missed during that final series. He's a heavy guy, and was generating fear in the other team's d. they missed his dump and chase, and hitting game I see. Either way it'll probably have the same result, can't win if you can't score Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NHL97OneTimer Posted November 7, 2016 Share Posted November 7, 2016 He looks like a timid, confused player...........that I blame on WD and management. He also looks like he's not putting his 100%......that he takes the blame for. He's young and there's lots to look for with him. I would love for WD to give him a longer leash and put him on a line with Horvat for 20 games. Then give Horvat the leadership responsibility of helping to push Virt as much as possible. What the hell, these are the years to experiment. If Virt can't be pushed by his teammates, then it's time to send him to the AHL. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snizzle_ Posted November 7, 2016 Share Posted November 7, 2016 41 minutes ago, NHL97OneTimer said: He looks like a timid, confused player...........that I blame on WD and management. He also looks like he's not putting his 100%......that he takes the blame for. He's young and there's lots to look for with him. I would love for WD to give him a longer leash and put him on a line with Horvat for 20 games. Then give Horvat the leadership responsibility of helping to push Virt as much as possible. What the hell, these are the years to experiment. If Virt can't be pushed by his teammates, then it's time to send him to the AHL. I agree with this. He has no intensity, drifts around and doesn't move his feet. If he's on the ice, he goes up the ice and back down then off. We're lucky to see him out there for 30 seconds. He doesn't looked like he's engaged with plays and he's just sitting back and not asserting himself, and that's the worst. As a player who needs yo use his size and speed to generate offence, he's using none of those strengths. Definitely surprised as to where he's gone. I think he could be in very big danger of losing his confidence for the for seeable future. This isn't even two years ago, and look at the way he competed in an AHL playoff game as an 18 year old. He's now 20 and looks worse out there than he does in this game. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leomessi Posted November 7, 2016 Share Posted November 7, 2016 1 hour ago, junglesniper said: I agree with this. He has no intensity, drifts around and doesn't move his feet. If he's on the ice, he goes up the ice and back down then off. We're lucky to see him out there for 30 seconds. He doesn't looked like he's engaged with plays and he's just sitting back and not asserting himself, and that's the worst. As a player who needs yo use his size and speed to generate offence, he's using none of those strengths. Definitely surprised as to where he's gone. I think he could be in very big danger of losing his confidence for the for seeable future. This isn't even two years ago, and look at the way he competed in an AHL playoff game as an 18 year old. He's now 20 and looks worse out there than he does in this game. he's being coached straight out of this league. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
N4ZZY Posted November 7, 2016 Share Posted November 7, 2016 11 hours ago, J.R. said: Have to think he goes down when Rodin is finally healthy. Hopefully that's sooner than later. is rodin actually going to be healthy this year? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thaji Posted November 7, 2016 Share Posted November 7, 2016 I think more than confidence his conditioning is just not up to par. If you look at him his speed is not that special anymore. I think all the weight he added on has actually hurt his agility and separation speed. I want JV to be a more skilled forward and I think if he is a trimmed well conditioned at 210 lbs he would be so effective. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mathew Barzal Posted November 7, 2016 Share Posted November 7, 2016 If this continues past December if I'm Virtanen I tell my agent I want out and demand a trade. At a certain point you can't put the blame on him for not performing because in order to develop he NEEDS consistent experience and exposure to different IN GAME situations. Virtanen seems to me like the type of player who won't learn by watching. He has a very one dimensional style of play and to make it work he needs to make those 90 mistakes in order to find the 10 plays that do work for him. I understand Willie's desire to win now and save his job but that just isn't conducive to Virtanen's development. He needs more minutes, here or in Utica. And he needs it now. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
N4ZZY Posted November 7, 2016 Share Posted November 7, 2016 1 hour ago, Mathew Barzal said: If this continues past December if I'm Virtanen I tell my agent I want out and demand a trade. At a certain point you can't put the blame on him for not performing because in order to develop he NEEDS consistent experience and exposure to different IN GAME situations. Virtanen seems to me like the type of player who won't learn by watching. He has a very one dimensional style of play and to make it work he needs to make those 90 mistakes in order to find the 10 plays that do work for him. I understand Willie's desire to win now and save his job but that just isn't conducive to Virtanen's development. He needs more minutes, here or in Utica. And he needs it now. nothing new being said here. i agree with your thoughts. with the exception of being traded of course. i'd like for him to blossom here in a vancouver sweater as opposed to another one. but i just don't understand Desjardins treatment of Jake. he hasn't been that bad that he deserves the minutes. it's probably cause jake outed or called out Willie. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
terrible.dee Posted November 7, 2016 Share Posted November 7, 2016 4 hours ago, Mathew Barzal said: If this continues past December if I'm Virtanen I tell my agent I want out and demand a trade. He needs more minutes, here or in Utica. And he needs it now. I wouldn't wait another minute he's having his career destroyed right in front of his eyes Demand a trade, demand Utica........No actually, I don't see how he could trust this team ever again, they have shown willful disregard for his and their OWN best interests BTW It's Aqua-man who set this in motion and he's the one to blame, WD has at least been honest, "Its not the try hard league, its the get it done league" it is not WD's job to develop Jake, if WD doesn't win he gets fired, its management's job to manage the assets, Only in our case those decisions are made by the owner Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toews Posted November 7, 2016 Share Posted November 7, 2016 51 minutes ago, terrible.dee said: I wouldn't wait another minute he's having his career destroyed right in front of his eyes Demand a trade, demand Utica........No actually, I don't see how he could trust this team ever again, they have shown willful disregard for his and their OWN best interests BTW It's Aqua-man who set this in motion and he's the one to blame, WD has at least been honest, "Its not the try hard league, its the get it done league" it is not WD's job to develop Jake, if WD doesn't win he gets fired, its management's job to manage the assets, Only in our case those decisions are made by the owner Putting this all on Aquaman absolves those who he has hired to carry out his vision. Why are JB and especially Linden going along with it? Just to collect a paycheck at the end of the month? If so they are doing so by deceiving the fans by claiming that Aquaman does not interfere in the running of this team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
73 Percent Posted November 7, 2016 Share Posted November 7, 2016 1 hour ago, Toews said: Putting this all on Aquaman absolves those who he has hired to carry out his vision. Why are JB and especially Linden going along with it? Just to collect a paycheck at the end of the month? If so they are doing so by deceiving the fans by claiming that Aquaman does not interfere in the running of this team. Can't throw the guy who writes your paychecks under bus. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hairy Kneel Posted November 7, 2016 Share Posted November 7, 2016 (edited) Rudy!Rudy!Rudy! Edited November 7, 2016 by Hairy Kneel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boudrias Posted November 7, 2016 Share Posted November 7, 2016 8 hours ago, Mathew Barzal said: If this continues past December if I'm Virtanen I tell my agent I want out and demand a trade. At a certain point you can't put the blame on him for not performing because in order to develop he NEEDS consistent experience and exposure to different IN GAME situations. Virtanen seems to me like the type of player who won't learn by watching. He has a very one dimensional style of play and to make it work he needs to make those 90 mistakes in order to find the 10 plays that do work for him. I understand Willie's desire to win now and save his job but that just isn't conducive to Virtanen's development. He needs more minutes, here or in Utica. And he needs it now. I kinda agree with you. The decision comes down to what is the proper balance between TOI and the need to earn your time. Management sat Tryamkin out to get him into shape before letting him play. If this sets him up for success then their approach should get full credit. That said Tryamkin is a 4 year pro. Virtanen has been more inclined to 'talk the talk' but not show enough on the ice. Our speculation about Virtanen (and that is what it is) could be totally out to lunch. Most fans equate his success with point production and physical play. We all know that NHL teams use video as a major training aid. Do we know if Canuck coaching is doing just that with Virtanen. TOI of 8-10 minutes combined with practice and video coaching? Willie is the popular whipping boy because he is the head coach. There are 3 assistant coaches on the bench as well. I simply have a hard time rationalizing the idea that Canuck prospects have success or not through the point of view of a head coach alone. This is particularly true in Vancouver where the approach appears very collaborative from the President down to the trainers. Surprisingly enough I suspect Willie will know when he can no longer provide the leadership that adds value to the roster. Back to your point about Virtanen. I do think there will be a decision fairly quickly (within 10 games) about whether to send Jake to Utica. I am all for it. If nothing else it should mature his approach to the game. Unless he has a lingering injury to his shoulder I expected a far more physical game form him on this road trip. I use the Ferlund example of a player who parlayed his aggressive play into a solid ppg game. Virtanen does not have to be the 2nd coming of Todd Bertuzzi to be a solid Canuck contributor. With speed and physicality he can be a ice presence which should compliment his line mates. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
250Integra Posted November 7, 2016 Share Posted November 7, 2016 (edited) The thing is, you make the best out of the opportunities you're given. He can be an effective player whether he plays 6 minutes a game or 16 minutes a game. The problem is, he is not showing that he deserves more ice time. Most of the time when he's on the ice, he's either coasting or giving the puck away. I don't know if he feels "entitled" due to being a top ten draft pick, but when you compare him to a Kesler, Hansen, or Burrows when they first broke into the league, they did everything possible to gain more ice time. Right now, I feel he wants to be a celebrity more than an NHL hockey player. Edited November 7, 2016 by 250Integra 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Where'd Luongo? Posted November 7, 2016 Share Posted November 7, 2016 Virtanen needs to go to Utica. Why? One great example is Subban. Think about what Subban's life would be like if he was currently on the Canucks. He would never get to play, WD would constantly criticize him for all his mistakes, he would not be allowed to be creative. Instead, he's on Utica where Green allows him to be the player he wants to be, and enhances that with guidance. He doesn't tell him to change how he plays, he tells him how to play that part more effectively without hindering other aspects of the game. The result? Subban lights it up in the AHL. If Virtanen could get down there, I am confident that Green would give him 1st line minutes and get him playing that energetic, hard hitting, shoot first game that Virtanen needs to do to succeed. He wouldn't tell him to hold off on hits, he wouldn't bench him for making a mistake, he would encourage him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlackBeard Posted November 7, 2016 Share Posted November 7, 2016 if he has skill he should be composed and confident with the puck. but he's the opposite with it most of the time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mathew Barzal Posted November 7, 2016 Share Posted November 7, 2016 I wish we had a Jake cam so we could see his facial expressions right now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alflives Posted November 7, 2016 Share Posted November 7, 2016 32 minutes ago, BlackBeard said: if he has skill he should be composed and confident with the puck. but he's the opposite with it most of the time. That's because the kid is too worried to make a mistake. That's a coaching issue. He makes even one mistake, and turns over a puck, and his rear is stapled to the bench. He needs to be ENCOURAGED to play freely, not discouraged by every shift. WD must instill confidence in his players. That's a coache's job, no? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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