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Jake Virtanen | #18 | RW


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46 minutes ago, shiznak said:

I don't understand why management and the coaching staff are so hell-bent on developing Jake into a two-way player. He's never been that great in the defensive zone and probably never will be. It's like trying to teach a cat, dog tricks. It's less likely he's going to improve, no matter how much they try to teach him. Thus, hindering his offensive skillset and confidence to be successful in the NHL. They need to forget this whole 200-foot game, let him make his mistakes, and give him every opportunity to play in the offensive zone.

I'd say that it's because you'd have to be pretty gifted offensively to be suspect defensively in the NHL and get away with it. Jake is no Patrick Kane, Backstrom or Ovie. He will have to carry his weight defensively in the NHL at least to an extent if he wants to have a career, just like most other players. 

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1 hour ago, guntrix said:

If this thread were dedicated to reporting on his progress, it'd be empty. Not just because there's so few of us who actually watch the Utica games but because he's actually regressed play-wise. 

 

Forums are about expressing views and opinions about said topics and that's pretty much what makes them entertaining. It's no coincidence that this thread and the Burrows thread have been two of the hottest threads on this forum since their inception. 

Sometimes I hate myself, but I'm sure I hate you more...

Edited by canuckledraggin
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8 minutes ago, guntrix said:

I'd say that it's because you'd have to be pretty gifted offensively to be suspect defensively in the NHL and get away with it. Jake is no Patrick Kane, Backstrom or Ovie. He will have to carry his weight defensively in the NHL at least to an extent if he wants to have a career, just like most other players. 

Imagine if Anaheim went through the same process with Perry. I don't think he'd be the same player he is today, if that happened.

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30 minutes ago, iinatcc said:

Maybe the felt after further evaluation he doesn't have much of a offensive upside?

Could be, but how would they know if they barely used him in offensive situations, last year. 

Edited by shiznak
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22 minutes ago, The 5th Line said:

I still have faith in this kid but I can't explain my theory without coming off like a huge D-bag and taking mass amounts of flak from other posters...which is literally what happens every time I post on this site anyways but for now I'll keep this particular comment to myself :)  It's pretty juicy though and I know some of you would really love to hear it.  Mwuahaha

Stay this way. Let's enjoy this ride as Canucks fans. 

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5 hours ago, JamesB said:

It is said a lot but it is not true. There was a fairly detailed analysis of this point in another thread in the recent past that, in my view, was pretty much definitive. Also for what it is worth I have downloaded the entire NHL.com and done quite a few checks on this point. It is not obvious how you define "power forwards" for the purposes of statistical analysis but if we say they tend to be big wingers who make more hits than average and/or take more penalties than average (or any other permutation that we think might correspond to being a power forward) those guys do not develop any later than other forwards.

 

Some guys are late bloomers but most high end forwards (power forwards or small playmakers or whatever) show more than Jake has by their draft+3 year. Body type has nothing to do with it. We just have to hope that Jake is a late bloomer. 

Some guys are late bloomers? List some names. 

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10 hours ago, Warhippy said:

Just gonna leave this here :bigblush:

That thread is damn near satire at this point... People are tearing a 20 year old apart, and some of the posts do nothing but stroke the poster's ego.  I am strting to see why other team's and their fanbase can't stand us... I don't like us

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1 hour ago, NEON.KNEE said:

That thread is damn near satire at this point... People are tearing a 20 year old apart, and some of the posts do nothing but stroke the poster's ego.  I am strting to see why other team's and their fanbase can't stand us... I don't like us

Yep many fans here should leave the kid alone. He's working to become better, he wants to be better. Green seems to get the best out of our young guys and since there's no rush lets give him a break already. When we drafted him his main criticism was he didn't see the ice at an NHL level yet. He has lots of time. If he's still playing like this at 24 then go ahead and call him a bust. But ffs the kid went through shoulder surgery. I'd rather support him since he's dominated physically at every level he's played at. If he can become the first line power forward scoring winger he has the potential to be then we have something unique that not every team gets to have. And oh man he'll be worth it. Patience.

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6 minutes ago, RogersTowell said:

Cam Neely.  Need more?  Pay attention to the game and it's history.

Neely had 31 points with the .Canucks as a 19 year old, and he did that in 60 games.  So he was a .5 ppg guy, and tough as nails too.  

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11 hours ago, suitup said:

Just a guess but were you referring to my post where I gathered stastical data on the first 3 years of every PWF or PWF-like players' progress and their eventual point production value?

Yes I am. Sorry for not citing your posts specifically. I could remember where the posts were but, prompted by the above message,  I searched and now realize that your posts were on December 27 in this thread. There were some other posts also around that time. And the issue has come up before. I think the evidence or, more accurately, lack of evidence for slower development of power forwards is pretty clear.

 

Thanks,

 

 

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1 hour ago, Alflives said:

Neely had 31 points with the .Canucks as a 19 year old, and he did that in 60 games.  So he was a .5 ppg guy, and tough as nails too.  

Messier had 36 points as a rookie, this fan base would have traded him for a bag of pucks in the ridiculously high scoring 80's like they did Neely when 31 points even as a rookie for his draft position was considered pathetic in an era where there were a dozen or more players  that scored better than 100+ points in 1984 alone and it ONLY increased from there with 9 players recording 50+ goal seasons 

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2 minutes ago, Warhippy said:

Messier had 36 points as a rookie, this fan base would have traded him for a bag of pucks in the ridiculously high scoring 80's like they did Neely when 31 points even as a rookie for his draft position was considered pathetic in an era where there were a dozen or more players  that scored better than 100+ points in 1984 alone and it ONLY increased from there with 9 players recording 50+ goal seasons 

yeah. foolishness to trade away such young players....unless they demonstrate otherwise (i.e. Daigle)

 

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3 hours ago, Tystick said:

Yep many fans here should leave the kid alone. He's working to become better, he wants to be better. Green seems to get the best out of our young guys and since there's no rush lets give him a break already. When we drafted him his main criticism was he didn't see the ice at an NHL level yet. He has lots of time. If he's still playing like this at 24 then go ahead and call him a bust. But ffs the kid went through shoulder surgery. I'd rather support him since he's dominated physically at every level he's played at. If he can become the first line power forward scoring winger he has the potential to be then we have something unique that not every team gets to have. And oh man he'll be worth it. Patience.

might as well just keep him at that point, and give him a bottom six role. 

when did Bert start to break out offensively? 25? 26? 

 

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1 minute ago, N4ZZY said:

yeah. foolishness to trade away such young players....unless they demonstrate otherwise (i.e. Daigle)

 

LOL this fan base would have LOVED Daigle though, 88 points in his first 131 games.

 

OMG he's the next captain sign em up JB :lol:

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