Jake Virtanen | #18 | RW

[DeNiro]

Nylander offers a whole other level of skill. While his size is an area of concern, I feel like that is being overstated, especially when he's doing well in Modo against full grown men.

I'm also cautious about criticizing JV this early in the season but I find it completely clueless to resort to criticizing Nylander in JV's defence when he's ripping it up in a better league.

Who's criticizing him?

He's not big and he doesn't play with an edge. Those are facts.

I said nothing about his skill, and nothing that isn't true.

My point is, it all comes down to what type of player we want. Backstrom had as many points as Benn last season, but who would you want to compete in the Western conference if you were building a team? Even though Backstrom is the more skilled player, Benn brings more to the table in terms of being able to compete with the big Western teams.

[guntrix]

Who's criticizing him?

He's not big and he doesn't play with an edge. Those are facts.

I said nothing about his skill, and nothing that isn't true.

My point is, it all comes down to what type of player we want. Backstrom had as many points as Benn last season, but who would you want to compete in the Western conference if you were building a team? Even though Backstrom is the more skilled player, Benn brings more to the table in terms of being able to compete with the big Western teams.

If it were up to CDC, we would have ended up with Ritchie just because "the guy is big and has some skill."

Drafting to size is heavily overstated on here. Your Backstrom-Benn comparison is heavily flawed because Benn in simply the better player. On top of his size, his points per game ratio is noticeably better than Backstrom.

In regards to JV and Nylander, Nylander always had a LOT more skill than JV. Now, he's got 14 points in 10 games in MODO, all while JV is finding the ropes in the WHL.

Let's be grounded here and admit that as of now, Nylander is the better prospect on stats alone. Size by itself does not give JV the advantage nor does it automatically make Nylander the inferior player, even though we're a Western Conference team.

As for the 'edge,' Nylander is a playmaker and JV is more of a power forward/goalscorer (even if his assists tally is larger so far this season). That explains why JV understandably plays with more edge.

[DeNiro]

If it were up to CDC, we would have ended up with Ritchie just because "the guy is big and has some skill."

Drafting to size is heavily overstated on here. Your Backstrom-Benn comparison is heavily flawed because Benn in simply the better player. On top of his size, his points per game ratio is noticeably better than Backstrom.

In regards to JV and Nylander, Nylander always had a LOT more skill than JV. Now, he's got 14 points in 10 games in MODO, all while JV is finding the ropes in the WHL.

Let's be grounded here and admit that as of now, Nylander is the better prospect on stats alone. Size by itself does not give JV the advantage nor does it automatically make Nylander the inferior player, even though we're a Western Conference team.

As for the 'edge,' Nylander is a playmaker and JV is more of a power forward/goalscorer (even if his assists tally is larger so far this season). That explains why JV understandably plays with more edge.

Well you completely contradicted yourself with your argument. You make one claim that Nylander is a better player because of his stats, yet say that Benn is a better player than Backstrom despite Backstrom having far superior numbers to Benn over his career. (including a 101 point season).

Again, you can't seem to separate skill with an overall game. Your only basis that Nylander is better is because of stats, yet I doubt you've watched him play a single game in the SHL. I've seen some of the assists he's getting over there, and they're not exactly all star plays.

Yes, Virtanen is putting up average numbers after coming back from surgery, but in almost every game he's making an impact through his physical play. That's the difference between a player who just puts up points, and one who can contribute when they're not putting up points.

There's no doubt that Nylander has more raw skill, but skill alone doesn't equal being better. I'm glad Benning realizes that.

Edited November 18, 2014 by DeNiro

[Herberts Vasiljevs]

This is the Jake Virtanen thread. Not the William Nylander thread.

[DeNiro]

This is the Jake Virtanen thread. Not the William Nylander thread.

I agree.

People need to stop talking about all the players we should have drafted and just support Virtanen.

If people wanna talk about the 2014 draft, open up one of those old threads.

[Toews]

Well you completely contradicted yourself with your argument. You make one claim that Nylander is a better player because of his stats, yet say that Benn is a better player than Backstrom despite Backstrom having far superior numbers to Benn over his career. (including a 101 point season).

Again, you can't seem to separate skill with an overall game. Your only basis that Nylander is better is because of stats, yet I doubt you've watched him play a single game in the SHL. I've seen some of the assists he's getting over there, and they're not exactly all star plays.

Yes, Virtanen is putting up average numbers after coming back from surgery, but in almost every game he's making an impact through his physical play. That's the difference between a player who just puts up points, and one who can contribute when they're not putting up points.

There's no doubt that Nylander has more raw skill, but skill alone doesn't equal being better. I'm glad Benning realizes that.

In regards to the Benn vs Backstrom comparisons. Its not a good idea to be comparing career numbers. For one thing what a player did 5 years ago is no longer relevant to their play today. Jamie Benn was not the same player in 2009 that he is today. Lets compare with a more relevant sample size and take into account PP production and line mates etc. Provided that you have the stats and you put them into context, numbers can show you who the better player is. Like for example Backstrom has for the majority of his career played with a guy who by myself is the most deadliest PP player in this league. Benn has not had the same luxuries.

Even still I think Backstrom is really underrated, he isn't just a product of Ovechkin. He has been a ppg player for his entire career. He would be regarded more highly if he played for a different team under a different situation. He is beyond a doubt a legit #1C, there are only a few of those in this league and everyone wants one.

[2inthecup]

In a perfect world, the BPA for us would be have an enticing package of skill, size, and tenacity.

However, that wasn't the case in the last draft. The first 5 picks were obvious and the 6th could have realistically gone to a number of different prospects, all of which lacked and offered something.

Nylander offers a whole other level of skill. While his size is an area of concern, I feel like that is being overstated, especially when he's doing well in Modo against full grown men.

I'm also cautious about criticizing JV this early in the season but I find it completely clueless to resort to criticizing Nylander in JV's defence when he's ripping it up in a better league.

Sounds like you are describing JV to me. NHL ready shot and hits like a truck. Which of those three does he not have?

[logic]

I bet if JV was on another team people would be hyping him up to be the next Perry. But since he's on the Canucks our fans are convinced he can only be a third liner.

Seriously what the frack is wrong with you people? All you fracken do is look for the negatives and never fracken see any of the positives. I've never been to a board where our 'fans' are so fracken glass half empty.

LIGHTEN THE FRACK UP AND BE POSITIVE

[UFCanuck]

I know im going to get flamed for this. Especially by deniro.

While I'm not panicking. And I won't go into a rant on who we should have picked because I'm not a professional, and iI flip flopped my favored pick numerous times. I will say that so far virtanens lack of production has been alarming.

Many will come to virtanens aid with "he's learning both sides of the game" (which i dont buy into at all) and "hes coming off a major surgery (many players come off injury and production immediately, especially in junior where he should be dominating).

He has 3 goals since coming back. 4 if you wish to include the super series. Out of those 4, I know 2 were gimmes (superseries and garbage triple deflection rebound goal).

Does anyone else share this feeling right now? Can anyone provide me with more insight asto why his production is lacking (other than the excuses I mentioned above).

Having major surgery isn't an excuse, it's reality.

[avelanch]

i'm not really sure what "many players come off injury and production immediately, especially in junior where he should be dominating" means...

[aGENT]

I bet if JV was on another team people would be hyping him up to be the next Perry. But since he's on the Canucks our fans are convinced he can only be a third liner.

Seriously what the frack is wrong with you people? All you fracken do is look for the negatives and never fracken see any of the positives. I've never been to a board where our 'fans' are so fracken glass half empty.

LIGHTEN THE FRACK UP AND BE POSITIVE

To be fair it's only a few posters crying over their spilled Nylander-milk. Most of us seem to be pretty happy with JV.

I'm personally thrilled as I called picking him long before the draft

Big, fast, wicked shot and generally plays like a junk yard dog. On top of that he's a local boy who bleeds blue and green.

Yes please.

[73 Percent]

i'm not really sure what "many players come off injury and production immediately, especially in junior where he should be dominating" means...

produce*

Everyone else seemed to figure it out fine. Sorry for assuming you could too.

Edited November 18, 2014 by Gooseberries

[Angry Goose]

I get that people want to see a top prospect do well, all the time, but the kid is just trying to find his stride. That much time away from training/competition is hard- you are trying to build your body back to where it was pre-injury while everyone else is still in their game shape. I think most high performance athletes will agree.

He's got the foundation to succeed. Good hands, excellent skating and wicked shot. Big boi too

Edited November 18, 2014 by SILLY GOOSE

[Amish Rake Fighter]

and he turned 18 three months ago

[Honeydew]

Love CDC jumping off the boat and assuming our prospects are bottom 6 players :D Gotta love the positives of this!

[avelanch]

Love CDC jumping off the boat and assuming our prospects are bottom 6 players :D Gotta love the positives of this!

don't worry, 5 good games and they'll be back, stronger than ever, proclaiming he's the next one.

[73 Percent]

Love CDC jumping off the boat and assuming our prospects are bottom 6 players :D Gotta love the positives of this!

not one person has "jumped off the boat". Where do you get this shit from? Would you be happy if he was producing at a 3p/g pace? Yes. So why is it that its not okay to be kinda bummed when hes producing at less than point per game while the rest of his team seems so be scoring no problem?

[Guest Dasein]

Perks of being a high draft pick - there are always those picked after you that some of the team's fans wish they took instead.

Bo at #9 and now Jake at #6.

Shinkaruk and McCann get a free pass for dropping to #24.

[avelanch]

shink and mccann get a free pass for being our "extra" first round picks. so they become "steals"

[Tearloch7]

When it comes to life, there is a 'turd in every punch bowl' .. when it comes to Canuck prospects, there is a 'punch bowl for every turd' .. some folks would rather criticize a prospect and hope their criticism turn out 'right', rather than support a kid and just be considered a 'loyal fan' ..

Edited November 18, 2014 by Tearloch7