Jake Virtanen | #18 | RW

[kloubek]

14 hours ago, The Lock said:

The way I see it, even if he gets on as a bottom 6. He's shown he has the ability to score. It's not unheard of for a player to start in the bottom 6 and gradually work their way up. We can even look at Canucks past. There was a point in time where both Kesler and Burrows were bottom 6 players. Kesler was even a 1st round pick. There was also a point in time where Kesler was known for his 200 foot game but with limited scoring.

 

I'm not saying Virtanen's a Kesler; however, I am saying that even if Virtanen starts out bottom 6, he still has a good shot at getting better than that.

Perfectly valid point.  You're right - it isn't unheard of but it certainly is pretty rare.  The instances you site were from nearly 15 years ago!  In Burrows' case, he obviously benefited from playing with the Sedins but he clearly turned into a far better player than projected regardless.  And for Kesler, well, I recall myself thinking - man, this guy is an awesome 3rd line center, but never did I feel he would be better than that.  But yet he ended up being a 1b/2a player.  

I actually see more upside to Virtanen's skillset than I ever did Kesler or Burrows.  I STILL think he has most of the tools to be a decent 2nd line winger - which is where I had projected him initially.  Where he lacks though is the ability to make quick decisions on the fly, and hockey IQ is even more needed now than it ever has been given how much quicker the game has become.  You could see both Kesler and Burrows make great plays when they were first on the scene.  Their skills and bodies just took a few years to catch up to their minds.  With Virtanen, it is quite the opposite.  But at least, the other thing that helped them was their tenacity, and that's something at least that Virtanen shares with them.

In short, I like the optimism.  I hope he does indeed turn it around.

[Where'd Luongo?]

15 hours ago, The Lock said:

The way I see it, even if he gets on as a bottom 6. He's shown he has the ability to score. It's not unheard of for a player to start in the bottom 6 and gradually work their way up. We can even look at Canucks past. There was a point in time where both Kesler and Burrows were bottom 6 players. Kesler was even a 1st round pick. There was also a point in time where Kesler was known for his 200 foot game but with limited scoring.

 

I'm not saying Virtanen's a Kesler; however, I am saying that even if Virtanen starts out bottom 6, he still has a good shot at getting better than that.
 

PS: Anyone have a spray that could make Virtanen work as hard as Burrows?

[guntrix]

20 hours ago, The Lock said:

Perhaps I should also point out that Dal Colle (picked before Virtanen) and Hadyn Fleury (picked right after Virtanen) have yet to even play a game in the NHL. The horror that Virtanen's currently in the AHL. The horror that his path may be a little different than precious Nylander or Ehlers...

Tbf, Dal Colle notched 41 points in the AHL this past season... that's superstar status compared to Jake. Fleury notched 26 points (7 more points than Jake) in the AHL as a defender. 

 

And even if both those guys bust, that still won't affect Jake's probability of sticking/busting in the NHL.

 

We can't look at other prospects with rose-tinted glasses when they're actually on far better trajectories.

Edited May 16, 2017 by guntrix

[b3.]

1 hour ago, guntrix said:

Tbf, Dal Colle notched 41 points in the AHL this past season... that's superstar status compared to Jake. Fleury notched 26 points (7 more points than Jake) in the AHL as a defender. 

 

And even if both those guys bust, that still won't affect Jake's probability of sticking/busting in the NHL.

 

We can't look at other prospects with rose-tinted glasses when they're actually on far better trajectories.

Yup.

 

Ehlers and Nylander are making highlight reel plays, and Jake is playing ball hockey.. 

[Alflives]

5 hours ago, 10pavelbure96 said:

His brother Stefan is a national inline champion. Lol playing inline in the summer is a good way to stay in shape you moron.

I really could care less about how Jake stays lean, just so long as he shows up to camp fit.  

[Dazzle]

On 2017-05-15 at 4:30 PM, runtzguy said:

All im saying is Virtanen will make the NHL but not as a 1st or 2nd liner but most likely as a third line grinder whom hits and gets puck to people who score. As for the scoring touch everyone says he has, his shot is hard and nice but his accuracy sucks and its slow getting off of his stick; just look at his ahl production. So Virtanen as a puck retrieving third liner is a good projection for him considering his skillset. 

I get that his AHL production looks poor, especially this season's. There is context behind this reason though: Green had Virtanen re-invent his game, hence the lack of production. His conditioning was also a work in progress. From what I heard from some fans, Virtanen looked more effective than earlier. Green has said that Virtanen may not need to score to be effective; that he can be contribute in other factors. He also noted the improvement that Virtanen has been making. So what we can draw from Green's quotes is that 1) Virtanen is a project player and 2) he's understanding what it takes to be a pro.

 

I feel very good about Virtanen and that with Green, hopefully he can push him to success. I know, like many other people, couldn't have foreseen how good of a pick Horvat was, but I also think that if Horvat hadn't focussed on his weakness (skating), he might not be one of the positive news from this past season.

[dpn1]

I find it hard to be to negative about the kids drafted.  We always get ticked when ever the couple guys taken ahead of Jake  but what about the guys before?  Rienhart, Dal Colle, and Bennett.  These guy aren't exactly lighting it up.  Some are even using the dreaded "Dud" word (except)  maybe Bennett but he isn't doing as well as everyone would like.

Top it off with a weak draft and the fact that the needs of the team took Virtanen for his power forward potential.  The draft is like trading Futures.  Risky business but every once in a while, you win.  The Canucks did't do so bad with Jake

Edited May 17, 2017 by dpn1

[higgyfan]

5 hours ago, guntrix said:

Tbf, Dal Colle notched 41 points in the AHL this past season... that's superstar status compared to Jake. Fleury notched 26 points (7 more points than Jake) in the AHL as a defender. 

 

And even if both those guys bust, that still won't affect Jake's probability of sticking/busting in the NHL.

 

We can't look at other prospects with rose-tinted glasses when they're actually on far better trajectories.

I think Jake was rushed into the NHL and he was way to immature to handle the glory.  If he had the simmering time that Dal Cole has had, we might be seeing a different outcome.

 

Hopefully he has matured and is ready to work for his rewards.

[dpn1]

My point is more that they were taken above him and not that much better at at this time.  Plus I do believe was the younger side of this draft.  Dal Coole is not in the NHL and apparently the Islander are not happy with his development . The people at the draft thought he would step right in to the NHL..

 

[Butters Stoch]

10 hours ago, mangosteens said:

Virtanen is the reverse Burrows.

Burrows goes undrafted and works his way through the ECHL, AHL, playing ball hockey, and eventually a long NHL career.

Virtanen is a high draft pick and has worked his way out of the NHL down the to AHL, and is now playing inline hockey in the summers.  Next stop ECHL?

LOL. Certainly hope not but that's hilarious

[10pavelbure96]

7 hours ago, guntrix said:

Tbf, Dal Colle notched 41 points in the AHL this past season... that's superstar status compared to Jake. Fleury notched 26 points (7 more points than Jake) in the AHL as a defender. 

 

And even if both those guys bust, that still won't affect Jake's probability of sticking/busting in the NHL.

 

We can't look at other prospects with rose-tinted glasses when they're actually on far better trajectories.

So by that logic does that mean shinkaruk >> Virtanen??

 

Development at the AHL level is so much more than points

[Butters Stoch]

1 hour ago, 10pavelbure96 said:

So by that logic does that mean shinkaruk >> Virtanen??

 

Development at the AHL level is so much more than points

Maybe not the best example since that is pretty debatable.

[aGENT]

7 hours ago, Butters Stoch said:

Maybe not the best example since that is pretty debatable.

Is it? Jake has shown that, despite still needing a LOT of work and maturing, he can play at the NHL level already. 

 

I sure as hell wouldn't trade you a Virt for Shink...YMMV 

[Ronaldoescobar]

I could see Virtanen as a Jim Sandlak type. Now of course that is not what you pick with the #6 overall and probably not what the nucks were expecting (not surprised given the nucks absolutely horrible WHL scouting team I believe is/was led by Smyl & Delorme) but I do believe he has a place on the team in the future it is just not that top 6 role everyone was hoping for. This does not mean he is a bust (that would be someone out of the league completely) just selected a bit too high unfortunately.

[Alflives]

1 hour ago, Ronaldoescobar said:

I could see Virtanen as a Jim Sandlak type. Now of course that is not what you pick with the #6 overall and probably not what the nucks were expecting (not surprised given the nucks absolutely horrible WHL scouting team I believe is/was led by Smyl & Delorme) but I do believe he has a place on the team in the future it is just not that top 6 role everyone was hoping for. This does not mean he is a bust (that would be someone out of the league completely) just selected a bit too high unfortunately.

I think Jake skate WAY better than 'The House'.  Plus, Jake's got superior skills.  Jake is going to score 20 this season for the Canucks and be a really effective fore checker.  I see Janik Hansen, but bigger and even faster.

[guntrix]

3 hours ago, J.R. said:

Is it? Jake has shown that, despite still needing a LOT of work and maturing, he can play at the NHL level already. 

 

I sure as hell wouldn't trade you a Virt for Shink...YMMV 

Debatable as well. 

[aGENT]

2 minutes ago, guntrix said:

Debatable as well. 

13 points as a rookie in 55 games on a mess of a team with largely good underlying stats. And while he clearly had work to do (and IMO could have been handled better) showed he could play at this level (especially after the WJC).

[higgyfan]

2 hours ago, Ronaldoescobar said:

I could see Virtanen as a Jim Sandlak type. Now of course that is not what you pick with the #6 overall and probably not what the nucks were expecting (not surprised given the nucks absolutely horrible WHL scouting team I believe is/was led by Smyl & Delorme) but I do believe he has a place on the team in the future it is just not that top 6 role everyone was hoping for. This does not mean he is a bust (that would be someone out of the league completely) just selected a bit too high unfortunately.

Van did a horrible job developing Sandlak.  Sure hope they do better with Virtanen.

[Angry Goose]

1 hour ago, Alflives said:

I think Jake skate WAY better than 'The House'.  Plus, Jake's got superior skills.  Jake is going to score 20 this season for the Canucks and be a really effective fore checker.  I see Janik Hansen, but bigger and even faster.

i like your optimism alf

[Spitfire_Spiky]

1 hour ago, J.R. said:

13 points as a rookie in 55 games on a mess of a team with largely good underlying stats. And while he clearly had work to do (and IMO could have been handled better) showed he could play at this level (especially after the WJC).

I have to agree his rookie season was not bad at all considering the circumstances the team was in at the time and he proved he belonged in the NHL.

 

It was when he showed up to camp last season out of shape where I think it went downhill for him. It led to a mediocre camp followed by a weak start to the season and ultimately his demotion to the Comets. That obviously hurt his confidence and made him look at the way he approached the game and how he needs to play to be successful. While he didn't put up great numbers he came a long way last year and was one of the most exciting comets on the ice most nights.

 

Now if Jake can have a good off season and come in ready to play/perform like he did in his rookie season and combine that with the experience he got last year he will prove he can play at the NHL level. Whether or not he can earn a roster spot out of camp will depend on how he performs compared to our other RW propects like Boeser and Goldobin.