Nikita Tryamkin | D

[Outsiders]

9 minutes ago, I.Am.Ironman said:

1. Speculation. He may like to stay here for reasonable term and cap hit.

 

2. His role isn't to put up offensive numbers. Gets paid accordingly as defensive defensemen don't make as much as point generators from the blue line.

 

3. You never know once you get in. I'm not saying it is likely but you never know. While petey and markstrom are integral to team success Tanev is an integral component to our D corp. Our D is significantly worse if we switch out Benn for Tanev. Additionally we have finally got to a place where we have some depth in our forward and D groups. Why absolutely gut that for a pick or prospect that might turn into a 2nd or 3rd liner in 5 years.

 

4. At some point the endless 'trade asset x for pick y' has to stop. We also get value from having a competitive team in the playoffs. Right now the Canucks need playoff experience more than another prospect or pick. In your first 2 points you devalue Tanev due to his injury history, low offensive numbers and turnovers then go on to think a team is going to pay a top prospect or a 1st round pick? Which one is it? By the same token if he is worth that to another team he is worth that to ours, he wears an 'A', you have to balance what it may do to team chemistry as well. IMO this team needs playoff experience more than another 25-32 pick... if he would even get that. I think it is more likely for teams to be offering 2nd rounders, in which case it is certainly not worth it.

 

5. I think they both play a role in eachother's success. Put Benn with Hughes and I am not so sure Quinn sees the same success, both defensively and offensively. IIRC Tryamkin can play both sides but is better playing in the LD spot. He may not be the best fit for Hughes as is. Tryamkins style isn't the stay at home type either, I'm not sure they would be the best mix stylistically. 

To reply to your points.

 

1. Great, if he wants to do that sign back in the offseason. When has a guy took less money and term to stay with a team? We always say it and it never happens. He will get a raise on his 4.45 million and will want 5 million with term (like every player does). 

 

2. I agree that isn't his role, but you don't pay 5 million for a player thats 30 with injury troubles. Especially when we are tight with cap. Not to mention we have players to fill the void. Those players will never get a chance if Tanev stays. 

 

4. I wouldn't say I devalued Tanev. I pointed out reasons and flaws as to why you don't break open the bank for players that aren't game changers. Every year teams over pay at the deadline to get what they think the "missing piece" is for their team. I'm not saying Tanev is a bad player. I pointed out flaws, which are injury prone, not a point producer or play driver, he's now 30 and will want to cash in. He's a good defensive defensemen and that will have value at the TDL. I'd take a 2nd rounder. We have pulled out Demko, (Lind and Gadjovich same draft) , Woo and Hoglander in the 2nd round since Benning took over. The other 2 years we didn't have 2nd rounders. Call me crazy, but I think 4 of those 5 I listed will play an important role for us. 

[I.Am.Ironman]

5 minutes ago, Outsiders said:

To reply to your points.

 

1. Great, if he wants to do that sign back in the offseason. When has a guy took less money and term to stay with a team? We always say it and it never happens. He will get a raise on his 4.45 million and will want 5 million with term (like every player does). 

 

2. I agree that isn't his role, but you don't pay 5 million for a player thats 30 with injury troubles. Especially when we are tight with cap. Not to mention we have players to fill the void. Those players will never get a chance if Tanev stays. 

 

4. I wouldn't say I devalued Tanev. I pointed out reasons and flaws as to why you don't break open the bank for players that aren't game changers. Every year teams over pay at the deadline to get what they think the "missing piece" is for their team. I'm not saying Tanev is a bad player. I pointed out flaws, which are injury prone, not a point producer or play driver, he's now 30 and will want to cash in. He's a good defensive defensemen and that will have value at the TDL. I'd take a 2nd rounder. We have pulled out Demko, (Lind and Gadjovich same draft) , Woo and Hoglander in the 2nd round since Benning took over. The other 2 years we didn't have 2nd rounders. Call me crazy, but I think 4 of those 5 I listed will play an important role for us. 

If Tanev isn't able to fit into our cap next year then he walks. My point is that I think the Canucks are at the point that having a deep team for the playoffs and the opportunity for playoffs experience is more valuable than a late second rounder that is likely to be pick 55+. To use your example, we are talking Gadjovich range and not Lind, Woo, Hoglander or Demko range. We are a better team with him than with out him and I would like the best team possible for the playoffs.

Edited February 3, 2020 by I.Am.Ironman

[Rob_Zepp]

25 minutes ago, Outsiders said:

Can't afford to let a pending UFA with value walk for free.

It happens all the time in the NHL and it isn't "for free" if you get good service from the player in his last season and then have his contract space/AAV open in the CAP.   You only make trades that help your team and fit in with an overall plan.   Every combination is evaluated by every management team in the NHL.   You cannot make trades another GM isn't willing to make and you most certainly shouldn't make trades if it messes up an overall plan.

 

You cite Miller and Danny H.   The former was always a rent and they used him as such.   The latter has a NMC and invoked it to not be moving on his kids before school was out.   Don't create false narratives as if there was this massive trade potential in either case.    

 

The Canucks have actually had very few FAs really ever move on that wasn't by mutual agreement.   Big names like the Sedins and Edler re-signed for not more than market and in the former case, likely considerably less.   

 

The best moves the Canucks make this trade period with their pending UFAs may be the moves the don't make....and that will still be better for them now AND in the future.

[Outsiders]

18 minutes ago, Tre Mac said:

We weren't going to get much for Miller or Hamhius, even the return for Hansen and Burrows was nominal at best.  Losing Tanev for nothing is not going to set this franchise back nor are you getting a 1st or a prospect for Tanev's rights. 

We would have easily gotten a 2nd for Hamhuis and a 3rd or prospect for Miller.  Let me list the following for you.

 

Drafted in 2nd round since Benning took over

 

Demko

Lind

Hoglander

Woo

Gadjovich

 

Drafted in 3rd round since Benning took over

 

Madden

Tryamkin

DiPietro

Lockwood

Brisebois 

 

 

I highlighted the players above I feel will play a role for our team going forward. I count 7 players. Now tell me, what are Hamhuis and Miller doing for us?

 

 

[Gurn]

8 minutes ago, Outsiders said:

Now tell me, what are Hamhuis and Miller doing for us?

What part of NTC are you having trouble with?

[aGENT]

40 minutes ago, Outsiders said:

That is why our rebuild took so long in the first place.

 

 

I think you should go ask some other teams fans how long rebuilds can take and get back to us...

 

45 minutes ago, I.Am.Ironman said:

Tryamkins style isn't the stay at home type either, I'm not sure they would be the best mix stylistically. 

That actually is the exact role he's playing in the K.

[aGENT]

10 minutes ago, Outsiders said:

We would have easily gotten a 2nd for Hamhuis and a 3rd or prospect for Miller.  Let me list the following for you.

 

Drafted in 2nd round since Benning took over

 

Demko

Lind

Hoglander

Woo

Gadjovich

 

Drafted in 3rd round since Benning took over

 

Madden

Tryamkin

DiPietro

Lockwood

Brisebois 

 

 

I highlighted the players above I feel will play a role for our team going forward. I count 7 players. Now tell me, what are Hamhuis and Miller doing for us?

 

 

Oh sweet Gordie it continues!

 

If we 'easily' could have got a 2nd for Hamhuis or a 3rd for Miller, we would have.

 

We couldn't, so we didn't.

 

Seriously, show us some examples of 35+ year old goalies getting 3rd at TDL's...we'll wait.

[JM_]

1 minute ago, aGENT said:

 

 

I think you should go ask some other teams fans how long rebuilds can take and get back to us...

 

That actually is the exact role he's playing in the K.

hard to tell from the short blips of video but from the regular game watches that seems to be the case. 

 

I think Nik will be even more effective on smaller NHL ice. I would expect to see him be used by Green very much in a stay at home role as well. He's so damn big I'm not sure you really want him clearing the net tho, he'll just screen Marky most of the time 

[the grinder]

7 minutes ago, Outsiders said:

We would have easily gotten a 2nd for Hamhuis and a 3rd or prospect for Miller.  Let me list the following for you.

 

Drafted in 2nd round since Benning took over

 

Demko

Lind

Hoglander

Woo

Gadjovich

 

Drafted in 3rd round since Benning took over

 

Madden

Tryamkin

DiPietro

Lockwood

Brisebois 

 

 

I highlighted the players above I feel will play a role for our team going forward. I count 7 players. Now tell me, what are Hamhuis and Miller doing for us?

 

 

hammer had a ntc that he refused to wave  , miller   was only going to play for cali teams  so that limits any value there and the cali team aren't going to give any assets for a guy they can scoop up in the off season for free 

[JM_]

4 minutes ago, aGENT said:

Oh sweet Gordie it continues!

Jim just didn't want the extra work of having to pick more guys. I mean it gets tiring watching all those prospects. 

 

 

Edited February 3, 2020 by Jimmy McGill

[theo5789]

3 minutes ago, Jimmy McGill said:

hard to tell from the short blips of video but from the regular game watches that seems to be the case. 

 

I think Nik will be even more effective on smaller NHL ice. I would expect to see him be used by Green very much in a stay at home role as well. He's so damn big I'm not sure you really want him clearing the net tho, he'll just screen Marky most of the time 

Good thing Tryamkin is already playing on NHL ice and had often looked like one of the better players on his team.

[JM_]

1 minute ago, theo5789 said:

Good thing Tryamkin is already playing on NHL ice and had often looked like one of the better players on his team.

I thought only a few KHL teams were on NHL-sized ice? how many are there now?

[theo5789]

18 minutes ago, Outsiders said:

We would have easily gotten a 2nd for Hamhuis and a 3rd or prospect for Miller.  Let me list the following for you.

 

Drafted in 2nd round since Benning took over

 

Demko

Lind

Hoglander

Woo

Gadjovich

 

Drafted in 3rd round since Benning took over

 

Madden

Tryamkin

DiPietro

Lockwood

Brisebois 

 

 

I highlighted the players above I feel will play a role for our team going forward. I count 7 players. Now tell me, what are Hamhuis and Miller doing for us?

 

 

We had potentially a 2nd lined up with one of the few teams he was willing to waive his NTC for. They balked and offered less. We told them to pound sand. They got eliminated early in the playoffs. We had a much better TDL the following year. Karma.

[theo5789]

1 minute ago, Jimmy McGill said:

I thought only a few KHL teams were on NHL-sized ice? how many are there now?

Well Tryamkin's home ice is NHL sized, so he gets practices and plenty of game time on an NHL surface.

[JM_]

1 minute ago, theo5789 said:

Well Tryamkin's home ice is NHL sized, so he gets practices and plenty of game time on an NHL surface.

even better, I thought it was just a couple of other clubs. 

 

does anyone have a home vs road split on stats? I'd be curious to know if Nik actually plays better on smaller ice. 

[theo5789]

55 minutes ago, Outsiders said:

Can't afford to let a pending UFA with value walk for free. That is why our rebuild took so long in the first place. We let to many players walk, (Ryan Miller, Dan Hamhuis) We aren't winning the cup this year. So many posters on here are implying Tanev is a make it or break it type player. If he really is other teams will overpay, as they think  Tanev will put them over the top.  We will receive a 1st rounder or top prospect. This is the difference between having a elite team around Petey and Hughes and an "average team" down the line. Have to continue to restock the prospect pool. That's how good teams stay competitive. When guys want huge money and term, they have a cheaper option to replace that guy and the drop off ain't much between players. I'm not paying Tanev 5 million for 3-4 years. I'm replacing him with Tryamkin, Rafferty, or Juolevi and using that extra cap space to find other avenues to make my team better, or saving  it for Petey/Hughes extensions. 

Who said Tanev was a make or break player? I've personally only said that he gives us the best chance moving forward. Teams don't downgrade going into the playoffs. The team and players are not thinking this isn't their year. Every year counts, that's why they play the games. Did anyone predict Tampa would get swept in the 1st round last year?

 

See Edmonton, Toronto, Buffalo, etc for long-ass rebuilds. We have actually turned it around in remarkably short order that the pro-tank crew hasn't been able to process it fast enough.

[theo5789]

4 minutes ago, Jimmy McGill said:

even better, I thought it was just a couple of other clubs. 

 

does anyone have a home vs road split on stats? I'd be curious to know if Nik actually plays better on smaller ice. 

https://www.flashscore.ca/hockey/russia/khl/standings/

 

Looks like a much better record at home. Can't simply be attributed to Tryamkin though. Although Tryamkin's team overall seemed to have taken a dip while Tryamkin seemed to improve his game this year fwiw.

[I.Am.Ironman]

21 minutes ago, aGENT said:

That actually is the exact role he's playing in the K.

The shutdown role? I was going off of his last stint with us a few years ago. Once he got comfortable he wouldn't shy away from rushing the puck up ice.

[aGENT]

1 minute ago, I.Am.Ironman said:

The shutdown role? I was going off of his last stint with us a few years ago. Once he got comfortable he wouldn't shy away from rushing the puck up ice.

Yeah, he's been playing the the same shutdown/PK role in the K as Tanev does here (granted, not likely to the same level of proficiency). 

[JM_]

2 minutes ago, theo5789 said:

https://www.flashscore.ca/hockey/russia/khl/standings/

 

Looks like a much better record at home. Can't simply be attributed to Tryamkin though. Although Tryamkin's team overall seemed to have taken a dip while Tryamkin seemed to improve his game this year fwiw.

I think we pretty much know what we have already, an improved version of the guy we had 3 years ago. It certainly seems like he's improved physically. I don't put a ton of stock in KHL experience but we know he was able to play here already.

 

It would be pretty exciting to see him with Edler imo, that would be a lot for teams to handle.