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Burrows on Torts


TheRussianRocket.

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People quickly forget how Coach AV never ever talked with his players. All communication went through his assistant coaches. He led us to the cup finals and just did the same with New York. Pretty decent coach.

Not trying to say Torts is a good coach but not talking to players doesn't mean your a bad coach.

I think the "AV never talked to his players" thing is an oversimplification and I also believe that it's inaccurate.

To be sure, the bulk of the communication is done through assistant coaches, but this is the norm in professional hockey. Head coaches are in many ways, administrators. They delegate responsibility, which is why you have assistants who run special teams, coaches who look after the defense and goaltender coaches.

However, to state that Vigneault "never talked to his players" is just inaccurate. I remember during Keith Ballard's struggles with the team, he mentioned having several "in person" meetings with coach V. Also, anyone who watched the last NHL 24/7 saw his pust rest to the silly "AV doesn't even go into the dressing room" routine. There he was, on video, giving the same pep talk between periods that we see (and assume) all NHL head coaches do.

As far as Torts goes, I believe that he did communicate with his players, however, I also believe that he is the prototypical "MY way, or the highway" kind of coach, so most communications were likely one-sided and not particularly pleasant for the player in question.

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And if he gets injured again this season?

Sure it's an excuse but suddenly he's an injury prone player

When you're injured because guys are two handed slashing you, that isn't "injury prone", that's dirty. Hopefully some of the dirty stuff that he endures will be addressed and he can focus on playing, not recuperating.

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When you're injured because guys are two handed slashing you, that isn't "injury prone", that's dirty. Hopefully some of the dirty stuff that he endures will be addressed and he can focus on playing, not recuperating.

Problem with this is that Burrows doesn't exactly have the best reputation in the league. Among the more hated players, i'm sure. Some players are just going to take shots at him because of this. So while he might not be injury prone, he will be prone to getting dirty hits and sticking penalties... and the refs can't be relied on to protect him.

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Problem with this is that Burrows doesn't exactly have the best reputation in the league. Among the more hated players, i'm sure. Some players are just going to take shots at him because of this. So while he might not be injury prone, he will be prone to getting dirty hits and sticking penalties... and the refs can't be relied on to protect him.

Yet, some how he keeps getting invited to the World Championships every Spring. I'm of the opinion that certain officials have their eyes on certain players during games, because of that kind of reputation.

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People can hate on Torts all they want, but he forced the Luongo issue which lead to him being traded and Gillis being fired. All in the span of 1 year. Didn't accomplish much on the ice, but off the ice I'd say he worked miracles, LOL!

: :D

I too liked the way he handled the Luongo situation, I certainly wasn't pining for Gillis' head - I think he's a pretty intelligent and calculated man - but who can argue with the results of Linden, Benning and Desjardins?

I think you nailed the strength in Tortorella's performance and the off ice results.... +1.

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"I hate it when people come on here and say MG didn't have a plan.... how do you think he took this team from the basement to the SCF?? No plan....give your head a shake!

MG does not have a say, nor does any other GM, over who plays in what games...that decision is made solely by the coach. "

In my humble opinion I think what he was trying to say with the "precise plan" comment was that Gillis didn't seem to have a long term plan. I'll be the first to say he put the right parts together at the right time. However, his trading away of future prospects and draft picks hurt the team and put them in the position they are now.

Now, he did make a few draft picks in the last couple seasons that are solid, however they were quite abysmal in the years previous. Overall though, I think he hung on to players too long, and signed players to NTC's that frankly aren't warranted. Unfortunately I believe his tenure will be remembered as the GM who ALMOST won a cup, the goaltending debacle, and the Torts hire (whether that speculation that he was pressured into it or not by ownership).

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I was a big believer in Torts at first but now with all the facts pointing to how inept he was at doing his job

1) No contact with Utica management or Coach Green about any of the farm players

2) telling MG how to do his job by trying to get him to trade the teams heart and soul in Burrows

3) his fiasco in the inability to keep his emotions in tact (evidence Calgary game)

4) not even speaking to key players until half the season was gone.

Glad Torts is gone...clearly he had no clue how to coach this team

I was the same in the beginning too. Couldn't agree more. How did torts win a cup?

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: :D

I too liked the way he handled the Luongo situation, I certainly wasn't pining for Gillis' head - I think he's a pretty intelligent and calculated man - but who can argue with the results of Linden, Benning and Desjardins?

I think you nailed the strength in Tortorella's performance and the off ice results.... +1.

I agree with what you wrote...but I think Grapefruits was applauding the fact that Torts had MG fired.

I wasn't hoping for MG to be fired, I really wanted him to have another year.....but I also have liked most of the moves so far by Linden and Benning....especially the WD hiring. So, I'm comfortably torn with the situation.

Still too early for me to decide on Benning and Linden because I question some moves, but I can't say I'm upset....Benning and Linden seem to be able to get more done because they are more respected amongst their peers than MG was.

I've said this since the hiring, but WD is gonna be a huge difference maker and bring the most out of some key players on this team... Edler, Burrows, Hansen and Kass, I see huge improvements from these guys. The Sedins, I think they'll improve regardless, they just need less ice time. It's nice to see the prospects get some realistic opportunities and not have to play with the odds stacked against them....

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"I hate it when people come on here and say MG didn't have a plan.... how do you think he took this team from the basement to the SCF?? No plan....give your head a shake!

MG does not have a say, nor does any other GM, over who plays in what games...that decision is made solely by the coach. "

In my humble opinion I think what he was trying to say with the "precise plan" comment was that Gillis didn't seem to have a long term plan. I'll be the first to say he put the right parts together at the right time. However, his trading away of future prospects and draft picks hurt the team and put them in the position they are now.

Now, he did make a few draft picks in the last couple seasons that are solid, however they were quite abysmal in the years previous. Overall though, I think he hung on to players too long, and signed players to NTC's that frankly aren't warranted. Unfortunately I believe his tenure will be remembered as the GM who ALMOST won a cup, the goaltending debacle, and the Torts hire (whether that speculation that he was pressured into it or not by ownership).

Fair enough, I understand what you're saying, but I disagree with you somewhat...

Lots of people like to say he didn't have a plan....but lets be serious, he's a professional and he was quite good at his profession before being GM and as a GM. There are many faults with MG, but one thing nobody says, is that he's stupid or non-calculating....If anything, he is a very calculating man and he is very crafty, open-minded and smart. These qualities do not mesh with a GM that doesn't have a plan, quite the opposite in fact. Another area that people seem to forget is that non-moves are still considered part of a calculated, thought-out plan... MG came in and took a team from the basement to the Finals. He assessed the team and it's needs, decided what parts were still essential and what key ingredients were needed and added them...his decisions were right. So, I gotta disagree with MG not having a short-term AND long-term plan for the Canucks during his tenure.

During the Cup runs, teams need to trade future prospects/picks to reach their goals....priorities are different than bottom dwelling teams who will do the exact opposite. His last few years, he had to adjust his goals and he did what was expected, built our prospects and draft picks.... Personally, I don't think I've ever seen the Canucks in a better position, in regards to the prospects. Benning and Linden definitely added to it, but MG is a HUGE part of the reason why our prospects look so good now.

I agree that he may have hung on to players a bit too long, but I think he is a man of his word, and so being, he didn't want to go back on his words. Not only that, I think he has a lot of faith and trust in people working for him....he doesn't give up easily and wanted to give them one last chance. As a GM, it might not be great qualities, but as a person...I can respect him.

Now, I'm excited to see what Benning and Linden will do....I liked most of the moves so far and I'm eager to throw my complete support behind them. Just need a little more time to assess their moves so far.

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People quickly forget how Coach AV never ever talked with his players. All communication went through his assistant coaches. He led us to the cup finals and just did the same with New York. Pretty decent coach.

Not trying to say Torts is a good coach but not talking to players doesn't mean your a bad coach.

Where on earth did you get that from? I went to some open practices and he was constantly talking to the players. He also talked to players on the bench. Although I never saw him grab a player by the jersey or start poking him in the chest. I think you're confusing letting the players "police themselves" with not talking to them at all. Very different things.

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Yea what Burr said was pretty eye opening.

Coming in last year you saw Torts portrayed as a hard working guy that won't hesitate to communicate with his players. Turns out most of that communication was on the bench instead of behind closed doors.

I understand there is sometimes a go-to (like a Captain). But Burr is undeniably one of our leaders. No reason Torts couldn't approach him.

If someone had told MG that he was getting a guy who preaches fitness but hates practice, who yells at the bench but is silent in the back, doesn't watch tape of opposing teams and simply refuses to roll 4 lines even when our top guys are cracking under the minutes.. well he probably knew all that anyway and still hired him.

lack of sense cost him his job. and it cost the Canucks Schneider, Luongo and Kesler. Now our current situation may cost us Burr, too.

What the hell, we didn't even have Schneider while Torts was coach.

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Where on earth did you get that from? I went to some open practices and he was constantly talking to the players. He also talked to players on the bench. Although I never saw him grab a player by the jersey or start poking him in the chest. I think you're confusing letting the players "police themselves" with not talking to them at all. Very different things.

I think it's from the "AV doesn't coach" narrative that gained a lot of transaction in his final days here and his early struggles in New York. Example:

I asked one player this week whether he had been shown video relating to a specific play on the ice. The response, not offered as a criticism but in a matter-of-fact manner, was, “He says what he says and then expects you to figure it out.”

I’m not sure I’ve ever heard a coach unfavorably compare his team’s work ethic to another club’s the way Vigneault did last week in his evaluation of the Rangers and the Red Wings.

http://nypost.com/2013/12/15/contract-issues-loom-as-blueshirts-struggle-with-changes/

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Such a bad coach in so many different ways. Gassed 30+aged players with a lot of ice time. Didn't put Kassian in the top 6 even though he deserved an oppurtunity. Said Kass defence needed work yet played Edler 20+ minutes/game. Didn't let Lou start winter classic. Stormed the other teams dressing room. etc. Now this. Well i'm out of words :picard: .

Look at his good side: he filled the "tough guy" image vacuum that we haven't had since Burke had left.
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