Jump to content
The Official Site of the Vancouver Canucks
Canucks Community

[Discussion] Vets and Trade Deadline


Recommended Posts

canucks have to many passengers on the bus in my eyes

1. hansen has constantly been given chances in top six to cover for burrows the guy has no hands works hard but really brings nothing close to his cap hit value 2.5 mill needs to be traded at deadline

replacements in utica kenins 680k or gaunce 925k lain 600k id rather a youngster get a look.

2. burrows hard worker was great when he made 2 mill a yr hes still a 20 goal scorer but cap hit of 4.5 is way to much at deadline we might have to retain 1-1.5 mill in space if we wanna trade him his ntc would mean he might only agreee to go to teams like montreal or a true contender. Hopefully he plays well the next 20-30 games get his value up and unload him.

3. mattias big bodied looks great with kassian and richardson ufa at end of yr benning should resign him cheap or unload asset at deadline. id rather he be resigned love him with kass next yr id like to see a mattias horvat kassian line or even mattias gaunce kassian would cause fits for other teams.

4. richardson hard working 4th line center not much room next yr on team for him with gaunce and horvat cassels and mccann pushung for spots he might be gone at deadline isnt the best at faceoffs regardless hopefully he continues scoring maximizing his value at deadline for teams making cup runs.

5. hamhuis huge value big minute eater on d many teams would pay alot for him. he seems off this yr no offense and some what bad plus minus which nevers been the case maybe hes injured

next yrs team should faster and younger time to unload some assets for some missing holes in team

1. punishing shutdown dman - which we havent had since willie mitchell sbisa is hardest hitter since :)

2. young puck moving ppqb dman (pulock, reinhart, ekholm, lindholm, morin, sproul. oullett, morrisey, bowey, gudbranson) lets target one of these guys or draft one in deep draft.

3. hard hitting sciring beast forward weve been missing since bertuzzi he used to go into corners and hurt dmen on forecheck pound them into boards ( al macinnis, jackman) all got hurt in that blues playoff series

jake virtanen looks to be this guy next yr.

Next yrs roster needs to be younger and meaner and faster so we dont get embarassed by teams like kings bruins ducks sharks if we need to give up a few good assets do it

sedin sedin vrbata

virtanen bonino higgins

shinkaruk horvat kassian

kenins gaunce mattias

go young and see what happens we still have a decent vet core the defense mess needs to be fixed any ideas

Link to comment
Share on other sites

IMO Hamhuis is still not tradeable. He's had a rough start, but it's just the first 1/6 of the season thus far. As for Burr, he's finally proven that he can be a serviceable 2nd liner, which is a surprise.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I cant see Matthias resigning here. In all of his interviews and every time i see him on the ice he looks unhappy, its too bad cause he's such a hard worker but id deal him at the deadline. on the other hand i want to keep Hansen. He provides such great speed on the ice, and you need those guys. Canucks are already such a slow team, getting rid of Hansen will only make that more noticeable. Look at the Habs last year, one of the reasons why they beat the bruins was because of their speed (and Carry Price of course).

Link to comment
Share on other sites

tradeable assets

hansen

burrows

hamhuis

richardson

one of lack or markstrom

mattias

jensen

vey

cassels

subban

get rid of some ntcs

players i think should be off limits (shinkaruk, gaunce, virtanen, horvat, mccann, hutton,)

why not look at trading bieska and no to the prospects. Why would we trade away prospects. This team is not going to be any better they need to start retooling/rebuilding now. Its simple they have to trade for bluechip d-man prospects because our d-man core is weak.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Definately agree. Hamhuis and Bieksa are looking slow and old this season, their time has come to an end and we've got to find replacements for their 20 minutes each on the blueline before we move them.

Richardson has been a great 3rd line center fill in this season and I wouldn't mind keeping him as a veteran in our bottom-6 to help groom the kids coming in.

Hansen and Matthias have been the worst Canuck forwards by far and their roles can easily be replaced by Gaunce and Shinkaruk, who deserve the ice time far more than those two plugs. Give Matthias a bit more of a chance as our 4th line center because he's young, cheap and big, but he's got one of the worst +/- in the league playing on the second best team in the NHL.

As for Burrows, I've never liked that 4.5M contract extension. You don't pay a 3rd line checker who strikes it lucky 4.5M. Bickell didn't get given the big bucks because he scored a lot with Kane and Toews, and the same goes for Burrows. He's not worth 4.5M, even as a 2nd line winger, but he's playing well this season.

Higgins, Bonino, the Sedins and Edler are the only veterans we should really keep around as we transition into a new core of Horvat, Shinkaruk, Kassian, Jensen, Edler/Tanev and Lack.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Definately agree. Hamhuis and Bieksa are looking slow and old this season, their time has come to an end and we've got to find replacements for their 20 minutes each on the blueline before we move them.

Richardson has been a great 3rd line center fill in this season and I wouldn't mind keeping him as a veteran in our bottom-6 to help groom the kids coming in.

Hansen and Matthias have been the worst Canuck forwards by far and their roles can easily be replaced by Gaunce and Shinkaruk, who deserve the ice time far more than those two plugs. Give Matthias a bit more of a chance as our 4th line center because he's young, cheap and big, but he's got one of the worst +/- in the league playing on the second best team in the NHL.

As for Burrows, I've never liked that 4.5M contract extension. You don't pay a 3rd line checker who strikes it lucky 4.5M. Bickell didn't get given the big bucks because he scored a lot with Kane and Toews, and the same goes for Burrows. He's not worth 4.5M, even as a 2nd line winger, but he's playing well this season.

Higgins, Bonino, the Sedins and Edler are the only veterans we should really keep around as we transition into a new core of Horvat, Shinkaruk, Kassian, Jensen, Edler/Tanev and Lack.

I think if anything Higgins would be one to go as he holds more value than someone like Burrows.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

If we find another young banger with speed who can play on the 3rd too, I would be willing to move Hansen since that cap space is, admittedly, valuable. Also, agreed that Matthias or Richardson may not have a spot if Horvat makes it. I'd be up to trading one of those vets (Richie or Matthias could be valuable for smaller teams needing face-off specialists or big bodied depth for the playoffs). Hansen should be able to bring decent value though, maybe he could bring in a young D-man. Speaking of which...

2. young puck moving ppqb dman (pulock, reinhart, ekholm, lindholm, morin, sproul. oullett, morrisey, bowey, gudbranson) lets target one of these guys or draft one in deep draft.

really? They're shutdown guys.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Definately agree. Hamhuis and Bieksa are looking slow and old this season, their time has come to an end and we've got to find replacements for their 20 minutes each on the blueline before we move them.

Richardson has been a great 3rd line center fill in this season and I wouldn't mind keeping him as a veteran in our bottom-6 to help groom the kids coming in.

Hansen and Matthias have been the worst Canuck forwards by far and their roles can easily be replaced by Gaunce and Shinkaruk, who deserve the ice time far more than those two plugs. Give Matthias a bit more of a chance as our 4th line center because he's young, cheap and big, but he's got one of the worst +/- in the league playing on the second best team in the NHL.

As for Burrows, I've never liked that 4.5M contract extension. You don't pay a 3rd line checker who strikes it lucky 4.5M. Bickell didn't get given the big bucks because he scored a lot with Kane and Toews, and the same goes for Burrows. He's not worth 4.5M, even as a 2nd line winger, but he's playing well this season.

Higgins, Bonino, the Sedins and Edler are the only veterans we should really keep around as we transition into a new core of Horvat, Shinkaruk, Kassian, Jensen, Edler/Tanev and Lack.

What have Gaunce and Shinkaruk done to "deserve" those roster spots? Neither even made it to the final cut in preseason.

Bickell's cap hit is 500k less than Burrows and he's never scored more than 20 goals or exceeded 40 points in a season his entire career. So far this season Bickell has 6 points in 15 games while Burrows has 8 points in 13 games. A pretty bad comparison on "value" for cap hit. Btw, Burrows is also a quality pk player, while Bickell gets no pk time at all.

Last years average 2nd line player put up 39 points. Burrows is currently on pace for 50. Pretty damn good for an overpriced third line checker that "struck it lucky" and doesn't belong on a second line.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

If we're talking trade deadline, I would predict that we move none of the veterans unless it is a hockey move with a roster player coming back in return.

We're trying to make the playoffs this year and this team is in a position to do so right now.

Here are the UFAs: Matthias, Richardson, Dorsett and Sestito.

Of these, I don't see us moving any of them for draft picks or prospects at the deadline. Why? Because I think it's more valuable to this team to have them on a playoff run to help us maybe win a series - it would be our 1st since 2011. This team badly needs a little bit of success in the post-season, and if these guys can help in that regard, it's well worth risking losing them on July 1st as free agents IMO, especially considering how low their values would be at the deadline - none of them would fetch more than a 2nd rounder (and even that's really pushing it - 3rd rounder at best if the GM is sane but we know there are some kooky ones out there).

If there is a hockey trade to be made, where we can get a player that plays a similar style to one of them but is signed to a multi-year deal, I could see us making that trade if management can't re-sign that player before the deadline.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

...

Here are the UFAs: Matthias, Richardson, Dorsett and Sestito.

Of these, I don't see us moving any of them for draft picks or prospects at the deadline. Why? Because I think it's more valuable to this team to have them on a playoff run to help us maybe win a series - it would be our 1st since 2011. This team badly needs a little bit of success in the post-season ...

Why?

What good does it do the team to win one playoff series? In what way is that worth a pick or prospect?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Definately agree. Hamhuis and Bieksa are looking slow and old this season, their time has come to an end and we've got to find replacements for their 20 minutes each on the blueline before we move them.

Richardson has been a great 3rd line center fill in this season and I wouldn't mind keeping him as a veteran in our bottom-6 to help groom the kids coming in.

Hansen and Matthias have been the worst Canuck forwards by far and their roles can easily be replaced by Gaunce and Shinkaruk, who deserve the ice time far more than those two plugs. Give Matthias a bit more of a chance as our 4th line center because he's young, cheap and big, but he's got one of the worst +/- in the league playing on the second best team in the NHL.

As for Burrows, I've never liked that 4.5M contract extension. You don't pay a 3rd line checker who strikes it lucky 4.5M. Bickell didn't get given the big bucks because he scored a lot with Kane and Toews, and the same goes for Burrows. He's not worth 4.5M, even as a 2nd line winger, but he's playing well this season.

Higgins, Bonino, the Sedins and Edler are the only veterans we should really keep around as we transition into a new core of Horvat, Shinkaruk, Kassian, Jensen, Edler/Tanev and Lack.

1. "As for Burrows, I've never liked that 4.5M contract extension. You don't pay a 3rd line checker who strikes it lucky 4.5M."

The problem here is that you can't simply make the contract go away. While the salary will drop, the cap hit of $4.5 million will remain, and any team considering trading for him will know it. Further, he's got one of the famous MG no trade clauses so can't be moved unless he wants to be. It isn't a modified ntc-it's full. He can't be moved without his agreement.

You and I differ on Burrows' ability-I think he's a better player than you give him credit for, but that isn't the point I'm making. Assume you're right in your evalutation. Burrows has a deal with a cap hit of $4.5 million and anyone you want to trade him to knows it and will adjust what they will pay accordingly. I don't think he has much trade value at this stage in his career, and my evaluation of his play is much higher than yours-I don't consider him merely a 3rd line checker who got lucky. Based on your evaluation, his trade value with a cap hit of $4.5 million would be negative.

2. "Hansen and Matthias have been the worst Canuck forwards by far and their roles can easily be replaced by Gaunce and Shinkaruk, who deserve the ice time far more than those two plugs."

In the case of Hansen either you and I have been watching different games-unless you only watched the first three games of the season, or we place far different values on what Hansen does and doesn't bring to the table. I see a speedy defensive winger who had a rough start to the season but since then has been good at what he does. He has definite value despite his lack of soft hands.

He also has a modified ntc, so the ability to move him is restricted. He might be moved, but I wouldn't be as anxious to get rid of a conscientious, speedy checking forward.

I'm already on record on this forum as saying Matthias needs to be traded some time. I don't think the Canucks will be able to sign him to an extension.

3. ..."and their roles can easily be replaced by Gaunce and Shinkaruk, who deserve the ice time far more than those two plugs."

Gaunce and Shink are young rookie pros, playing solidly but not lighting it up in the AHL. They didn't make the final round of preseason cuts. They are good prospects and give much hope for the future, but what have they done to make you think they can play a better 3/4 line game than Hansen right now? I'll grant you that they will have a few opportunities where they get off shots that Hansen doesn't-but for that, Hansen is fast and has learned to play defensively in the NHL-and both Gaunce and Shink are just starting out.

Don't rush them. Let them develop properly. They aren't too good for the AHL and are in a great position for development there.

I know there is a great deal of disagreement about how best to develop players. Some believe it best to play them in the NHL. I am one of those that for most players disagree and think that unless a player is too good for the minors, most often if the minor league program is a good one, the player can best develop there until he is better than the NHL player he would replace.

4. "Hamhuis and Bieksa are looking slow and old this season, their time has come to an end ..."

Once again, targeted are two players with full no trade clauses. Further, I really doubt either one of them wants to leave Vancouver.

I'm not sure how they will play in the future. Hamhuis started really slowly last year, then played well for most of the year. Bieksa started out this year playing hurt. Either or both could turn out to have good seasons.

Certainly, they are at an age where their play is expected to trend downward. I think they're probably valuable beyond their play. Bieksa also plays tough and can provide a spark. Hamhuis is a calm, steady influence, the type you want your prospects learning from. Hamhuis is in his home province and really involved in the Vancouver community beyond the extent he would be if traded to play out the string to end his career somewhere else. My sense is that Bieksa is committed to the Canucks.

I don't see them agreeing to a trade if the team asks. Then again, I was surprised Garrison agreed.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I wondering about Higgins vs Burrows......I beleave they have equal value and skill

My thoughts are these, if you consider that we should trade one of these 2 in the next 6 months, i think it is an easy choice really, as Burrows is too costly to trade, meaning that teams won't take the 4.5 million a year contract without devaluing what ever is coming back to compensate for the high contract.

Now Higgins on the other hand is on pace for a 50 pt season, and has a great contract at 2.5 million, one which is easy to move, and easy for teams to absorb.

Are either easy to trade ....no, because of their NTC, but if you are asking one, Higgins is probably the one that will give you the most

I believe Montreal, NYI, NY Rangers, Toronto and New Jersey would all be interested

As for the Rest

If Richardson = Horvat +/- a point or 2............than trade Richardson at the deadline (UFA) ($1,150,000)

If Matthais = Hansen +/- a point or 2...............than resign Matthais and trade Hansen (NTC) ($2,500,000)

If it is between playing Dorsett or Sestito........resign Dorsett and Waver Sestito ($750,000)

Plus Higgins.........................................................................................................($2,500,000)

That should give us plenty of caproom to buy a UFA dman next year.....maybe?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Why?

What good does it do the team to win one playoff series? In what way is that worth a pick or prospect?

Our projected Cap at Deadline is around 4m with our current lineup. There is no reason to ship out people even if it means we get knocked out in the first or second series in the playoff. If anything else we would add a player or two for depth to make a playoff run (all pending we are in a position to make the playoffs).

I wondering about Higgins vs Burrows......I beleave they have equal value and skill

My thoughts are these, if you consider that we should trade one of these 2 in the next 6 months, i think it is an easy choice really, as Burrows is too costly to trade, meaning that teams won't take the 4.5 million a year contract without devaluing what ever is coming back to compensate for the high contract.

Now Higgins on the other hand is on pace for a 50 pt season, and has a great contract at 2.5 million, one which is easy to move, and easy for teams to absorb.

Are either easy to trade ....no, because of their NTC, but if you are asking one, Higgins is probably the one that will give you the most

I believe Montreal, NYI, NY Rangers, Toronto and New Jersey would all be interested

As for the Rest

If Richardson = Horvat +/- a point or 2............than trade Richardson at the deadline (UFA) ($1,150,000)

If Matthais = Hansen +/- a point or 2...............than resign Matthais and trade Hansen (NTC) ($2,500,000)

If it is between playing Dorsett or Sestito........resign Dorsett and Waver Sestito ($750,000)

Plus Higgins.........................................................................................................($2,500,000)

That should give us plenty of caproom to buy a UFA dman next year.....maybe?

I agree with most of this but depth is huge in a season and playoff run, there is no need to trade away anyone unless if its to move a piece out to get a piece back in.

Overall the only teams that would be wanting Matthias and Richardson because they are UFA are teams who need to add them for a playoff run... but then why would we want to ship the player out and degrade our chances in the playoff for a prospect.

I think we let Richardson / Sestito walk and resign Matthias and Dorsett.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    • No registered users viewing this page.
×
×
  • Create New...