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Santorelli (+2nd Rounder) versus Vey


JeremyCuddles

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Out of those two, I'd take Vey any day of the week. That's not even a fair comparison.

Vey could easily pot the same 20g this season - something Santorelli has done once in his career. By no means do I want to downgrade Mike, but Vey is going places. We just need to bring him along nicely. Like playing PP with Danny & Hank :lol:

I'm so happy we got him onboard.

I was hoping we'd have re-signed him in the offseason, but with the amount of forwards, it was kinda logical not to.

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I have a couple questions to ask and hope some one can answer them for me. First when Burrows got suspended for the 3 games and Willie tried Vey on the second line for half a game or so do you think he instantly turned the 2nd line around and made it better without Burrows on it. Second question when Willie put him on the line with the twins for part of the game did Vey make the first line better than when Willie had Hansen on it. My answer for both questions is NO> But is that just me?

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I am a Santo fan for his short time played here. He came in and impressed considering he was an potential AHL signing. He had some offensive upside, Good in the face off and defensively sound. He broke his body playing for the Canucks, so we will never know if his enthusiasm would drop off or if he could keep the pace up.

I would of been happier getting Vey for the 2nd and trading Hansen for a 2nd and keeping Santo. I think Santo can contribute more than Hansen while playing in any line up and end up being cheaper than Hansen as well with no NTC.

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I have a couple questions to ask and hope some one can answer them for me. First when Burrows got suspended for the 3 games and Willie tried Vey on the second line for half a game or so do you think he instantly turned the 2nd line around and made it better without Burrows on it. Second question when Willie put him on the line with the twins for part of the game did Vey make the first line better than when Willie had Hansen on it. My answer for both questions is NO> But is that just me?

Vey is a rookie and lacks the NHL experience Burrows and Hansen bring. Although he's not a slow skater, Burrows and Hansen are both faster and more physical. This is why Burrows and Hansen are better options for now. The talent Vey has shown indicates to me that given experience he will surpass both on the skill side. The way he gets that experience is being put into better opportunities here and there to gain the experience. Instantly turning a line around is a tad much to ask of a rookie not named Crosby.

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The argument is Santo and the 2nd. So we'd still have a young guy and a better centre. Seeing as this is CDC I figured no one would read the original post.

bruh no one cares about the 2nd rounder. it would be 4 years later until that pick is in the nhl. vey > santorelli now because skill and age and potential

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bruh no one cares about the 2nd rounder. it would be 4 years later until that pick is in the nhl. vey > santorelli now because skill and age and potential

Rubbish. I've read an eternity of posts lamenting how we'd squandered SO MANY 2nd's since the '04 lockout. Lots of people attributing our (previous) prospect woes to this very fact.

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Rubbish. I've read an eternity of posts lamenting how we'd squandered SO MANY 2nd's since the '04 lockout. Lots of people attributing our (previous) prospect woes to this very fact.

Context is an important word regarding that complaint. Those "squandered" second round picks many complain about were used for rental players for a playoff push. Leaving us with nothing when the season was over. Vey is not a rental player.

An article a while ago showed the success rate on drafting. Second round players were 20% likely to have a successful NHL career. What the writer considered "successful" was playing 160 NHL games to qualify for an NHL pension. So several of those in that 20% are fringe players that didn't last in the league and a much smaller percentage decent players and an even smaller percentage actual impact players with longevity.

This brings me to this:

You can have the second round pick and play the small percentage he'll be more than a fringe player, wait through 3 to 4 years of development in the hopes he becomes a decent or possibly an impact player. Which the odds are heavily against. Or you can trade that second round pick for a player that has already gone through the development stage in the AHL and ripped it up at that level, who is ready to step into the NHL. Which is the smarter play?

I'll take the developed prospect thanks.

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He puts up points and seems consistent, that's important for a young player. Does it matter those points aren't flashy and highlight reel?

He has good hockey sense, passes well but struggles in the circle. That can be learned and improved with experience can't teach good passing. He's got potential and that potential needs time to grow. He's played how many NHL games?

I was a bit surprised to see the Canucks let Santo go, he seemed like the type of guy they'd want to keep around. He has offensive skill and plays hard all the time. The second round pick is a wait and see as those picks don't always pan out, the D man the Kings took could be a bust. This will all be a wait and see situation. Maybe Santo goes lights out and the seond rounder is a gem, but maybe Vey develops into a great second line player. We don't know, but that's all part of the game.

You misunderstood me.

You do not have to be a flashy player, but something has to show you are cut above the rest of the opposition in more ways than one to prove you are a top 6 NHL caliber player.

Physicality, speed, ice vision, shot, playmaking, faceoff (for a C), stickhandling... out of these criteria, Vey has not shown, even for a moment, he excels in any. The reason why I mentioned how he obtained his points is due to the fact he has been a beneficiary in the majority of it.

If you are talking about good passing, Kassian has shown far superiority in that department. Kassian also possesses a better ice vision. Yet, many on this board label him as nothing more than a solid 3rd liner, despite Kassian having the superior edge in physicality as well.

Another example of our recent prospect is Cody Hogdson. Sure, he may be a victim of mismanagement and collapse under media pressure, however, he has showed far more top 6 potential when he first suited for the Canucks than Vey has this year. Look where he is now.

Look, I'm not crucifying Vey. He is a perfectly fine NHL player. I was just indirectly replying to this thread that I don't think Vey is worth Santo and the 2nd, as I don't see a clear indication Vey has all the raw tools to become a top 6 player.

I think Santo would have done a better job now, and the 2nd could have poached us a player of Vey caliber or higher for the near future.

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Is this team about the now? Then Santoreli would be better plus they keep the pick, if the team is about the future then Vey will most likely end up the better deal (younger) but what about the pick? And if the team is about the future, shouldn't there be a couple more young guys on the team?

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I'm going to say no. We've been needing to have a younger team for a while and trading away a rookie who's fit in well so far doesn't make sense to me. We need to be younger for our future and Vey could easily turn out to be way better than Santo. Time will tell on that.

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You misunderstood me.

You do not have to be a flashy player, but something has to show you are cut above the rest of the opposition in more ways than one to prove you are a top 6 NHL caliber player.

Physicality, speed, ice vision, shot, playmaking, faceoff (for a C), stickhandling... out of these criteria, Vey has not shown, even for a moment, he excels in any. The reason why I mentioned how he obtained his points is due to the fact he has been a beneficiary in the majority of it.

If you are talking about good passing, Kassian has shown far superiority in that department. Kassian also possesses a better ice vision. Yet, many on this board label him as nothing more than a solid 3rd liner, despite Kassian having the superior edge in physicality as well.

Another example of our recent prospect is Cody Hogdson. Sure, he may be a victim of mismanagement and collapse under media pressure, however, he has showed far more top 6 potential when he first suited for the Canucks than Vey has this year. Look where he is now.

Look, I'm not crucifying Vey. He is a perfectly fine NHL player. I was just indirectly replying to this thread that I don't think Vey is worth Santo and the 2nd, as I don't see a clear indication Vey has all the raw tools to become a top 6 player.

I think Santo would have done a better job now, and the 2nd could have poached us a player of Vey caliber or higher for the near future.

He's in Buffalo, where careers go to die.

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There have been tons of guys that performed above average in the AHL and just don't quite have it for the NHL.

AV, when he first got here promoted all kinds of guys because he thought they were good enough and in his system a fire hydrant would have been good.

I guess I will start to question the coach's ideas on somethings, so far he has been pretty much been in the background BUT when Vey gets #1 PP time without trying out anyone else, it is bound to discourage some of the other players.

Entitlement is a bltch and not exactly a team builder.

Great that the kid is getting his chance to show what he has and that he has already paid some dues in the minors but is he the guy that is going to turn the crank in the future?

IMO Fox could do what he does and maybe better.

Think of it, the Nucks already had something like 9 centers in their system and then traded for another, what sense does that make.

Hope the kid starts showing up on the scoresheet with other than being set up by the Sedins.

I get the sad impression you don't like Willie's plan for Vey. Well all I can say is get used to it because "you ain't the coach."

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Context is an important word regarding that complaint. Those "squandered" second round picks many complain about were used for rental players for a playoff push. Leaving us with nothing when the season was over. Vey is not a rental player.

An article a while ago showed the success rate on drafting. Second round players were 20% likely to have a successful NHL career. What the writer considered "successful" was playing 160 NHL games to qualify for an NHL pension. So several of those in that 20% are fringe players that didn't last in the league and a much smaller percentage decent players and an even smaller percentage actual impact players with longevity.

This brings me to this:

You can have the second round pick and play the small percentage he'll be more than a fringe player, wait through 3 to 4 years of development in the hopes he becomes a decent or possibly an impact player. Which the odds are heavily against. Or you can trade that second round pick for a player that has already gone through the development stage in the AHL and ripped it up at that level, who is ready to step into the NHL. Which is the smarter play?

I'll take the developed prospect thanks.

I've got no qualms regarding the notion of Vey vs a 2nd rounder. I've watched the game long enough, that I can appreciate it's a fairly reasonable calculation.

The issue(in this context) is basically Santo & 2nd vs Vey. There may be more to it, than we fans know. Perhaps they were afraid about Santo's recovery? Maybe his demands were excessive? Likely they wanted to set Willie up with a few familiar faces, etc...

For the most part, with JB's scouting exp/knowledge, they likely see upside in Vey, which will be realized in the future. Yet with how excited most CDCers are about Gaunce, Horvat, Cassels & McCann(JB's first pick) it appears to me as a surplus in one area, with a deficiency at D remaining a virtually unanimous agreement.

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