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Santorelli (+2nd Rounder) versus Vey


JeremyCuddles

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How many Even strength points does Santo have versus Vey?

Santo has 6 ES points in 223:49 ES ice time to Veys 6 ES points in 191:44 ice time.

Any more questions I can answer for you like Santo is about 6 years older than Vey, or that Santo has played 239 more NHL games than Vey, or that Santo makes more than double what Vey does?

Maybe you can answer a question for me. Who is more likely to become more than he currently is, 29 year old veteran Santo or 23 year old rookie Vey?

all 8 of Santo's points this season is even strength points.

Santo has 1 PP point, 1 SH point, and 6 ES points.

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You say nobody cares about the pick as it's four years down the line but then say you'd pick Vey over Santo because of potential.

Vey is low risk to fail at the NHL level considering his AHL numbers. A 2nd round pick has less than a 25 percent chance of making the NHL at all and a much lower chance of being a top 6 player. Vey is also ready now versus the pick being ready for the NHL in 3 or 4 years. That makes Vey preferable to the second round pick as he's now versus down the road and less of a gamble to be NHL caliber. Vey also has the potential to be considerably better than Santo making him a preferable option to him. So yes, Vey is the preferable option to both the 2nd round pick and Santo but for different reasons.

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I think we did the exact right thing and signing Santorelli would have been incredibly weak and short-sighted. The last thing this team needed was to tread water for yet another year by signing players that clearly don't belong in the future plans of the team.

Also Vey is not being given PP time as a ploy to boost the value of the trade. He is being given that time because he has the most skill and experience for that position. Our defenceman suck at the PP.

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I didn't make the assessment by the numbers they have put up on the sheet. The sample size is far too low for that method.

If you have watched Cody's games, and now Vey's, you will realize the difference in skill level these two candidates have demonstrated... and I'm not even a Cody lover. Cody showed moments where he could elevate his game and create chances, whereas Vey has really been the beneficiary.

Vey could turn out to be a good complimentary winger, not in the same mold but similar role to Higgins. However, Higgins has more speed and physicality than Vey (and this is taking into consideration Vey's defensive game will improve with years). But then, how many of us truly believe Higgins is a legitimate top 6 NHL forward?

Or, it could lead to a solid pick, especially with JB's scouting background.

I can go on and list you some amazing, and some solid 2nd round picks, but I also do agree a lot of them turn out to be tweens and busts.

It is a hypothetical issue so there is no right or wrong answer, however my point was Santorelli would have done a better job for now, and that 2nd could have netted us the depth we required for the future. I mean Jensen showed just as much success last year in a similar role. I don't see an upgrade in Vey over Jensen.

As aforementioned, I see Vey more of a complimentary winger, and those aren't too hard to find in drafts, or as free agent signings.

This is entirely incorrect. As has been mentioned Cody looked like crap in the early part of his career. Very unimpressive, he was virtually unnoticeable out there.

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Why are most people just comparing Santo and Vey? There's the 2nd round pick involved too.

I think right now we would have been better off keeping Santo and the 2nd. I still don't understand why we let him go. In the long run Vey is the safer option. We don't know how that 2nd would pan out, but at least we know Vey can already crack our lineup and he still has room to improve.

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The thing I find the funniest is that people are worried about what veys playoff production will be... Why don't we worry about making the playoffs first.

Well on the upside Vey is currently tied with Santo for career NHL playoff points. :lol:

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This is entirely incorrect. As has been mentioned Cody looked like crap in the early part of his career. Very unimpressive, he was virtually unnoticeable out there.

"Has shown moments" is the part you should re-read. Neither of these players are / were "noticeably good" on a consistent basis. However, Cody was able to show he could drive the line when he, at moments, elevated his game. Linden Vey has really been "quietly" putting up points, mostly as the beneficiary.

Once again, I am not stating that is a bad thing, but his raw tools that have so far been displayed aren't convincing me he is a future top 6 forward. A complimentary top 9 forward who could step up to the 2nd line in times of need, such as Higgins, would be a more accurate prediction of his career.

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"Has shown moments" is the part you should re-read. Neither of these players are / were "noticeably good" on a consistent basis. However, Cody was able to show he could drive the line when he, at moments, elevated his game. Linden Vey has really been "quietly" putting up points, mostly as the beneficiary.

Once again, I am not stating that is a bad thing, but his raw tools that have so far been displayed aren't convincing me he is a future top 6 forward. A complimentary top 9 forward who could step up to the 2nd line in times of need, such as Higgins, would be a more accurate prediction of his career.

I am really not sure what moments you are conjuring up.

Well if you can convince yourself of that go ahead and believe what you want. In his first 30 games Cody didn't show anything about driving a line. By about the 40-50 game mark he started to show he can put up points if given sheltered minutes, on a very deep team, where little responsibility is required. He was also playing third line center, not fourth line center, or third line winger.

And Linden has put up 10 points compared to the line drivers 2. In fact, Cody is one step away from being a permanent scratch on the worst team in hockey.

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But perhaps the team only offering a one year deal speaks to the "didn't see Santorelli in our future" question, no?

regards,

G.

Thats right he opted for Toronto's 2 year deal. Which means we probably traded for Vey because Santo didn't sign. Which means the OP's question is invalid as Santo wasn't available any ways. Thanks for reminding me.

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I am really not sure what moments you are conjuring up.

Well if you can convince yourself of that go ahead and believe what you want. In his first 30 games Cody didn't show anything about driving a line. By about the 40-50 game mark he started to show he can put up points if given sheltered minutes, on a very deep team, where little responsibility is required. He was also playing third line center, not fourth line center, or third line winger.

And Linden has put up 10 points compared to the line drivers 2. In fact, Cody is one step away from being a permanent scratch on the worst team in hockey.

I am comparing Cody's first full season with us to Linden Vey's current season (a rookie to a rookie).

A minor example would be Cody's game against Boston, where he elevated his game, scored a beautiful goal, and had a solid all around outing. It clearly indicated, if Cody could play consistently in that form, he would be a solid top 6 forward in the NHL.

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Thats right he opted for Toronto's 2 year deal. Which means we probably traded for Vey because Santo didn't sign. Which means the OP's question is invalid as Santo wasn't available any ways. Thanks for reminding me.

Could be. Vey was acquired June 28. Santorelli signed with the Leafs on July 3.

I'm assuming Santorelli had an offer on the table from the Canucks well before the acquisition of Vey, and had refused it, or at the very least was keeping it as a fall-back in case his agent couldn't come up with any other offers.

regards,

G.

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