ForsbergTheGreat Posted January 10, 2015 Share Posted January 10, 2015 48MPHSlapShot proposal got me thinking. and since this is just armchair GM Cancuck get O'Reilly, 1st Av's get Kassian Tanev, Lack, 2016 2nd Av's do this because they get a young high potential big body RW that currently can fit on the top 9. They get a young stud D that will easily fit into there top 4 and fits with the rest of the teams age group. Last year av's gave up a 2nd round pick to solidify there back up. The Berra experiment did not work out. Lack would not only solidify that role, he'd also give the av's confidence into giving Varly a few more nights off. Av's can afford to give up there first, as there team is already stacked with young prospects/players. The signing of iggy shows that they are in a desire to win now. Kassian, Tanev, and Lack help fills those needs now. Just like when the av's gave up there first for varly. This pushes the avs to be a more complete team. He is slightly overpriced and UFA in 2 years. So the first reduces some of the risk. Canucks do this because O'Reilly is everything the canucks want Kassian to become, He is the same age as kassian and may not be as physical but currently fills the canucks top 6. Kills penalties, plays PP, strong defensively, has produced at a .70 point per game pace over the last 4 years. Tanev is a tuff loss but he is due for a contract extension and currently the only top 4 that canucks doesn't have a NTC. Lack also is moved out to give Markstrom a chance to be brought up. Cauncks get. Franson TO gets Bieksa (15% retained) canucks 2nd TO does this as Franson is set to become UFA. They likely can't afford to resign him, Bieska at roughly only 4 million fits right into TO, plus they love guys that cough of up puck. They do get a character, team leader, gritty defensemen. Canucks do this because they need to get bigger and younger on the point. Franson is exactly that. Bieksa only has 2 years left on his contract for retaining a small chunk of salary is not that big of deal. TO is likely the only place that Juice may accept a deal to since he has a NTC. Canucks get Orlov Caps get Higgins The loss of tanev complete destroys canucks young D pool. Orlov has a tuff road ahead of him with Alzner, Carlson, Orpik, and Niskanen higher up on the depth chart. This added depth has force him to the AHL for a chunk of time this year after putting up 31 points in his first 119 NHL games. Caps also likely lose Ward as he is set to hit ufa. Higgins provides a replacement for him signed at a cheaper contract for 3 more years. Sedin-sedin- Vbrata O'reilly Bonino Burrows Matthias Richardson Jensen/Vey Hansen Horvat Dorsett Franson Edler Hammer Orlov Sbisa Stanton Miller Markstrom Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baer. Posted January 10, 2015 Share Posted January 10, 2015 Don't like the first trade. At all. Tanev is definitely somebody to keep on our roster. Also don't like having no 2nd rounders in the next 2 drafts. Also doubt Bieksa would waive for Toronto of all places. Washington trade is...ok. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ManUtd Posted January 10, 2015 Share Posted January 10, 2015 No. We aren't giving up our first. Too much risk of it being a top 10 pick and it will almost certainly be top 15. Can't give that up in a good draft year when we have pretty much the worst prospect pool in the league. Tanev is a great piece and I would absolutely love him if he were a lefty but he's not. EJ, Barrie, Tanev would be a great right side but unfortunately with the absolute garbage that would be next to them it wouldn't do a whole lot to solve our defensive woes. We'd be further ahead to get back less pieces but send ROR somewhere that will give us an actual viable option to play next to EJ then hope and pray one of Bigras or Siemens is ready to play with Barrie next year. That or just write off the season and go hard after Staal/Sekera/Ehrhoff in the summer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
asian player Posted January 10, 2015 Share Posted January 10, 2015 I'd do that first deal in a heartbeat. He'll want a big raise but with Horvat, Gaunce, Jensen, Shinkaruk, McCann, Cassels, Corrado on ElC and RFA contracts for the next few years, we can afford it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coastal.view Posted January 10, 2015 Share Posted January 10, 2015 i do not see how this can fit under the cap from vancouver's perspective we have to replace some of the departing bodies and they take up cap space in addition to the cap space to accommomdate what is sought in this post Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Odd. Posted January 10, 2015 Share Posted January 10, 2015 No. We aren't giving up our first. Too much risk of it being a top 10 pick and it will almost certainly be top 15. Can't give that up in a good draft year when we have pretty much the worst prospect pool in the league. Tanev is a great piece and I would absolutely love him if he were a lefty but he's not. EJ, Barrie, Tanev would be a great right side but unfortunately with the absolute garbage that would be next to them it wouldn't do a whole lot to solve our defensive woes. We'd be further ahead to get back less pieces but send ROR somewhere that will give us an actual viable option to play next to EJ then hope and pray one of Bigras or Siemens is ready to play with Barrie next year. That or just write off the season and go hard after Staal/Sekera/Ehrhoff in the summer. If you look carefully, you will see that WE are getting the Avs first. We ain't giving out our 1st. I think all of these trades are fair. However the Toronto one I think we need to add a tad little bit more. Avs could trade their 1st seeing as that they have tremendous, quality prospects with an already young team. I'm to lazy to calculate the salary cap. Wish we still had capgeek. anyways i do think we are over the cap with these trades though. This proposal I really like. Sedin/Sedin/Vrbata ROR/Bonino/Jensen Matthias/Richardson/Vey Dorsett/Horvat/Hansen Edler/Franson Orlov/Hamhuis Sbisa/Stanton Corrado Miller Markstrom. Hmm. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coastal.view Posted January 10, 2015 Share Posted January 10, 2015 and furthermore the ror contract destroys the salary grid on any team he is with he ensured that colorado cannot offer bridge contracts they now have to move directly from entry level contracts to full value payments that's what made ror contract so crazy colorado should have let calgary have him when they signed him to that deal Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ManUtd Posted January 10, 2015 Share Posted January 10, 2015 If you look carefully, you will see that WE are getting the Avs first. We ain't giving out our 1st. I think all of these trades are fair. However the Toronto one I think we need to add a tad little bit more. Avs could trade their 1st seeing as that they have tremendous, quality prospects with an already young team. I'm to lazy to calculate the salary cap. Wish we still had capgeek. anyways i do think we are over the cap with these trades though. This proposal I really like. Sedin/Sedin/Vrbata ROR/Bonino/Jensen Matthias/Richardson/Vey Dorsett/Horvat/Hansen Edler/Franson Orlov/Hamhuis Sbisa/Stanton Corrado Miller Markstrom. Hmm. You didn't read the whole post, did you? It's pretty obvious from the rest of it that when I said "we" I meant the Avs. I would have thought the avatar and sig would have given that away anyways... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fox Mulder Posted January 10, 2015 Share Posted January 10, 2015 You didn't read the whole post, did you? It's pretty obvious from the rest of it that when I said "we" I meant the Avs. I would have thought the avatar and sig would have given that away anyways... I thought the same thing. Then I read it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billabong Posted January 10, 2015 Share Posted January 10, 2015 Ror would be a great asset but he will be demanding 7m his next contract because he thinks he's the best hockey player of all time. Other teams are much more need of his services and can afford to pay more to get him and keep him around (edm, tor, la, sj, nyi, nyr, ott and stl) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pimp C Posted January 12, 2015 Share Posted January 12, 2015 First 2 proposals are incredibly moronic Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ForsbergTheGreat Posted January 12, 2015 Author Share Posted January 12, 2015 i do not see how this can fit under the cap from vancouver's perspective we have to replace some of the departing bodies and they take up cap space in addition to the cap space to accommomdate what is sought in this post Canucks have 1.9 in cap space currently Going to Av's is 4.9, coming back it 6, leaving canucks .9 in space after the 1st deal Franson this year only makes 3.3, so this year in the second deal canucks would be saving .7 In the third deal higgins is 2.5 while orlov is only 2 so again canucks save .5 All in all canucks would have 2.1 in cap space. after the 3 deals. No. We aren't giving up our first. Too much risk of it being a top 10 pick and it will almost certainly be top 15. Can't give that up in a good draft year when we have pretty much the worst prospect pool in the league. Tanev is a great piece and I would absolutely love him if he were a lefty but he's not. EJ, Barrie, Tanev would be a great right side but unfortunately with the absolute garbage that would be next to them it wouldn't do a whole lot to solve our defensive woes. We'd be further ahead to get back less pieces but send ROR somewhere that will give us an actual viable option to play next to EJ then hope and pray one of Bigras or Siemens is ready to play with Barrie next year. That or just write off the season and go hard after Staal/Sekera/Ehrhoff in the summer. You make some valid points, especially with Tanev being a right handed shot.. My idea was Av's likely don't feel there pick will be a top ten they have been coming on strong and even still have a shot at making playoffs. Come trade deadline, if Av's have a bit of a shot of making the post season I think that pick will definitely be in play. Tanev, Kassian, and Lack are all under 26 so it fits within the rest of the core and they are all current NHL impact players. 3 years ahead of development of a 2015 draft pick. Realistically if Av's did put O'Reilly and there first on the market they'd get a ton of bigger offers coming back. Likely more than what I had the canucks offer. First 2 proposals are incredibly moronic Yeah I don't know why anyone would want a 24 year old 60 point player, plus an additional 1st round pick this year. I also don't know why anyone would want a 27 year old 6.5 player who's on pace to put up 55 points this season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warhippy Posted January 12, 2015 Share Posted January 12, 2015 Canucks have 1.9 in cap space currently Going to Av's is 4.9, coming back it 6, leaving canucks .9 in space after the 1st deal Franson this year only makes 3.3, so this year in the second deal canucks would be saving .7 In the third deal higgins is 2.5 while orlov is only 2 so again canucks save .5 All in all canucks would have 2.1 in cap space. after the 3 deals. You make some valid points, especially with Tanev being a right handed shot.. My idea was Av's likely don't feel there pick will be a top ten they have been coming on strong and even still have a shot at making playoffs. Come trade deadline, if Av's have a bit of a shot of making the post season I think that pick will definitely be in play. Tanev, Kassian, and Lack are all under 26 so it fits within the rest of the core and they are all current NHL impact players. 3 years ahead of development of a 2015 draft pick. Realistically if Av's did put O'Reilly and there first on the market they'd get a ton of bigger offers coming back. Likely more than what I had the canucks offer. Yeah I don't know why anyone would want a 24 year old 60 point player, plus an additional 1st round pick this year. I also don't know why anyone would want a 27 year old 6.5 player who's on pace to put up 55 points this season. I have to say you qualified that trade very well. And Man Utd that's a very good point for a team that is so full of young studs. you're right in that the prospect pool isn't entirely the deepest. Tanev would work well with Bigras/Siemens. Lack slots in very quickly and gives the Avs that options on Varlamov should they decide to dangle him somehwhere Kassian almost immediately solidifies that issue with NHL ready young RW's (same issue we kinda have) And a 2nd is a beauty throw in All of this under solid contract or needing minimal increase in pay for the cost of a player they may not be able to retain in ROR and a 1st. I agree that's a gamble but the payoffs are immediate as opposed to over time. This also gives the canucks the option to flip ROR to someone else as well and recoup any loss in the event he won't sign with them leaving the Avs almost risk free. In a different world does this happen? Probably now probably not. But it is hard to argue that doesn't make the Avs better Lack being the question mark for value to them; but Kassian and Tanev help now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
desiboynux4lifee******* Posted January 12, 2015 Share Posted January 12, 2015 Like the first trade and the 3rd trade. With the leaf trade just wait until off-season, if this team underachieves Benning has promised change! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J.I.A.H.N Posted January 12, 2015 Share Posted January 12, 2015 #1. Colorado...... O'Reilly + 1st for Van...... Kassian, Tanev, Lack, and 2016 2nd Love it! #2. Caps........Orlov for Van.........Higgins Simple Don't like the payment for Toronto's Franson for Van's Bieska and a 2nd I might add a 5th on our end....nothing more or like another post said wait until summer....love Bieska alot It sure would change the time table a lot........ Wouldn't mind Buffalo or Carolina's 2105-2nd for Hansen and our 2015-2nd as a touch up to our 2nd Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pimp C Posted January 12, 2015 Share Posted January 12, 2015 Yeah I don't know why anyone would want a 24 year old 60 point player, plus an additional 1st round pick this year. I also don't know why anyone would want a 27 year old 6.5 player who's on pace to put up 55 points this season. Yeah, it makes sense to trade a 25 year old top pairing defensemen. I mean we could just insert sbisa in his spot and everything would go swimmingly amirite? And yes, lets retain salary on Bieksa and add a 2nd round draft pick for a UFA. Excellent idea. If only you were the Canucks GM right now, your moves would make us an elite team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ForsbergTheGreat Posted January 12, 2015 Author Share Posted January 12, 2015 No you replace him with a 27 year old 6’5” top paring defencemen. Or did ya miss that part? Either Bieska or Hammer is gone by end of next season, both UFA’s both starting to age. With Tanev being moved in the first deal I’d rather keep the more defensive minded defensemen. If you did the math,(which you probably didn’t) 15% of his cap it, is only 690K. Nothing to be worried about since it only affects the canucks next year. But it does mean that for TO, they just added a veteran top 4, for under 4 million. But a 33 year old Bieska alone (even with retained cap hit) won’t be enough in a 1 for 1 deal, which is why a second is included, They will either want a pick or prospect, something that cost them next to nothing in cap space. Franson may be UFA at the end of the year, but he will also be a hot commodity at trade deadline. Exactly why a 2nd round pick is added. Could it be conditional whether he re-signs? Sure. But if canucks trade for a player like Franson they’d do it with full intention of re-upping him. Unlike some of the other UFA rentals we’ve picked up. Overall… Canucks D core gets bigger and younger. Canucks also get a true top 6 forward had produces at a 60 point pace over the last 3 years. Not to mention that he’s still only 23 (turning 24 in Feb) and would fit in nicely with the future core of canucks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hlaevang Posted January 12, 2015 Share Posted January 12, 2015 As much as I would hate to lose Tanev and Kassian, I love the value we get back in the first trade. That said, swapping Kassian for Jensen might work for Colorado as well. I am content to wait till the off season on Franson for the simple fact that I highly doubt Bieksa will waive to go to TO. Few players in Vancouver would actually. The third proposal is fair for what we get back in return. All in all, good job OP. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ManUtd Posted January 12, 2015 Share Posted January 12, 2015 You make some valid points, especially with Tanev being a right handed shot.. My idea was Av's likely don't feel there pick will be a top ten they have been coming on strong and even still have a shot at making playoffs. Come trade deadline, if Av's have a bit of a shot of making the post season I think that pick will definitely be in play. Tanev, Kassian, and Lack are all under 26 so it fits within the rest of the core and they are all current NHL impact players. 3 years ahead of development of a 2015 draft pick. Realistically if Av's did put O'Reilly and there first on the market they'd get a ton of bigger offers coming back. Likely more than what I had the canucks offer. Really have very little interest in Lack. Pickard acquitted himself well when he was up with the team this year. As soon as we get rid of Berra, he'll be the backup. Sure Lack would likely be even better but not so much so that it's worth giving up assets for at this point. We're tied to Berra for the time being anyways. That's the only reason Pickard was sent back down. Avs have more need for a centre than a RW if ROR is moved anyways. Mack is flat out not ready to handle top 6 centre responsibilities yet. To the point he's now playing RW on the 3rd line with Mitchell and Talbot. If ROR goes we need someone to slot in between Tangs and Iggy. We're still a long shot to make the playoffs this year and there's too much risk in trading the 1st this year unless we're getting a surefire long term partner for EJ. I just don't see any kind of ROR to Van deal unless Edler or Hamhuis are on the table. I doubt either of them would waive so it's just not going to happen. We're better off trying to work out a ROR+ deal for Pouliot/Despres and Sutter, or Yandle and Vermette (provided they will both extend), or Phaneuf (with salary retained) and Bozak, or some other deal along the lines of LD to play with EJ and replacement C who can be a stop gap top 6 C until Mack is ready and then slotted on the 3rd after. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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