BBQ Sauce99 Posted March 25, 2015 Share Posted March 25, 2015 Hey ppl! First time posting so please be nice if I'm in the wrong area/board/section. I have a story for CDC as my first post . I ran into a gentleman at work (rather not disclose were I work lol..), this fellow worked for the NY Islanders scouting department and was in charge of scouting the whole WHL. Let's call him Mr.X, as I don't want to use his name either. I thought it was a really unique job so we started talking. I was really interested in the different players that he thought were good and players he thought were "meh". He told me about the different areas in a scouted players game that he would look for, and what his thoughts were about McDavid. Than the conversation led to WHL players who were eligable to be drafted this year, One player who I've always liked is Mathew Barzal. I always thought he was a really great player, and Mr.X said "he's a very unique, dynamic forward". He told me that this new generation of players (2013-2016 Drafts) are very, very good; and lot of great players are going to come up. Anyway I was really excited about this draft and thought that maybe the Canucks could somehow move up to choose Barzal; but Mr.X said that there were quite a few teams who had scouted Barzal and even interviewed him at something..(Sorry I can't remember what exactly but I recall him saying that every team was somewhere with draft eligible players asking questions??). He than went on to say that the Canucks hadn't done very much scouting in the WHL from what he's heard. This is were it gets weird because I really wanted to know more about the Canucks and why they hadn't scouted Barzal, for my own knowledge. He said that from what he's heard that Canucks and JB haven't really looked far into the WHL, rather they've spent time in the NCAA/OHL/Europe. Mr.X said that it wasn't a bad thing, because the Canucks got "lucky" with Horvat, and "they have some decent center prospects". So that's my story, I am a big fan of Mathew Barzal and hope the Canucks do trade up for him, but wouldn't mind seeing who/where JB has been really looking at in the NCAA/OHL/Europe . (Sorry for the long first post lol..) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
asian player Posted March 25, 2015 Share Posted March 25, 2015 The Canucks didn't have any issue scouting Virtanen. And wasn't Benning scouting Harkins recently? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G. Reaper Posted March 25, 2015 Share Posted March 25, 2015 Great first post! Something different than the usual stuff posted here. Definitely worth looking into. JB is a smart man and he's probably the best scout manager in the league. I could see him finding the next big thing where not many other GMs are looking. He'll send his minions in to scout the game to game and come up with a surprise for next season. Let's do some DD and see what we can find! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Noseforthenet Posted March 25, 2015 Share Posted March 25, 2015 This isn't anything new. The Nucks scouts hardly ever scout the Dub and it has been that way for around 10 years. They scout colleges (Tanev, Kesler, Schroeder) Europe (Lack, Tryamikin, Tommernes, etc) and the OHL (Horvat, Gaunce, Fox, Cassels, Subban, Jensen, Mccann.) This is what really frustrates me about the scouting here and I think that's going to change in the next couple of years. The WHL has produced a ton of really good NHL players. Players whom the Nucks have passed on. Players whom our 1st round picks should have been used for instead of traded away (I.E. Emerson Etem.) The player we wanted from the OHL (Jarrett Tinordi) was picked already, so we let that pick go in the Ballard trade when it could have been used on Etem (WHL), who is going to be a very good player. And it's all because our scouts know hardly anything about him. Personally, I think the Nucks need to pull our Europe scouts and place them in the Dub. When is the last time they drafted out of Europe and it turned out?! I'm glad they found Lack, but it's not okay. BTW, I do agree with the focus on college scouting this season. There are ALOT of good players coming out of those ranks in this draft and as free agents (Eichel, Hanifin, O'Connor). And there's more. I believe this year's draft will be good for the Canucks because of this, but we need scouts in the WHL. This can not continue to stand like this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HowYaDrouin Posted March 25, 2015 Share Posted March 25, 2015 This isn't anything new. The Nucks scouts hardly ever scout the Dub and it has been that way for around 10 years. They scout colleges (Tanev, Kesler, Schroeder) Europe (Lack, Tryamikin, Tommernes, etc) and the OHL (Horvat, Gaunce, Fox, Cassels, Subban, Jensen, Mccann.) This is what really frustrates me about the scouting here and I think that's going to change in the next couple of years. The WHL has produced a ton of really good NHL players. Players whom the Nucks have passed on. Players whom our 1st round picks should have been used for instead of traded away (I.E. Emerson Etem.) The player we wanted from the OHL (Jarrett Tinordi) was picked already, so we let that pick go in the Ballard trade when it could have been used on Etem (WHL), who is going to be a very good player. And it's all because our scouts know hardly anything about him.Personally, I think the Nucks need to pull our Europe scouts and place them in the Dub. When is the last time they drafted out of Europe and it turned out?! I'm glad they found Lack, but it's not okay. BTW, I do agree with the focus on college scouting this season. There are ALOT of good players coming out of those ranks in this draft and as free agents (Eichel, Hanifin, O'Connor). And there's more. I believe this year's draft will be good for the Canucks because of this, but we need scouts in the WHL. This can not continue to stand like this. Odd time to post something like that as just this last draft we drafted 2 players from Europe. One was named a 1st Team allstar, who we've subsequently traded for a further along D-prospect (Clendenning), and the other just got called up to the Russian National Team at age 20... (Tryamkin). Not to mention players like Sergei Shirokov, Alex Edler, Eddie Lack, Joakim Ericsson, Ludwig Blomstrand, among others. I'd say Gradin and the rest of the European staff has been fairly successful at finding later round/undrafted talent in Europe. Here's to hoping we can pull some later round gems from Europe, or i'll take Sebastian Aho (either of them) as a consilation prize. It'd be nice to have some talent from the dub, especially seeing players like Damon Severson, Shea Theodore, Nic Petan, Oliver Bjorkstrand have so much success, but as long as we get servicable players from the draft, I could care less what league they come from. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dura_mater Posted March 25, 2015 Share Posted March 25, 2015 Maybe so many people scout the WHL already that JB feels there aren't going to be any steals there or they aren't going to find anything different to what the general consensus is? Isn't a list compiled of what order each player is expected to go? Maybe JB trusts this but feels it's not as reliable for Europe etc and that by scouting these areas he can find some steals. Just some thoughts as I really don't know. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cuporbust Posted March 25, 2015 Share Posted March 25, 2015 This isn't anything new. The Nucks scouts hardly ever scout the Dub and it has been that way for around 10 years. They scout colleges (Tanev, Kesler, Schroeder) Europe (Lack, Tryamikin, Tommernes, etc) and the OHL (Horvat, Gaunce, Fox, Cassels, Subban, Jensen, Mccann.) This is what really frustrates me about the scouting here and I think that's going to change in the next couple of years. The WHL has produced a ton of really good NHL players. Players whom the Nucks have passed on. Players whom our 1st round picks should have been used for instead of traded away (I.E. Emerson Etem.) The player we wanted from the OHL (Jarrett Tinordi) was picked already, so we let that pick go in the Ballard trade when it could have been used on Etem (WHL), who is going to be a very good player. And it's all because our scouts know hardly anything about him. Personally, I think the Nucks need to pull our Europe scouts and place them in the Dub. When is the last time they drafted out of Europe and it turned out?! I'm glad they found Lack, but it's not okay. BTW, I do agree with the focus on college scouting this season. There are ALOT of good players coming out of those ranks in this draft and as free agents (Eichel, Hanifin, O'Connor). And there's more. I believe this year's draft will be good for the Canucks because of this, but we need scouts in the WHL. This can not continue to stand like this. Alex edler was a kelowna rocket Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VancouverDave2010 Posted March 25, 2015 Share Posted March 25, 2015 I hope this isn't too far off topic but about 10 days ago I was in Kingston, Ontario. I had the opportunity to catch the Belleville Bulls vs. the Kingston Frontenacs. For any Flames fans reading this you will be happy to know Sam Bennett was easily the best skater in the game. He didn't even look like he was trying and was still far and away the best player on the ice. For us Canucks fans, I'm sure you're interested in Jordan Subban. Honestly, he didn't impress me a whole lot. He floated for the majority of the game. During one Bulls power play he did show off that Subban stride. From behind his own net to across the opposing blue line in what seemed like 5 powerful strides. The other Canuck's prospect of interest in the game was Frontenacs defence man Evan McEneny. If I recall correctly, McEneny did have a goal and played a solid game defensively. The Frontenacs won 5-2 with an empty netter late. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MJDDawg Posted March 25, 2015 Share Posted March 25, 2015 I'm almost positive that I'd read recently that JB went down to Seattle to personally scout Barzal. Honestly, I'd be shocked if JB hadn't scouted the dub that thoroughly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goalie13 Posted March 25, 2015 Share Posted March 25, 2015 Alex edler was a kelowna rocket Not until after he was drafted. When he was drafted, he was playing tier 3 in Sweden. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YEGCanuck Posted March 25, 2015 Share Posted March 25, 2015 What one third party source says about where the Canucks scout and reality may well be two totally different things. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warhippy Posted March 25, 2015 Share Posted March 25, 2015 Oh that's not shocking When you think of everyone they've literally snubbed their noses at from the Giants and Rockets in the 2nd and later rounds such as Weber, Gallagher, Keith, Severson, Bowey, Bloodhoof, Lucic and about a dozen other players since around 2003 between those two teams You have to wonder what kind of team we'd be icing now IF the canucks had spent just a fraction of time looking at two of the biggest WHL markets in their own back yards Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Outsiders Posted March 25, 2015 Share Posted March 25, 2015 I thought JB went to quiet a few Prince George Cougars games? He has actually scouted the dub. I highly doubt Benning " I love scouting " would not cover/ scout every league out there. Its just not like him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
canuckster19 Posted March 25, 2015 Share Posted March 25, 2015 Think about it though, why would the Canucks send out scouts to the WHL when Jim himself has the Giants close by and three other WHL teams within short travelling distance? Probably don't need to send scouts out when their own management team has easy access to WHL games. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BanTSN Posted March 25, 2015 Share Posted March 25, 2015 lul. This thread was brought to you by Barzal himself or somebody in his family. The thing is you won't need to move up to select him in the draft. He's falling like a rock. The other thing was noted by this supposed guy you've talked to. The Canucks already have a bunch of centers. Right now the Canucks are probably scouring the globe for the best defenseman with the most speed, skill, size and strength that will be available to them at draft, because that's what they need the most right now, by far. But of course Benning and co. have scouted the WHL. This has come up before already. But they're probably crossing fingers that Provorov magically falls to them or they're somehow able to pick up Pilon, rather than Barzal. Other guys who are falling are Kylington and Zacha. Both are WAY more appealing than Barzal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CeeBee51 Posted March 25, 2015 Share Posted March 25, 2015 What one third party source says about where the Canucks scout and reality may well be two totally different things. Ain't that the truth Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Noseforthenet Posted March 25, 2015 Share Posted March 25, 2015 Odd time to post something like that as just this last draft we drafted 2 players from Europe. One was named a 1st Team allstar, who we've subsequently traded for a further along D-prospect (Clendenning), and the other just got called up to the Russian National Team at age 20... (Tryamkin). Not to mention players like Sergei Shirokov, Alex Edler, Eddie Lack, Joakim Ericsson, Ludwig Blomstrand, among others. I'd say Gradin and the rest of the European staff has been fairly successful at finding later round/undrafted talent in Europe. Here's to hoping we can pull some later round gems from Europe, or i'll take Sebastian Aho (either of them) as a consilation prize. It'd be nice to have some talent from the dub, especially seeing players like Damon Severson, Shea Theodore, Nic Petan, Oliver Bjorkstrand have so much success, but as long as we get servicable players from the draft, I could care less what league they come from.Yes and we offloaded Forsling right away and sold high for someone who can play now. Anton Rodin was great in the World Jrs too. So was Jordan Schroeder. The ONLY one of them you can say actually worked out was Alex Edler and that was around 10 years ago. Why even mention Shirokov, Ericsson, and Blomstrand. Neither are ever going to play in the NHL. And people gush over Tryamikin like he's the second coming of Chara or Tyler Myers. He's not. May have gotten lucky with him, but time will tell if he will ever play here. I absolutely stand by what I said. Pull ALL our Euro scouts and place them in the Dub. If they don't want to scout the Dub and stay in Europe, it's time to find some new scouts. There's a reason why the CHL manufactures more NHLers than Europe. Unless the players from Europe are HIGH END Talent, they rarely work out. Sorry to burst your bubble...but I'm not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tiger-Hearted Posted March 25, 2015 Share Posted March 25, 2015 Benning said that scouts can get too much blame whenever prospects don't pan out. The scouting staff are usually given instructions from management on what kind of players to scout. The anti-WHL bias was mostly Gillis. Assistant gm, Laurence Gilman probably set Gillis straight by overhauling the scouting department by having Chief scout Delorme focus on the Dub. Now, with two former WHL players in charge, ie. Linden and Benning, we can expect more prospects from the Dub. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TOMapleLaughs Posted March 25, 2015 Share Posted March 25, 2015 Wait, the Canucks 'got lucky' with Horvat? We had to trade a starting goaltender for the pick and even then people were whining on how we passed on 'generational talent' Nichushkin. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
avelanch Posted March 25, 2015 Share Posted March 25, 2015 Barzal didn't impress me in person at all. i'd rather not take him in the first round, to be honest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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