Dekey Pete Posted June 4, 2015 Share Posted June 4, 2015 so much doom and gloom around a team that's missed the playoffs 1 once in six years. Yes are core is aging but the guys coming up are exciting. I'm a die hard since my dad took me to my first game in 96 vs avs round 1 game 6. (Any one reminder the goal scorers frim that game). The thing with sports is its for our entertainment. As much as we hate seeing the Canucks come up short year after year, I'm still glued to the TV every game to see what happens. I've lived in Edmonton for the last 13 years and grew up in Courtenay. I've got to watch Van steam roll the oilers live for the last 13 years (with the exception of a few games). And living here and seeing their pain believe me we have had it good!! K I'm obviously off track my point is every day van plays Is a day I'm sitting at work excited because I know I have something fun to do that night! Not listen to my wife bitch, or the kids whine... I lock the basement door put on on the blue and green and think.... Maybe this is the F...ing year. I love hockey, I love Canucks.... Yes I am drunk. Goodnight:) Nice to see some optimism for once! I am deeply sorry about you relocating to Edmonton, my condolences. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Me_ Posted June 4, 2015 Share Posted June 4, 2015 once some of the bloated contracts are off the books, JB will have some money to bolster the d corps. In my mind defense is better bought than developed anyway. GONCHAR - FRANSON EDLER - EHRHOFF BIEKSA - SBISA Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TOMapleLaughs Posted June 4, 2015 Share Posted June 4, 2015 once some of the bloated contracts are off the books, JB will have some money to bolster the d corps. In my mind defense is better bought than developed anyway.Well, Boston pretty much bought theirs, so there's that. I guess we're going to eventually get Shea Weber? Noice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gollumpus Posted June 4, 2015 Share Posted June 4, 2015 once some of the bloated contracts are off the books, JB will have some money to bolster the d corps. In my mind defense is better bought than developed anyway. I actually agree with this...well said. So, in the interest of furthing the conversation, how does this viewpoint mesh with the idea that a successful team like Detroit takes the time to develop their young players? Does this mean that a team should only draft forwards? And what of the view which suggests that you have to draft #1 d-man, not acquire one by a trade or as a UFA (both of which cost a lot). regards, G. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VanGnome Posted June 4, 2015 Share Posted June 4, 2015 I've been a diehard fan since '88. I've seen bad teams, good teams and downright great teams in that time. My observation is, what endeared the Canucks to this city was the blue collar work ethic, never say die attitude and an engine that never quits as was displayed by the team from 1988 through 1995. That was 7 solid years of great hockey. Messier came to town and basically destroyed that mantra over night, and ever since we've been a soft, skilled and finesse team ever since, from 2000 to now, basically a decade and a half which is more than twice the amount of time that we've seen what Canuck hockey is really about. The problem is, that those two eras (the Naslund era, and the Sedin era) one or two players dictated how the rest of the roster should play as it set the precedent for the team style. When Smyl, Babych, Lumme, Linden, Bure etc played, the team all played the same way.. gritty, hard nosed and relentless. The past 15 years have shown many players attempting to play in a style conducive to a successful puck possession style, which many cannot sustain. With the current crop of prospects on the way up, almost every single one of them have unparalleled compete levels, never say die attitudes and relentless style of play. For me, the future cannot arrive soon enough. Bring on the youth movement. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghostsof1915 Posted June 4, 2015 Share Posted June 4, 2015 As great at Toews and Kane are. The backbone of Chicago's defence is a player drafted in the 2nd round, and a player drafted 14th overall in the first round. They also have Hjalmarsson who was drafted in the 4th round. Shea Weber was drafted in the second round, as was PK Subban. You can find All-Star Defensemen outside the Top 10. You just have to know what your looking for. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stawns Posted June 4, 2015 Share Posted June 4, 2015 So, in the interest of furthing the conversation, how does this viewpoint mesh with the idea that a successful team like Detroit takes the time to develop their young players? Does this mean that a team should only draft forwards? And what of the view which suggests that you have to draft #1 d-man, not acquire one by a trade or as a UFA (both of which cost a lot). regards, G. dmen are so hit and miss and many of them develop so much later than fwds, that's its nearly impossible to tell at their draft age. Obviously you get franchise dmen, lke Ekblad, who are pretty much can't miss, but the rest are a crap shoot. hence we see so many "franchise dmen" taken in later rounds. I like JB's mindset of poaching young players when they are nearing waiver eligibility and finishing their development process in house and I think that's what we're seeing with Clendenning. I'm also not on the "need a bonafide #1 dman to be successful" boat.........defense, imo, is always best when it's done by committee, form top to bottom, with a mix of different styles. I don't think they need to trade or sign a Shea weber to win the cup, but I do think it's more successful to sign or poach dmen once they start to show their development track than it is to draft and develop them in house. So, yes, unless there is a can't miss d prospect when your pick comes, I, personally, would lean to fwds in the draft if I were a GM. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frazzy Desjardins Posted June 4, 2015 Share Posted June 4, 2015 The guys coming up are not franchise-saving players They aren't Toews/Kane/Crosby/Stamkos/Tavares types that can completely change a franchise They are going to be good, but this team is going to suck for a long time once the Sedins and co. retire What about Brown/bergeron/williams types? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shanghai owey Posted June 4, 2015 Share Posted June 4, 2015 I think we are 1 elite centre away from being a very good team again. other then that we have the pieces in place referring to our top 9 going forward. In the next few years if we trade something like Bonino Mccann and a first to move up into a top 5 and select a centre while in the meantime steadily drafting defenceman we are back on the rise. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goal:thecup Posted June 4, 2015 Share Posted June 4, 2015 so much doom and gloom around a team that's missed the playoffs 1 once in six years. Yes I am drunk. Goodnight:)And...how are you feeling today? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrJockitch Posted June 4, 2015 Share Posted June 4, 2015 We are bringing along the young guys in a winning environment both in Utica and Vancouver. Best to milk the experience and professionalism of the Sedins for all it is worth. We will continue to develop young players in a winning environment bringing them in slowly to the Canucks as the vets move out. A couple players at a time instead of wholesale dumping of veterans. It is hard for young guys to teach young guys how to play in a professional league i.e.:Edmonton. Edmonton and Buffalo dumped everything and now are trying to add quality vets to bring the young ones along. Edmonton has done a terrible job of it, Buffalo probably a bit better. See how this summer goes. Easier to have the guys in the fold than to dump them for dubious return and have to go out looking for them. Currently Travis Green may be the most important man in our franchise outside of the top three. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pistolpro327 Posted June 4, 2015 Share Posted June 4, 2015 I find it funny when people mention players who may retire and then vancouver sucking for a long time. It's not like the owners are going to all of a sudden be okay with not spending max cap to make the team as good as it can possibly be once our best players retire. We will have a ton of cap space to fill holes when our older core begins to retire and by that time some of our young guns will have stepped up and filled roles in the NHL. I highly doubt were going to suck for very long if at all. More than likely become a treadmill type team for a while. Make playoffs but as underdogs or lower seeds. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
awalk Posted June 4, 2015 Share Posted June 4, 2015 I find it funny when people mention players who may retire and then vancouver sucking for a long time. It's not like the owners are going to all of a sudden be okay with not spending max cap to make the team as good as it can possibly be once our best players retire. We will have a ton of cap space to fill holes when our older core begins to retire and by that time some of our young guns will have stepped up and filled roles in the NHL. I highly doubt were going to suck for very long if at all. More than likely become a treadmill type team for a while. Make playoffs but as underdogs or lower seeds. Who are you going to replace the Sedins with? No one of that caliber makes it to free agency anymore. If you're not drafting or grooming star players, and your current star players retire, you're kinda screwed ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Realtor Rod Posted June 5, 2015 Share Posted June 5, 2015 The guys coming up are not franchise-saving players They aren't Toews/Kane/Crosby/Stamkos/Tavares types that can completely change a franchise They are going to be good, but this team is going to suck for a long time once the Sedins and co. retire I am curious if this is your professional opinion? Virtanen and Horvat absolutely could be franchise players. Even Demko could be a franchise goalie,not to mention Markstrom. People are too quick to throw these kids away. Let's just let it unfold before claiming to know the unknown. Virtanen in AHL is turning heads (literally) and Horvat could have been in the Calder running had we needed more from him offensively and put him in that position. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SaintPatrick33 Posted June 5, 2015 Share Posted June 5, 2015 I believe the Canucks forward prospect pool is deep and I am excited to seem them play. However, the issue is if Willie will let them get into the lineup. Kassian and Horvat were given very few minutes at the start while a guy like Vey was getting first power play minutes from the start of camp. This has been the problem with the Canucks for years, is that they fail to let the young guys make an impact right away. Not since Bure, and now Horvat, have we seen a rookie make a huge impact. Let them in and learn from mistakes while we have the veteran core here. IMO the 3rd and 4th lines should be all young guys. You seen once Kassian was given first line minutes the impact he had, and Horvats line was often the best line for most of the season. LET THE YOUNG GUYS PLAY WILLIE! We still have a veteran core, its not like Edmonton where the youngsters have all the pressure. At the very least, Virtanen, Cassels, Baerstchi, Shinkaruk and should see plenty of time in the bigs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gaudette Celly Posted June 5, 2015 Share Posted June 5, 2015 What are you even doing here with an attitude like that? Honestly. Going by his negative and non-constructive posting history, I'd say it starts with "t" and ends with "rolling"... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crabcakes Posted June 5, 2015 Share Posted June 5, 2015 JB is going to be drafting players he thinks will develop well. Character players. I have been told on CDC that development is a much bigger factor than talent in determining how good players will be by the time they hit their prime at 26-30 years old. That's right, we have to wait 9 years after they are drafted. Of course some reach a very high level at a very young age but most continue to improve. At any rate, nobody can tell for sure how good players will get or how long it will take. It took the Sedins 5-6 years to reach the 70 point plateau. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SaintPatrick33 Posted June 5, 2015 Share Posted June 5, 2015 JB is going to be drafting players he thinks will develop well. Character players. I have been told on CDC that development is a much bigger factor than talent in determining how good players will be by the time they hit their prime at 26-30 years old. That's right, we have to wait 9 years after they are drafted. Of course some reach a very high level at a very young age but most continue to improve. At any rate, nobody can tell for sure how good players will get or how long it will take. It took the Sedins 5-6 years to reach the 70 point plateau. Yikes, 9 years is a long time to wait. A team like Detroit could get away with it, simply because they had stability at the GM and Coach position, and kept winning in the process. Once the Canucks start to lose, everyone wants the quick fix. I sure hope that Linden and Benning stay, I question a few moves, but still 5 years should be enough to really get their young prospects and style of play imprinted on this franchise. I dont mind a few losing seasons, as long as the young guys are playing and learning with the Sedins. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gaudette Celly Posted June 5, 2015 Share Posted June 5, 2015 ...which is why Benning went out finding assets to fill holes, both for the short and longer term. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WilliesStache14 Posted June 5, 2015 Share Posted June 5, 2015 I am curious if this is your professional opinion? Virtanen and Horvat absolutely could be franchise players. Even Demko could be a franchise goalie,not to mention Markstrom.People are too quick to throw these kids away. Let's just let it unfold before claiming to know the unknown. Virtanen in AHL is turning heads (literally) and Horvat could have been in the Calder running had we needed more from him offensively and put him in that position. where did I throw them away? I said they're going to be good But they are not at the same level as the other guys I mentioned and I don't expect them to be, not expecting them to become 50+ goal or 100+ point players If they prove me wrong then great, but i'm not holding my breath. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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