Boudrias Posted April 17, 2019 Share Posted April 17, 2019 Just now, Pepe Silvia said: Just curious as to why you don't think Torts got a fair shake here. Not a fair shake simply because of the players he was given. Not enough talent for a serious CUP contention and no apparent commitment to get younger. Even in his exit presser he called for a re-build. It just seemed to me that he took a lot of the heat for what was a management and ownership issue. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Pepe Silvia Posted April 17, 2019 Popular Post Share Posted April 17, 2019 2 minutes ago, Boudrias said: Not a fair shake simply because of the players he was given. Not enough talent for a serious CUP contention and no apparent commitment to get younger. Even in his exit presser he called for a re-build. It just seemed to me that he took a lot of the heat for what was a management and ownership issue. I can agree with you on the 'stale' roster. But I don't think Torts made enough effort to fully invested himself here either. Here is the Canucks Army article highlighting some of the weird things he did while he was here: https://canucksarmy.com/2014/05/16/john-tortorella-s-short-tenure-apparently-consisted-of-some-weird-things/ The main thing I found odd, the guy lived in Point Roberts to allegedly save some coin. The team complains they weren't practicing enough, why? Cause Torts was too lazy to drive from Point Roberts to downtown? Not conversing with Utica coach Travis Green, all season. You'd think they'd chat fairly often. I have no source for this, but I remember when the Canucks had their rookies in Penticton, Torts opted not to go. As far as I recall, Torts was the only Coach of the teams not to go. You would think he would want to know what's in the system if he's new to the organization and calling for youth. Once again, I'm going off memory and can't find a source for this. Don't forget the 2014 Heritage Classic fiasco. Seemed like a big 'F you' to fans and the organization. I know I'm being nit picky, but in my opinion, you get what you give. Torts didn't really seem to give a s*** here. 5 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kanukfanatic Posted April 18, 2019 Share Posted April 18, 2019 19 hours ago, filthycanuck said: Yup and you win the "nobody cares what you think" award. Lets hear the speech! Im sure your grade 1 hooked on phonics can be put to good use Rant on filthy dude. Some poster says 8 of our players are 40 to 50 point players yet not one of them was close. Rant on....lol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kanukfanatic Posted April 18, 2019 Share Posted April 18, 2019 (edited) 19 hours ago, filthycanuck said: Well that "idiot" has played over a 1000 games in the NHL, scored probably more points than most Canucks have in their careers. How about you Kanukfanatic? What makes you so credible. oh thats right. NOTHING Stop acting like you're smarter than everyone else because you an inbred moron Settle down... CUPCAKE! Wow...I did big letters too!!! Edit: you spelz goodss!!! Edited April 18, 2019 by Kanukfanatic 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phat Fingers Posted April 18, 2019 Share Posted April 18, 2019 8 hours ago, Pepe Silvia said: I can agree with you on the 'stale' roster. But I don't think Torts made enough effort to fully invested himself here either. Here is the Canucks Army article highlighting some of the weird things he did while he was here: https://canucksarmy.com/2014/05/16/john-tortorella-s-short-tenure-apparently-consisted-of-some-weird-things/ The main thing I found odd, the guy lived in Point Roberts to allegedly save some coin. The team complains they weren't practicing enough, why? Cause Torts was too lazy to drive from Point Roberts to downtown? Not conversing with Utica coach Travis Green, all season. You'd think they'd chat fairly often. I have no source for this, but I remember when the Canucks had their rookies in Penticton, Torts opted not to go. As far as I recall, Torts was the only Coach of the teams not to go. You would think he would want to know what's in the system if he's new to the organization and calling for youth. Once again, I'm going off memory and can't find a source for this. Don't forget the 2014 Heritage Classic fiasco. Seemed like a big 'F you' to fans and the organization. I know I'm being nit picky, but in my opinion, you get what you give. Torts didn't really seem to give a s*** here. Agreed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
filthycanuck Posted April 18, 2019 Share Posted April 18, 2019 5 hours ago, Kanukfanatic said: Settle down... CUPCAKE! Wow...I did big letters too!!! Edit: you spelz goodss!!! You spelled cupcake right! bravo! Did you need help with google doing that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
filthycanuck Posted April 18, 2019 Share Posted April 18, 2019 5 hours ago, Kanukfanatic said: Rant on filthy dude. Some poster says 8 of our players are 40 to 50 point players yet not one of them was close. Rant on....lol. I didn't say I agreed with him, doesnt mean I have to discredit his comment either. Whats your assumption based on then? F-all, thats what I thought. Must be lonely in your moms basement in Victoria Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HorvatToBaertschi Posted April 18, 2019 Share Posted April 18, 2019 8 hours ago, Kanukfanatic said: Rant on filthy dude. Some poster says 8 of our players are 40 to 50 point players yet not one of them was close. Rant on....lol. None of them were close? Are you just choosing to be stupid? EP Edler Boeser Horvat Baertschi Pearson Leivo all had at least 40-50 point paces for us. All of them. That’s 7 right there. 4 of them are our future 2nd unit players so 4/5 of our 2nd unit are 40-50 point players. I don’t understand why you’re not interpreting the stats correctly. Baertschi Leivo Pearson and Edler are the people I’m referring to, since you like to misinterpret everything I say. Bo EP anybody(they like to use granlund for some reason so why not) Boeser Hughes Baertschi Gaudette Pearson Leivo(could be interchangeable with the 1st PP Player) Edler thats a FINE powerplay Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kanukfanatic Posted April 19, 2019 Share Posted April 19, 2019 Soooo...how about that Boeser. He is an actual 56 point player this year lol. Nope...not imaginary. 66 actual points in 82 games if you pro rate it. Now the team just needs some actual other players (other than petey 66 and horvat 61) that can get points. Tampa had 9 players with 40 points or more this year including a 128, a 98, and a 92. I know some people think the Canucks can compete next year but they are AT LEAST a couple years away. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
48MPHSlapShot Posted April 19, 2019 Share Posted April 19, 2019 4 minutes ago, Kanukfanatic said: I know some people think the Canucks can compete next year but they are AT LEAST a couple years away. But they competed this year.... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-AJ- Posted April 19, 2019 Share Posted April 19, 2019 8 minutes ago, Kanukfanatic said: Soooo...how about that Boeser. He is an actual 56 point player this year lol. Nope...not imaginary. 66 actual points in 82 games if you pro rate it. Now the team just needs some actual other players (other than petey 66 and horvat 61) that can get points. Tampa had 9 players with 40 points or more this year including a 128, a 98, and a 92. I know some people think the Canucks can compete next year but they are AT LEAST a couple years away. I agree that we're still a bit away from playoff level, but I'm not sure if you're comparing us to Tampa to determine if were playoff-ready or not. Tampa is not your everyday playoff team (that can be taken positively and negatively now I suppose ). I think we're not there yet, but we're getting close. I'm banking on us making it into the playoffs for 2020-21. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kootenay Gold Posted April 19, 2019 Share Posted April 19, 2019 19 minutes ago, -AJ- said: I agree that we're still a bit away from playoff level, but I'm not sure if you're comparing us to Tampa to determine if were playoff-ready or not. Tampa is not your everyday playoff team (that can be taken positively and negatively now I suppose ). I think we're not there yet, but we're getting close. I'm banking on us making it into the playoffs for 2020-21. Depending on what moves JB makes in the off season; they may get a taste as early as next year. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-AJ- Posted April 19, 2019 Share Posted April 19, 2019 8 minutes ago, Kootenay Gold said: Depending on what moves JB makes in the off season; they may get a taste as early as next year. Agreed. If Benning makes any big splashes in FA, that could definitely propel us into the playoff picture. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kanukfanatic Posted April 19, 2019 Share Posted April 19, 2019 (edited) 53 minutes ago, Kanukfanatic said: Soooo...how about that Boeser. He is an actual 56 point player this year lol. Nope...not imaginary. 66 actual points in 82 games if you pro rate it. Now the team just needs some actual other players (other than petey 66 and horvat 61) that can get points. Tampa had 9 players with 40 points or more this year including a 128, a 98, and a 92. I know some people think the Canucks can compete next year but they are AT LEAST a couple years away. AJ: Fair enough about comparing to Tampa might not be the best idea. Just showing the huge difference between what an elite team scores like and where we are...which is miles away. How about we compare to the worst team (by points) that actually made the playoffs this year: Vancouver Colorado Petey 66 MacK 99 Horvat 61 Rantanen 87 Boeser 56 Landeskog 75 Edler 34 Barrie 59 Roussel 31 Soderberg 49 Kerfoot 42 Compher 32 So to even be as good as the worst team to even make the playoffs this year we would need the following: 1. a 33% increase by petey - possible?? 2. a 32% increase by Bo - probably not...he will probably get better but not by that much. 3. a 20 something % increase by Boeser - maybe. 4. not sure who will get 59....maybe pearson if he had his best year ever by quite a bit....a UFA if JB can land a big fish 5. then you still need at least 3 players that can get into the 40s. It doesn't look like it will be easier to score as much as even the worst team in the playoffs this year. I don't think it is impossible if JB has a really good summer but we shall see. Having said this, I am still excited about where the team is headed. I am just not silly enough to say we have 8 40-50 point players lmao. Edited April 19, 2019 by Kanukfanatic Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kootenay Gold Posted April 19, 2019 Share Posted April 19, 2019 I think if JB can add an elite or at least close to elite winger and a mobile and productive top 4 D-man, besides having Hughes on the back end; that may improve the point totals of a lot of the Canuck forwards that have not had the supporting framework in place to be the best they can be. We should have a much better picture of how next years season might turn out after analyzing the moves that JB makes in the off season. Does he make some bold moves and bring in some top end elite talent or does he take the more conservative route and bring in some players that are best suited in the middle six role? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aGENT Posted April 19, 2019 Share Posted April 19, 2019 3 hours ago, Kanukfanatic said: AJ: Fair enough about comparing to Tampa might not be the best idea. Just showing the huge difference between what an elite team scores like and where we are...which is miles away. How about we compare to the worst team (by points) that actually made the playoffs this year: Vancouver Colorado Petey 66 MacK 99 Horvat 61 Rantanen 87 Boeser 56 Landeskog 75 Edler 34 Barrie 59 Roussel 31 Soderberg 49 Kerfoot 42 Compher 32 So to even be as good as the worst team to even make the playoffs this year we would need the following: 1. a 33% increase by petey - possible?? 2. a 32% increase by Bo - probably not...he will probably get better but not by that much. 3. a 20 something % increase by Boeser - maybe. 4. not sure who will get 59....maybe pearson if he had his best year ever by quite a bit....a UFA if JB can land a big fish 5. then you still need at least 3 players that can get into the 40s. It doesn't look like it will be easier to score as much as even the worst team in the playoffs this year. I don't think it is impossible if JB has a really good summer but we shall see. Having said this, I am still excited about where the team is headed. I am just not silly enough to say we have 8 40-50 point players lmao. Colorado is about 2'ish years ahead of us in their rebuild. Have as look and see what those guys in COL were scoring 2-3 years ago and you'll have your answer. P.S. I'd say Horvat is more comparable to Landeskog, Boeser to Rantanen, Hughes hopefully to Barrie, Pearson to Soderberg, Virtanen to Kerfoot, Edler to Johnson etc, etc... We're not there yet but we're getting there. With the right moves, next year legit bubble team (like COL last year), year after that potential first round upsetters. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darkstar Posted April 19, 2019 Share Posted April 19, 2019 3 On 4/17/2019 at 9:07 AM, Kanukfanatic said: Yeah. Ok. You said they are 40-50 point players. Their average THIS year was around 18. So yeah...if every single one played the whole year that would go up to 23. NOT 40-50 HAHA. Come on. I mean...I like Gaudette as hopefully a useful 3rd line centre. Hopefully he has a bit of upside on that. But now he is "ONE OF THE BEST HOCKEY MINDS AS A FUTURE 70 PT CENTER"? Even if some idiot like ferraro said it...well that source should tell you everything. Hahaha...good god that is bad evaluation. GAUDETTE HAD 12 POINTS THIS YEAR!! If he gets 35 in his prime most would be happy. Your valuation is so far off....well...Nevermind. Nitpicker - yeah that is what I am. You say they are 40-50 pt players..but they averaged 18. That is nitpicking lol. Oh boy. Kiddo, not all players can jump out of the gate in the NHL and put up the points that Pettersson and Boeser did. Gaudette had horrible line-mates, but he still had an impressive season. He's a young two-way forward, with a ton of potential. At the same age, Kesler had 16 points in 48 games. The numbers aren't too far off. The biggest test for Gaudette will be next season. He could easily be a 60-70 point player in this league. He won the Hobey Baker Award in the NCAA, and had an impressive showing in the AHL (11 points in 14 games). He's probably the most underrated young player in the system. Making hot takes based on his stats is a waste of time at this point. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post -AJ- Posted April 19, 2019 Popular Post Share Posted April 19, 2019 18 hours ago, Kanukfanatic said: AJ: Fair enough about comparing to Tampa might not be the best idea. Just showing the huge difference between what an elite team scores like and where we are...which is miles away. How about we compare to the worst team (by points) that actually made the playoffs this year: Vancouver Colorado Petey 66 MacK 99 Horvat 61 Rantanen 87 Boeser 56 Landeskog 75 Edler 34 Barrie 59 Roussel 31 Soderberg 49 Kerfoot 42 Compher 32 So to even be as good as the worst team to even make the playoffs this year we would need the following: 1. a 33% increase by petey - possible?? 2. a 32% increase by Bo - probably not...he will probably get better but not by that much. 3. a 20 something % increase by Boeser - maybe. 4. not sure who will get 59....maybe pearson if he had his best year ever by quite a bit....a UFA if JB can land a big fish 5. then you still need at least 3 players that can get into the 40s. It doesn't look like it will be easier to score as much as even the worst team in the playoffs this year. I don't think it is impossible if JB has a really good summer but we shall see. Having said this, I am still excited about where the team is headed. I am just not silly enough to say we have 8 40-50 point players lmao. Colorado was 10th in scoring this year. While it's possible we eventually get to that level, you could also be a more defensive team and make it to the playoffs. Dallas, for instance was carried by Ben Bishop and Khudobin and actually scored fewer goals than the Canucks this year, finishing 29th out of 31 teams in scoring. After Seguin and Radulov, their offense kind of falls of a cliff, with Klingberg coming in 3rd (by points-per-game) and Benn, who had a poor year by his standards, scoring at a lower rate than Horvat. After that, it falls off even more, with their next (4th place) current forward being Roope Hintz at a pathetic 0.38 points-per-game. They have no scoring depth whatsoever and even their top players are only marginally better than what Vancouver has. By comparison, Vancouver's 4th and 5th ranked forwards (by points-per-game) are ahead at 0.48 (Roussel) and 0.43 (Goldobin). Now I'm not saying Vancouver is as good as Dallas--there's a reason they're in the playoffs and we're not. My point is just that offense alone isn't the one metric to get you into the playoffs and that a team with offense at our level could make the playoffs, if your goaltending/defense is strong enough, as evidenced by Dallas this year. Of note, I will also be to the first to admit this is quite an anomaly. Dallas was 29th in offense, but 2nd in goals against. It's more likely that a defensive team make it through with a less lopsided game, but it can still happen. 1 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kanukfanatic Posted April 19, 2019 Share Posted April 19, 2019 (edited) 14 hours ago, Darkstar said: Oh boy. Kiddo, not all players can jump out of the gate in the NHL and put up the points that Pettersson and Boeser did. Gaudette had horrible line-mates, but he still had an impressive season. He's a young two-way forward, with a ton of potential. At the same age, Kesler had 16 points in 48 games. The numbers aren't too far off. The biggest test for Gaudette will be next season. He could easily be a 60-70 point player in this league. He won the Hobey Baker Award in the NCAA, and had an impressive showing in the AHL (11 points in 14 games). He's probably the most underrated young player in the system. Making hot takes based on his stats is a waste of time at this point. Kiddo? lol ok. You can call my adult son that boyo. Anyway, re read my post. I am quite high on Gaudette myself and agree with your first bolded statement. The whole point of my post was about how ridiculous it is to say we had eight 40-50 point players when in fact we had three. And as for your second bolded statement "He could easily be a 60-70 point player in this league" - it is that kind of extreme exaggeration that I find stupid. There are 55 - 70 point or higher players in the entire NHL. 55 - There are only 1 or 2 of those type of players on any given NHL team except the elite teams. We didn't have 1. Petey didn't get 70, Horvat didn't get 70, Boeser didn't get 70. And you say Gaudette could easily do it?? Really?? Pro scouts predicted Gaudette as possibly a 3rd line centre which would be very good for a 5th round pick. People saying he will be a 70 point player are high as &^%$ imo. Could Gaudette, at 22 years old continue to develop? Absolutely. BUT he only had 12 points this year. If he doubled that next year (to 24) that would be great. Then if he doubled that (24 to 48) the next year that would be Fantastic!! And to add another 22 points on top of that the next year? Possibly it has been done by a small handful of 5th rounders in NHL history. But lets at least try to live in a real world. Saying He (Gaudette) could easily be a 60-70 point player is extreme exaggeration. Anywho......I hope Boeser kicks some butt next year and gets 35 goals!!! Edited April 19, 2019 by Kanukfanatic Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WeneedLumme Posted April 19, 2019 Share Posted April 19, 2019 (edited) 50 minutes ago, Kanukfanatic said: And as for your second bolded statement "He could easily be a 60-70 point player in this league" - it is that kind of extreme exaggeration that I find stupid. There are 55 - 70 point or higher players in the entire NHL. 55 - There are only 1 or 2 of those type of players on any given NHL team except the elite teams. We didn't have 1. Petey didn't get 70, Horvat didn't get 70, Boeser didn't get 70. And you say Gaudette could easily do it?? Really?? Pro scouts predicted Gaudette as possibly a 3rd line centre which would be very good for a 5th round pick. People saying he will be a 70 point player are high as &^%$ imo. You seem to be frothing at the mouth over something you are aware that he didn't actually say. He said 60 to 70 points, not 70 plus points. There are 72 NHL players who scored 60+ points this season, an average of over 2 per team, or approximately 10% of all NHL players. There are 68 NHL forwards who scored 60+ points this season, of the 500 who played 10 games or more. That is about 14% of all forwards. To say that a young player as skilled and motivated as Gaudette could at some point end up in the top 15% of NHL forwards in scoring is not particularly outrageous. Pretending someone said something that you know he did not say is rather outrageous however. Edited April 19, 2019 by WeneedLumme 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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