RDCurran Posted July 3, 2015 Share Posted July 3, 2015 Problem lies in that Jb is handcuffed by ownership who want the revune from playoff hockey, it handcuffed Gillis and cost him hide job Rebuilding while trying to make the playoffs every year in my opinion feels like being stuck in neutral. Maybe that is the so-called "Detroit model" but guess what, Detroit isn't and hasn't been a serious cup threat for 6 years and counting. Neither are the Canucks and they wont be until they rebuild for real. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Puck'nAnimal Posted July 3, 2015 Share Posted July 3, 2015 Then I'd say you haven't been a Nucklehead all that long... Canucks fans are still basking in the afterglow of the greatest Canucks team ever put on a sheet of ice...I remember the dark days...when the word "playoffs" was uttered in shadows, & the Avalanche were one of the most feared teams ever to exist in the NHL, snatching up every Division title for 6 straight years? I can't remember fully, it was too evil a time... Rumour has it Mark Messier was once Captain of the Canucks....but no, not it can't be true! Probably means that you're also a youngster... I remember the good ol' Smythe when we were getting pounded by the Flames every time the Canucks made it into the playoffs in the ugly ol' days before Pat Quinn. It was a guaranteed first round exit for the Canucks when they matched up against Edmonton or the Flames...or the Kings. Hell, even in 89-90, the Jets got into the playoffs. We were a perennial basement team. God, how we prayed for an Original JETS matchup...when they were sucking like we were. Guys patrolling the ice like Garth Butcher, Dan Quinn, Jim Sandlak, Jim Benning, Tony Tanti, Dave Capuano and Petri Skriko...Anybody remember Vladimir Krutov? He was the fabled third part of the KLM line but never realized his full potential because he seemed to be more interested in donuts than in hockey. You think Big Bad Avalanche period was a dark time? Late 80s, early 90s (prior to 94) was a DARK time. We had Igor Larionov (pre-Red Wings Larionov) and somehow got f*d over big time by some contractual crap a couple years later. So...those of us who have suffered through that can swallow this and get through. Pull up yer britches, young'un, it's gonna be a bumpy ride. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NaslundLindenBure Posted July 3, 2015 Share Posted July 3, 2015 Thanks man, you gave me some hope to believe in this team when i was losing it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mustapha Posted July 3, 2015 Share Posted July 3, 2015 This was exactly what was said last year. Ana, LA, and SJ were too tough to beat. CDC also said we would be behind ARI. Then every stated, as they do every year, this could be EDM break out. Canucks were suppose to be fighting in the bottom 10. They overachieved. So whats the problem? Even if we are bottom 10, is that bad for a year or two? Maybe one of the so called unstoppables fumbles like LA did last year. Hell LA has so much internal problems I could see them having another bad year. I could see Cgy pulling the same thing Colorado did. I could see Edmonton pulling an Edmonton. This crazy negativity is.......crazy! If Calgary regresses, it's not the Canucks that will take the points from them. Momentum is a huge part of hockey and after that last playoff series, Calgary has it. They won't be afraid anymore to play the Canucks tough, and they are arguably softer than last season. Hartley is not Patrick Roy, he knows how get the most out of his players. Edmonton modestly improved when Eakins was fired and Todd Nelson came in. The team has had changes from top to bottom including more defensive depth and a much more talented coach in McLellan. The Canucks have less experience than last year, with more pressure on the defense and goaltending. Are predictions always a slam dunk? No. But even if LA and SJ have bad years, there are still other Pacific teams in better shape than Vancouver. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
luckylager Posted July 3, 2015 Share Posted July 3, 2015 OP- great read, I love your optimistic view of the bunghole we're in, the big difference is that we have one proven young forward and a goalie with "elite" potential, that's it. Not saying "you're wrong", but a reflection of '06 means we're 4-5 yrs from being a dominant team, which would be nice, but I think you're dreaming. This is the Canucks you're talking about, our SCF appearances come every dozen or so years. And now I feel like a turd. Because I effing love this team that I've counted out of contention for the next 6-8years. Boo-urns Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gaudette Celly Posted July 3, 2015 Share Posted July 3, 2015 So...those of us who have suffered through that can swallow this and get through. Pull up yer britches, young'un, it's gonna be a bumpy ride. If we had this current team back in the 80s, we'd be ecstatic. People who are panicking now have NO IDEA whatsoever what it's like having a perennial loser that regularly gets its behind whooped. Remember that one game here, I think in Tanti's first year, where the Canucks were up on the Oilers something like 5:2 in the third period, and ended up losing 7:5? Then you have D Lars Lindgren scoring into his own net against them... then they pick Paul Coffey right before we pick Rick Lanz... then they draft Glenn Anderson despite Tom Watt begging us to take him... then we trade for BJ MacDonald... then... ah, that's enough. We have more talent in the lineup now and more prospects in the pool than at any other time in the club's history, and have a management team at the helm that can draft well and has a vision of how to build the team. Have just a bit of patience -- results won't be far off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Puck'nAnimal Posted July 3, 2015 Share Posted July 3, 2015 If we had this current team back in the 80s, we'd be ecstatic. People who are panicking now have NO IDEA whatsoever what it's like having a perennial loser that regularly gets its behind whooped. Remember that one game here, I think in Tanti's first year, where the Canucks were up on the Oilers something like 5:2 in the third period, and ended up losing 7:5? Then you have D Lars Lindgren scoring into his own net against them... then they pick Paul Coffey right before we pick Rick Lanz... then they draft Glenn Anderson despite Tom Watt begging us to take him... then we trade for BJ MacDonald... then... ah, that's enough. We have more talent in the lineup now and more prospects in the pool than at any other time in the club's history, and have a management team at the helm that can draft well and has a vision of how to build the team. Have just a bit of patience -- results won't be far off. Oh...god...man...that was painful ~cringe~ We old-timers end up listening to the panic and laughing our asses off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jetliner Posted July 3, 2015 Share Posted July 3, 2015 there will be hope if virtanen is able to light it up as an 18 year old. We need our prospects to bite their own ass and morph into the Gods CDC has endowed them to be. Man im as high as fk Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Honey Badger Posted July 3, 2015 Share Posted July 3, 2015 Oh...god...man...that was painful ~cringe~ We old-timers end up listening to the panic and laughing our asses off. i'm not as experienced as some of you folks, but i did remember the 10 games losing streak in that painful season under tom renney... we had 4th overall pick that year and who did we pick? none other than bryan allen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StevoCanuck Posted July 3, 2015 Share Posted July 3, 2015 thank you for your hockey knowledge Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BenDrinkin Posted July 3, 2015 Share Posted July 3, 2015 Too much optimism and less focus on the apparent uncertainty... The fact of the matter is we won't be competitive in the playoffs for at least 4-5 years.. We should have started rebuilding right after the Stanley cup finals fiasco.. The shorten season was a perfect opportunity Frack being a Canucks fan is frustrating.. Yeah, management will want to start a rebuild when we are getting back to back president's trophies. Brilliant! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted July 3, 2015 Share Posted July 3, 2015 The end of the WCE era saw us build on some pretty stellar foundations: - Top-class goalie (Luongo) - Burgeoning D (Bieksa, Edler) - Top-drawer forwards (Daniel, Henrik) - Burgeoning F (Kesler, Burrows, Raymond) - Savvy vets (Ohlund, Salo, Mitchell, Linden) This time, what do we have? - Average goalie and average backups (Miller, Markstrom, Bachman) - Potential good starter (Demko) - One burgeoning D (Tanev) - Top-drawer forwards (Daniel, Henrik, Vrbata) - albeit ancient and due to fall off a cliff at some point - Burgeoning F (Horvat, Virtanen, Baertschi) - Savvy vets (Burrows, Prust) I'm far less confident in this rebuild / retool than I was back in 2006/07. This roster has far more filler, earning far more of our cap space, than ever it did before. I am now convinced we will be tanking this season, for a 3-8 spot in the draft, splashing out on over-priced UFAs (no quality players ever reach UFA anyway), and drafting a few 1st rounders. With the direction Benning is taking us, I doubt the Sedins even see the playoffs before they retire. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baggins Posted July 3, 2015 Share Posted July 3, 2015 You literally have zero empircal evidence to back up your statement. In fact the ONLY data available to Canucks fans suggests that Benning suffers from an acute inability to execute trades at market value. I get that he has been thrust into a bad position, but to suggest that he will somehow find a way to magically trade all of our past ripe vets for picks and prospects is Harry Potter Market value is what teams are willing to give you for what you're offering. Not what's rolling around in your head. If 29 teams aren't willing to give what you're asking, you've likely overvalued your asset. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VintageDz Posted July 3, 2015 Share Posted July 3, 2015 I like optimistic posts..that being said, we had the 2nd and 3rd overall super stars heading in their prime during that time, who do we have now? Horvat and virtanen are both awesome pieces, but they are no sedans. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tas Posted July 3, 2015 Share Posted July 3, 2015 this coming season is going to be bleak for casual fans, but should be very interesting for the more involved fans, like most of us on this website. my hope is that they'll see what this lineup is made of, and if come trade deadline time they're 6-8 points out of a playoff spot, sell off the remaining pieces (hamhuis, vrbata, burrows, higgins, prust) for whatever picks and/or prospects they can get and bottom out for the rest of the year. they could potentially end up with their own (maybe top 5) pick, 2 more 1st rounders (vrbata and hamhuis), and a total of 3 or 4 2nd rounders, plus more in the later rounds. then they go into the offseason with more cap space than they know what to do with and a boatload of picks and they have the ability to make a big splash in free agency and the trade market. and just like that your rebuild is done. edit: to hell with it, let's play this fantasy out. let's assume the stuff i already outlined happens. let's then assume that nashville regresses big time next year, despite seth jones and ryan ellis taking big steps forward, and they decide it's time to move shea. at the draft, the canucks trade 1 of their 3 first rounders (not the top 5), plus a 2nd rounder (mid-round let's say) and chris tanev for shea weber. trade a 2nd rounder for steve stamkos's negotiating rights when it becomes clear he intends to test the market and sign him to a 8 year $72 m deal. then they sign brent seabrook ($6 m × 4 years) and milan lucic ($5 m x 5 years). baertschi-stamkos-virtanen sedin-sedin-lucic kenins-horvat-hansen gaunce-cassels-dorsett grenier edler-s. weber sbisa-seabrook corrado-clendening pedan/hutton/etc miller markstrom plus a top 5 pick, another 1st rounder, and 2 2nd rounders. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Riviera82 Posted July 3, 2015 Share Posted July 3, 2015 Problem lies in that Jb is handcuffed by ownership who want the revune from playoff hockey, it handcuffed Gillis and cost him hide job Yes it's apparent now that ownership is a roadblock between the Canucks and an actual rebuild. Somebody else (perhaps Trevor or Benning?) has probably run past the Aquilinis the idea that if they rip the team apart to an extent, the money they'd save on the deadweight contracts that go off the books should more than equal the revenue from a handful of playoff home games they'd miss out on over a couple of years. What's wrong with that concept? The Canucks are a cap-ceiling team that are very questionable for even making the postseason and as they've shown over the last few years when they do get in, they are an easy out. I'm just one guy, but if I were in charge I'd roll the dice with a lot of young players. If they manage to get you some playoff games then that's great. If they blow it, well then it's not such a big loss because a majority of the players are making at or close to minimum wage and then ownership can look forward to some more top prospects to help the team in the future. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Psycho_Path Posted July 3, 2015 Share Posted July 3, 2015 You never know your a leader until someone teaches you, you are a leader. All great leaders had mentors to help bring out their leadership potential. I think Toews is the exception. He didn't really thrive behind anyone. Just came in and led. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MaxieMan98 Posted July 3, 2015 Share Posted July 3, 2015 The end of the WCE era saw us build on some pretty stellar foundations: - Top-class goalie (Luongo) - Burgeoning D (Bieksa, Edler) - Top-drawer forwards (Daniel, Henrik) - Burgeoning F (Kesler, Burrows, Raymond) - Savvy vets (Ohlund, Salo, Mitchell, Linden) This time, what do we have? - Average goalie and average backups (Miller, Markstrom, Bachman) - Potential good starter (Demko) - One burgeoning D (Tanev) - Top-drawer forwards (Daniel, Henrik, Vrbata) - albeit ancient and due to fall off a cliff at some point - Burgeoning F (Horvat, Virtanen, Baertschi) - Savvy vets (Burrows, Prust) I'm far less confident in this rebuild / retool than I was back in 2006/07. This roster has far more filler, earning far more of our cap space, than ever it did before. I am now convinced we will be tanking this season, for a 3-8 spot in the draft, splashing out on over-priced UFAs (no quality players ever reach UFA anyway), and drafting a few 1st rounders. With the direction Benning is taking us, I doubt the Sedins even see the playoffs before they retire. I disagree wholeheartedly. We had zero to slim prospect depth in 2006/07, this time around we have great depth and potential game breakers in my opinion. Sven, Bo, Jared, Jake, and to a lesser extent Cole and Brock all have potential to be top Allstars even if only for a season or too. IMO our forward prospect ceilings ~Sven-Mike Cammalleri ~Bo-Patrice Bergeron ~Jared- Claude Giroux lite ~Jake-Brandon Saad ~Cole-Dave Bolland ~Brock-Kyle Okposo Tell me what we had in our system back then? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Psycho_Path Posted July 3, 2015 Share Posted July 3, 2015 this coming season is going to be bleak for casual fans, but should be very interesting for the more involved fans, like most of us on this website. my hope is that they'll see what this lineup is made of, and if come trade deadline time they're 6-8 points out of a playoff spot, sell off the remaining pieces (hamhuis, vrbata, burrows, higgins, prust) for whatever picks and/or prospects they can get and bottom out for the rest of the year. they could potentially end up with their own (maybe top 5) pick, 2 more 1st rounders (vrbata and hamhuis), and a total of 3 or 4 2nd rounders, plus more in the later rounds. then they go into the offseason with more cap space than they know what to do with and a boatload of picks and they have the ability to make a big splash in free agency and the trade market. and just like that your rebuild is done. edit: to hell with it, let's play this fantasy out. let's assume the stuff i already outlined happens. let's then assume that nashville regresses big time next year, despite seth jones and ryan ellis taking big steps forward, and they decide it's time to move shea. at the draft, the canucks trade 1 of their 3 first rounders (not the top 5), plus a 2nd rounder (mid-round let's say) and chris tanev for shea weber. trade a 2nd rounder for steve stamkos's negotiating rights when it becomes clear he intends to test the market and sign him to a 8 year $72 m deal. then they sign brent seabrook ($6 m × 4 years) and milan lucic ($5 m x 5 years). baertschi-stamkos-virtanen sedin-sedin-lucic kenins-horvat-hansen gaunce-cassels-dorsett grenier edler-s. weber sbisa-seabrook corrado-clendening pedan/hutton/etc miller markstrom plus a top 5 pick, another 1st rounder, and 2 2nd rounders. If only... lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buddhahoodlum Posted July 3, 2015 Share Posted July 3, 2015 There never is certainty. Even if we did/do rebuild we still will never know if we'll turn out like Edmonton. And you think we shoulda blown up the team right after going to game 7 of the SCF? L O L Yea I guess he forgets that same team won the President's Trophy the next year as well, albeit not in as dominating fashion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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