johngould21 Posted July 30, 2015 Share Posted July 30, 2015 There's a lot more to his game than just points. There is no points vs salary chart by which GMs determine players' sole worth.Don't worry the Pens have Phil the Thrill ready to bust out....I'm not too sure what I mean by that, but I think it could go two ways with him. At $8M per.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RRypien37 Posted July 30, 2015 Share Posted July 30, 2015 Too much being made of this. Was a near ppg as a 17 yr old in the Dub - and NHL scouts saw fit to make him an 11th overall pick, looking beyond simple production alone - as the Canucks did when they took Horvat at 9th overall. Again as an 18 yr old, 49 points in 59 games on a team that did not have another 30pt player, and had an 18-47 record. But the following year Bo took it up a notch with 33 goals and 74 points in 54 games. Which SHOWED more offensive potential, something Sutter HAS NOT. Again...I'm not trying to devalue the guy here...a key player for any team, but he is not top 6 material for a contender. However, with where the Canucks are at this point, I guess he is a top 6 on THIS team... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhillipBlunt Posted July 30, 2015 Share Posted July 30, 2015 The Penguins will see Kessel and Bonino take their requisite mid season breaks and with an even more porous defense than the Canucks, Pittsburgh will once again be one and done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldnews Posted July 30, 2015 Share Posted July 30, 2015 But the following year Bo took it up a notch with 33 goals and 74 points in 54 games. Which SHOWED more offensive potential, something Sutter HAS NOT. Again...I'm not trying to devalue the guy here...a key player for any team, but he is not top 6 material for a contender. However, with where the Canucks are at this point, I guess he is a top 6 on THIS team... yes, and again, Bo picked it up on a team that was 49-14, featuring team-mates like Max Domi, Chris Tierney, Mitch Marner, Nikita Zadorov.... a handful of ppg players - so I suspect you missed the point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aGENT Posted July 30, 2015 Share Posted July 30, 2015 But the following year Bo took it up a notch with 33 goals and 74 points in 54 games. Which SHOWED more offensive potential, something Sutter HAS NOT. Again...I'm not trying to devalue the guy here...a key player for any team, but he is not top 6 material for a contender. However, with where the Canucks are at this point, I guess he is a top 6 on THIS team... Good thing we're not a contender then. By the time we are, he'll be an elite 3C on a good contract who helped bridge the gap between prospects and vets and lead and mentor those prospects. Sounds terrifying, I know Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeNiro Posted July 30, 2015 Share Posted July 30, 2015 yes, and again, Bo picked it up on a team that was 49-14, featuring team-mates like Max Domi, Chris Tierney, Mitch Marner, Nikita Zadorov.... a handful of ppg players - so I suspect you missed the point. Yep. Context is everything. The next best player in his third year on the Rebels was Troy Ofukany. A real household name. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
apollo Posted July 30, 2015 Share Posted July 30, 2015 1 year plz. Let him prove himself. Baffled that people think he's worth anything over 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhillipBlunt Posted July 30, 2015 Share Posted July 30, 2015 Yep. Context is everything. The next best player in his third year on the Rebels was Troy Ofukany. A real household name. Won't you take me to....Ofukany. Won't you take me to.....Ofuknay! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhillipBlunt Posted July 30, 2015 Share Posted July 30, 2015 1 year plz. Let him prove himself. Baffled that people think he's worth anything over 4 ELITE!!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gaudette Celly Posted July 30, 2015 Share Posted July 30, 2015 I never said there wasn't. He is an amazing shut down guy, and an elite 3C. But for the people who want him at 2C, points are a huge factor... Sure, and we're about to see how he does when given a more offensive role to play. 20+ goals on the third line with grinders playing behind two all-star centers is nothing to discount. And yes -- he is an elite 3C and an elite PKer. Hear that, Apollo? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aGENT Posted July 30, 2015 Share Posted July 30, 2015 1 year plz. Let him prove himself. Baffled that people think he's worth anything over 4 He's played in the NHL for 6 years consistently putting up ~30+ points in a 3rd line role with elite defensive ability, good size, good speed, good at face offs. Pretty sure he's proven enough to get a long term contract for exactly what he is. An elite 3C with some untapped "good" 2C potential and intangibles up the wazoo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stawns Posted July 30, 2015 Share Posted July 30, 2015 4.4 is way too high for a guy that hasn't played a game with us yet. If he doesn't gel like he didn't in Pittsburgh it'll be very tough to move. We will have some cash available because Vrbata and Prust contracts will be done and I doubt we will re-sign either. Miller will be gone the year after (along with Higgins). But 4+ for a 3rd line C? Too much. Especially since Horvat, Vey, Baertschi, Hamhuis and Burrows will be needing new contracts You being serious? Hamhuis may get a new, cheaper deal, but equally as likely to move on. Burrows is almost certainly gone, likely before his contract expires. Vey and Baer will not be a significant hit against the cap. Sutter has two 20 goal seasons, one 17 goal season, is an elite pker and one of the top defensive fwds in the league, all by 26......but you dont think hes earned $4m a year? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dKs89 Posted July 30, 2015 Share Posted July 30, 2015 I am confused as to why people keep saying Sutter is a shutdown guy, has grit etc.....All I have read from Pens board is that he is the exact opposite of that...isn't physical, does not bring grit or use his size. However, all you have to do is look at the linemates he played with last season (garbage) and he still put up 21 goals. But if you guys are thinking he is some great shutdown center, the fans who have watched him for 2 years say the exact opposite. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stawns Posted July 30, 2015 Share Posted July 30, 2015 Yep. Context is everything. The next best player in his third year on the Rebels was Troy Ofukany. A real household name. I coached many games against Ofukany! Needless to say, his name was an easy target. He was a good player and dirty as hell Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stawns Posted July 30, 2015 Share Posted July 30, 2015 I am confused as to why people keep saying Sutter is a shutdown guy, has grit etc.....All I have read from Pens board is that he is the exact opposite of that...isn't physical, does not bring grit or use his size. However, all you have to do is look at the linemates he played with last season (garbage) and he still put up 21 goals. But if you guys are thinking he is some great shutdown center, the fans who have watched him for 2 years say the exact opposite. I watched at least 20 Pens games last season and when they got the matchups, it was Sutter playing the hard mins against the oppositions top scorers, and he was very very effective. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aGENT Posted July 30, 2015 Share Posted July 30, 2015 I am confused as to why people keep saying Sutter is a shutdown guy, has grit etc.....All I have read from Pens board is that he is the exact opposite of that...isn't physical, does not bring grit or use his size. However, all you have to do is look at the linemates he played with last season (garbage) and he still put up 21 goals. But if you guys are thinking he is some great shutdown center, the fans who have watched him for 2 years say the exact opposite. Physycality and 'grit' are not necessarily the same thing. I wouldn't consider Hanen or Burrows overly 'physical' but they both play a gritty, high pressure, puck pursuit game. I don't expect Sutter to go Torres on everybody and laying the body on everyone and everything. I expect him to play with consistently high effort and puck pursuit. Which he is in fact known for. Along with elite PK/defensive ability. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Tortorella Posted July 30, 2015 Share Posted July 30, 2015 Vancouver is no longer a desirable destination for players. Long gone are the hometown discounts and taking less to be competitive here. We are going to start paying the premium/market value for players until we do become a desirable destination for players again. Hard to give someone hometown discount when they are from new york Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brownky Posted July 30, 2015 Share Posted July 30, 2015 During one of our best times as a team, we never had a true "#1" centre. Nothing against Morrison, but he was never a true "first line" centre. But he had the compete and enough skill to play between Naslund and Bertuzzi for a number of years and compliment them (and handle their lazy backcheck at times). If we have four second line centres on the team, we could do worse than that. And Henrik isn't a second liner just yet. I like the deal, we finally got the better player. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alfstonker Posted July 30, 2015 Share Posted July 30, 2015 I think the forward corps is set. Hopefully Benning is still looking to make a trade for a defenseman with some size and grit to help take that load off of Edler (size) and Sbisa (grit?). Hamhuis brings some grit, but more a steady presence. Tanev, Weber, Bartowksi bring neither size nor grit. This defense will be eaten alive by a strong, consistent forecheck. Biega has a lot of grit and I note that Benning mentioned him. I think he is a sleeper and he doesn't get called "bulldog"(?) or something like that for nothing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blackberries Posted July 30, 2015 Share Posted July 30, 2015 It's hilarious how delusional everyone here is. Just hop on over to any of the Penguins' boards, and you will see that absolutely every single Pens fan LOVES this trade and thinks they fleeced us (which is fair, as they actually did fleece us). And, that was with Sutter making $1+ million less a year. Clearly they didn't watch Bonino that much this year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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