Proposal: Outside the box deadline (a bit long)

[Relyt Krets]

So lets pretend that it is the Morning of the deadline and we are in the hunt for the playoffs but we arent in a playoff position. We probably will just miss out but oh well it will be better for the draft. So we have a couple players with expiring contracts and also some without, but should be traded anyway.

First off, a non expiring contract in Higgins

Higgins to Buffalo for M.Foligno: Foligno is a Benning type player. 6"3', 247lbs. He would fit well on the 3rd line. Higgins will most likely wind up on the 3rd line anyway if Virtanen makes the team and sticks. We will need to include a draft pick I would say as well but Foligno is 23 and has potential. Look as his brother who was a late bloomer. Also who wouldnt want someone at his age with his size?

Next is Hamhuis

Hamhuis to Columbus for K.Rychel, 2016 2nd rd draft pick, 2016 3rd rd draft pick: Rentals come at a high price in the NHL and i believe this is pretty fair. BUT I make this proposal based on the fact that I believe that Columbus will have a good season and be in playoff contention at the deadline. They will be one of the dark horse teams I believe this season. It also works for both teams. We get 2 picks mid to late in the rounds as well as a highly touted winger. It puts a dent in our D but Columbus needs D and Hammer will be in there top 2. It will help them in there playoff hunt while we continue getting younger. We may also need to as a late pick but that wouldnt be a big deal. Again though this is if Columbus does have a good season. Also I could see Hammer testing the waters after next year so we can bring him back at a discounted price.

Vrbata....

Vrbata to Nashville for R.Ellis, M.Ekholm: Nashville loathes on D. Ellis is an underated player as he plays behind so many good D in Nashville. He quietly had a good season last year and can be an instant help to our powerplay as he can be our QB. Ekholm had a good full season last year and still has room for improvement. Nashville will want to improve on last year and have the D to replace both men as they are a D factory. Nashville will get a scoring winger who will help them with scoring when playoff time comes around. Also has thought about C.Sissions as well instead of Ekholm?

As for the others. Vey I see getting traded for a draft pick. i dont forsee him building on last year too much. Cassels can come in to end the year off in his spot. Prust will stick around for about the same cap hit for a couple years. I am one of the few who like the acquisition of him. Weber/Bartkowski one or both will be traded. Wont get much for them. Either picks or draft picks. Id rather see Bartkowski go but I doubt that will happen. Not your normal trading partners but thinking outside the box.

Flame away....

[Grape]

I don't think any of the other 3 teams make those deals tbh. Especially Nashville.

[Jiggs50]

I like the Foligno idea a lot but we would have to add.

No to the Hamhuis trade.

Nashville won't do the Vrbata trade.

[Valentine]

At the rate Benning seems to be going with trades I think it's more likely we'll see something along the lines of Hamhuis + 2nd for a 3rd.

[DownUndaCanuck]

Like the basis for all of them but we would have to add. Instead of the Columbus trade, why not make a huge Nashville trade?

TO NAS: Hamhuis and Vbrata

TO VAN: Ellis, Ekholm, 2nd round pick, 3rd round pick

To get Foligno I think we'd have to give up a 2nd or 3rd round pick AS WELL as Higgins.

TO BUF: Higgins + 3rd round pick

TO VAN: Foligno

Sedin - Sedin - Foligno

Baertschi - Sutter - Burrows

Kenins - Horvat - Hansen

Dorsett - Vey - Prust

Edler - Tanev

Ekholm - Ellis

Sbisa - Corrado

[ForsbergTheGreat]

I would love ellis. He is the perfect fit for our roster, A young PMD that this team needs. He's not likely going to get the opportunity in NSH with the D depth they have. Hammer would likely go back to NSH and they could use a goal score like vbrata.....and they have a ton of cap space.

Don't what they'd consider a fair deal for two pending UFA's.

[YEGCanuck]

I am thinking whenever possible JB wants to stock up on draft choices this year, rather than current players.

[Valentine]

I am thinking whenever possible JB wants to stock up on draft choices this year, rather than current players.

Then why does he always seem to be the guy either adding a pick or giving up the higher pick?

[Relyt Krets]

Like the basis for all of them but we would have to add. Instead of the Columbus trade, why not make a huge Nashville trade?

TO NAS: Hamhuis and Vbrata

TO VAN: Ellis, Ekholm, 2nd round pick, 3rd round pick

To get Foligno I think we'd have to give up a 2nd or 3rd round pick AS WELL as Higgins.

TO BUF: Higgins + 3rd round pick

TO VAN: Foligno

Sedin - Sedin - Foligno

Baertschi - Sutter - Burrows

Kenins - Horvat - Hansen

Dorsett - Vey - Prust

Edler - Tanev

Ekholm - Ellis

Sbisa - Corrado

I see that as a bit of an overpay in the Nashville deal. I saw an article recently out of Nashville that they say now is the right time to trade Weber. If we did something BIG with Nashville, that is what I'd be going for. But that's way to high of hopes for the Canucks. We have the prospects to pull it off. But then we deplete our young depth. But one can dream

[Sean Monahan]

Then why does he always seem to be the guy either adding a pick or giving up the higher pick?

Maybe because he had to in order to make the deal he wanted?

Prust/Kassian- JB said he shopped Kassian from Christmas onwards and couldn't find any takers. Throwing in a later round pick just sweetens the deal for MTL a bit to take him off our hands.

Bonino/Sutter- As has been explained about 101 times on these boards already, the picks are likely to be no more than 10-12 spots apart. At that point in the draft, you've got as good a chance of landing the guy you want at, say, 68th(where the 3rd we acquired could likely be) as you do at 58th (where the 2nd we traded is likely to be).

[mll]

I see that as a bit of an overpay in the Nashville deal. I saw an article recently out of Nashville that they say now is the right time to trade Weber. If we did something BIG with Nashville, that is what I'd be going for. But that's way to high of hopes for the Canucks. We have the prospects to pull it off. But then we deplete our young depth. But one can dream

Nashville is a young and fast team - Poile has been very vocal about his worries about "father time" with Ribeiro and Fisher so there is no way that he trades two core players (basically Nashville's 2nd pairing) who are young and cost controlled for two UFAs that are on the wrong side of 30.

For info, they finished 6th in the league in scoring differential at ES (8th in all situations). Also, each of their top-6 players scored more points than any of the players on the Canucks during their play-offs against the future champions (save Fisher who was injured and played only about 30min over 3 games).

Nashville also doesn't have a very good D-prospect pool so moving Ellis and Ekholm would destroy their good defence going forward.

Also they are not trading Weber as it's a bad idea hockey wise - there is no one that brings his physicality on their team (re the Chicago series showed how much his presence was missed). Plus that article conveniently ignores the recapture penalty: over 24M next summer.

Vancouver has likely no one other than Horvat that could interest Nashville - they need to find young Cs to take over for Fisher/Ribeiro in two years. As it is they have too many wingers competing for spots and risk losing a player or two to waivers for lack of place on the team.

[TheHockeyNerds]

Like the Hamuis trade to Columbus, Seems like a really fair trade for both sides

[TheHockeyNerds]

So lets pretend that it is the Morning of the deadline and we are in the hunt for the playoffs but we arent in a playoff position. We probably will just miss out but oh well it will be better for the draft. So we have a couple players with expiring contracts and also some without, but should be traded anyway.

First off, a non expiring contract in Higgins

Higgins to Buffalo for M.Foligno: Foligno is a Benning type player. 6"3', 247lbs. He would fit well on the 3rd line. Higgins will most likely wind up on the 3rd line anyway if Virtanen makes the team and sticks. We will need to include a draft pick I would say as well but Foligno is 23 and has potential. Look as his brother who was a late bloomer. Also who wouldnt want someone at his age with his size?

Next is Hamhuis

Hamhuis to Columbus for K.Rychel, 2016 2nd rd draft pick, 2016 3rd rd draft pick: Rentals come at a high price in the NHL and i believe this is pretty fair. BUT I make this proposal based on the fact that I believe that Columbus will have a good season and be in playoff contention at the deadline. They will be one of the dark horse teams I believe this season. It also works for both teams. We get 2 picks mid to late in the rounds as well as a highly touted winger. It puts a dent in our D but Columbus needs D and Hammer will be in there top 2. It will help them in there playoff hunt while we continue getting younger. We may also need to as a late pick but that wouldnt be a big deal. Again though this is if Columbus does have a good season. Also I could see Hammer testing the waters after next year so we can bring him back at a discounted price.

Vrbata....

Vrbata to Nashville for R.Ellis, M.Ekholm: Nashville loathes on D. Ellis is an underated player as he plays behind so many good D in Nashville. He quietly had a good season last year and can be an instant help to our powerplay as he can be our QB. Ekholm had a good full season last year and still has room for improvement. Nashville will want to improve on last year and have the D to replace both men as they are a D factory. Nashville will get a scoring winger who will help them with scoring when playoff time comes around. Also has thought about C.Sissions as well instead of Ekholm?

As for the others. Vey I see getting traded for a draft pick. i dont forsee him building on last year too much. Cassels can come in to end the year off in his spot. Prust will stick around for about the same cap hit for a couple years. I am one of the few who like the acquisition of him. Weber/Bartkowski one or both will be traded. Wont get much for them. Either picks or draft picks. Id rather see Bartkowski go but I doubt that will happen. Not your normal trading partners but thinking outside the box.

Flame away....

Really like the hammer trade you proposed to Columbus! Even though I would like a young defensive prospect, the trade is fair for both sides

[ForsbergTheGreat]

Vancouver has likely no one other than Horvat that could interest Nashville - they need to find young Cs to take over for Fisher/Ribeiro in two years. As it is they have too many wingers competing for spots and risk losing a player or two to waivers for lack of place on the team.

Vbrata + McCann + Weber for Ellis, NSH 1st (2016).

Most will say this is an overpayment for vancouver but when you think about all the pieces it fits both team needs.

NSH needs goal scoring and a young center, Canucks need a high end young PMD and more draft picks. Vbrata is a UFA at the end of the year. Ellis would give canucks a young, very strong right side D grouping.

Canucks still have Sedin, Sutter, Horvat ahead of McCann on the Depth chart for the next three years, and Vey and Cassels to compete with for those spots.

[goblix]

Honestly not so 'outside the box'...

Also, the only teams that would want Hamhuis / Vrbata at the deadline are teams that are in a playoff position so why would Nashville want to trade Ellis away ? Columbus kinda makes sense but if Rychel is doing well leading up to the playoffs I'd think they would rather keep him as well.

Draft picks are easier trades and is what we need to pile up on...

[mll]

Vbrata + McCann + Weber for Ellis, NSH 1st (2016).

Most will say this is an overpayment for vancouver but when you think about all the pieces it fits both team needs.

NSH needs goal scoring and a young center, Canucks need a high end young PMD and more draft picks. Vbrata is a UFA at the end of the year. Ellis would give canucks a young, very strong right side D grouping.

Canucks still have Sedin, Sutter, Horvat ahead of McCann on the Depth chart for the next three years, and Vey and Cassels to compete with for those spots.

The only missing piece for Nashville is a young C1 to take over from Ribeiro in two years. Any team not offering a true C1 will have a hard time doing a deal with Nashville (unless for minor pieces) because they are extremely happy with the makeup of their team. Poile was saying they improved because they did not have to make any major moves (he talked of finally having stability) - they now have a young core that they can keep together for several years.

Nashville finished the season with 2 less goals than Anaheim and more than Chicago - they are middle of the pack despite having one of the worst PP in the entire league (at ES they are in the upper tier). Downgrading on D wouldn't help their goal differential which was top-tier. Also their younger D are only going to get better at offence and defence as they gain more experience.

Moving Ellis or anyone else on D for that matter creates a hole on their blue line and this is a team that is built from the net out - GM Poile again restated that philosophy. They don't have any upcoming D prospects. Also, Ellis is signed at 2.5M for 4 more years as a D4 who QBs one of their PP units and has great chemistry with Ekholm on the 2nd pairing. Yannick Weber is not as efficient and UFA at the end of the year.

Vrbata doesn't fill a need and in fact would block the progression of one of their younger core players. They have too many wingers for the top-6 already and it wouldn't be unreasonable to think that they could play Wilson (5 goals in 6 play-off games after his first 20 goal season) on the 3rd line depending on who makes their team. They have more forwards than spots available and will have to send at least one player through waivers.

As for McCann they have Kamenev who also projects as a top-6 two-way centre. He is from the same draft class and will be playing in the AHL next year as he was drafted out of the KHL playing under Mike Keenan (ie already playing against men). McCann will be in juniors so he is one year further back compared to Kamenev and doesn't have experience of professional hockey. So there again there is no benefit for Nashville to do that deal at this stage.

[ForsbergTheGreat]

The only missing piece for Nashville is a young C1 to take over from Ribeiro in two years. Any team not offering a true C1 will have a hard time doing a deal with Nashville (unless for minor pieces) because they are extremely happy with the makeup of their team. Poile was saying they improved because they did not have to make any major moves (he talked of finally having stability) - they now have a young core that they can keep together for several years.

Nashville finished the season with 2 less goals than Anaheim and more than Chicago - they are middle of the pack despite having one of the worst PP in the entire league (at ES they are in the upper tier). Downgrading on D wouldn't help their goal differential which was top-tier. Also their younger D are only going to get better at offence and defence as they gain more experience.

Moving Ellis or anyone else on D for that matter creates a hole on their blue line and this is a team that is built from the net out - GM Poile again restated that philosophy. They don't have any upcoming D prospects. Also, Ellis is signed at 2.5M for 4 more years as a D4 who QBs one of their PP units and has great chemistry with Ekholm on the 2nd pairing. Yannick Weber is not as efficient and UFA at the end of the year.

Vrbata doesn't fill a need and in fact would block the progression of one of their younger core players. They have too many wingers for the top-6 already and it wouldn't be unreasonable to think that they could play Wilson (5 goals in 6 play-off games after his first 20 goal season) on the 3rd line depending on who makes their team. They have more forwards than spots available and will have to send at least one player through waivers.

As for McCann they have Kamenev who also projects as a top-6 two-way centre. He is from the same draft class and will be playing in the AHL next year as he was drafted out of the KHL playing under Mike Keenan (ie already playing against men). McCann will be in juniors so he is one year further back compared to Kamenev and doesn't have experience of professional hockey. So there again there is no benefit to do that deal at this stage.

I don't know if I agree with you entirely on that. Josi was there main PP QB last year and Jones is next in the depth chart. Ellis doesn't really have room to grow on their back end for his skill set. Ekholm really impressed me last year and the just picked up Jackman this summer, Even without Ellis they have 5 top notch D. Yannik does help there D, he has a great first pass and a strong shot on the point all at a cheap one year cap hit, If Big weber does down, they still have a big shot to work with on the PP.

As for Vbrata, goal scoring upfront is something they are missing. They are built from the net out but a high offensive player like Vbrata is a player they could use. Watching a lot of NSH games they don't have that pure goal scorer, Neal was brought in to put up those big goal numbers but hasn't really showed signs of improving off his 27 goal 57 gp in pits. If you put vbrata on the PP with Big Weber, that would be a scary threat. Vbrata doesn't really effect their youth depth either. There really isn't anyone in their line up to compete for #2 RW anyway.

Also not a great chance NSH gets a true #1 center or #1 center prospect for Ellis (just think would canucks even be willing to trade Horvat straight up for Ellis..not going to happen). but McCann isn't something to shy away from, Kamenev is more of a bigger scoring left winger than two way center. McCann is a few years away, likely 2 more years before making the NHL jump but NSH center prospect pool is really weak. They did just got out and pick up the Cody project, so maybe he can regain form and fill out that top line center. Both teams get close value, and they get needs for the now and the future. I really won't be surprised to see Ellis dealt this year, his name has been involved in a few rumours the last few years. I just hope that if it happens canucks are in on the talks.

[Baer.]

Terrible deal for all other teams.

[Z Hockey]

Nashville wouldn't want to Trade R. Ellis OR Ekholm alone for Vrbata. They like the depth they have there, just because it's crowded right now doesn't mean they will Trade young promising defenseman. They went out and signed Barret Jackman to add even more depth to that blue line. And Nashvillle only would Trade for Vrbata or a winger like him if Fiala doesn't make the team which they're hoping and expecting he will.

Forsberg-Ribeiro-Neal

C.Wilson-Fisher-C. Smith

Fiala-Jarnkrok-Hodgson

G. Bourque-Gaustad-Nystrom/Arvidsson/Moses

Even if Fiala doesn't make it this year, they wouldn't trade Ellis or Ekholm for Vrbata. Someone through Free Agency who can bring the same fundamentals and similar points as Vrbata would be more ideal for them. Brad Boyes, Jiri Tlusty, or Lee Stempniak. And if they wanted the added depth in skill and scoring, they would have re-signed Santorelli.

[mll]

I don't know if I agree with you entirely on that. Josi was there main PP QB last year and Jones is next in the depth chart. Ellis doesn't really have room to grow on their back end for his skill set. Ekholm really impressed me last year and the just picked up Jackman this summer, Even without Ellis they have 5 top notch D. Yannik does help there D, he has a great first pass and a strong shot on the point all at a cheap one year cap hit, If Big weber does down, they still have a big shot to work with on the PP.

As for Vbrata, goal scoring upfront is something they are missing. They are built from the net out but a high offensive player like Vbrata is a player they could use. Watching a lot of NSH games they don't have that pure goal scorer, Neal was brought in to put up those big goal numbers but hasn't really showed signs of improving off his 27 goal 57 gp in pits. If you put vbrata on the PP with Big Weber, that would be a scary threat. Vbrata doesn't really effect their youth depth either. There really isn't anyone in their line up to compete for #2 RW anyway.

Also not a great chance NSH gets a true #1 center or #1 center prospect for Ellis (just think would canucks even be willing to trade Horvat straight up for Ellis..not going to happen). but McCann isn't something to shy away from, Kamenev is more of a bigger scoring left winger than two way center. McCann is a few years away, likely 2 more years before making the NHL jump but NSH center prospect pool is really weak. They did just got out and pick up the Cody project, so maybe he can regain form and fill out that top line center. Both teams get close value, and they get needs for the now and the future. I really won't be surprised to see Ellis dealt this year, his name has been involved in a few rumours the last few years. I just hope that if it happens canucks are in on the talks.

Given how Laviolette has used their 4th line at F to keep their team fresh and his comments about how this year was tough on the D makes me believe that he is going to run three pairings more consistently. Poile did mention that he hopes to cut back Josi/Weber's minutes this year. Their 5D fit the system perfectly so I don't see them moving Ellis as they have no one that could replace him in their system.

Here's an article from the Predators website that sums how important Ellis is to Nashville and confirms his role on the team as a 2nd pairing D and his QB role on the PP: http://predators.nhl.com/club/blogpost.htm?id=38304

The power play is perhaps the aspect of the game where Ellis’ absence was felt most. He acts as a quarterback on the point when the Predators occupy the opposition zone. First, he has terrific vision; he sees the ice exceptionally well. Second, the blueliner possesses great anticipation. He knows his teammates and has a great sense of their tendencies - as smart players do.

[...]

Lastly, Ellis and his defensive partner Matthias Ekholm are a great fit for one another; their games seem to complement each other very well. [...]

I am not going to repeat what I already wrote about scoring and their excess of wingers (Smith is RW2 by the way) but you can listen to Poile in the following clip. He repeats how excited he is about the future, his confidence in his players, how promoting from within is the right thing to do and signing players that the team is comfortable with to term - he specifically mentions Ellis (who signed a 5 year contract last year). This year's deadline trade has really burned Nashville so it's highly unlikely that they move players that they are comfortable with for unknowns unless they really fill a need (they will need someone to replace Ribeiro). This message of wanting to keep the roster together while trying to bring in younger players has been repeated all summer - see Predators website or their local newspaper the Tennessean.

At the 5min mark: http://video.predators.nhl.com/videocenter/console?id=826958&catid=1469