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Canucks Four Biggest Non-Mistakes Over the Last Year


IBatch

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Appreciate a positive spin although i wouldn't call then non-mistakes. Ill make a few comments of my own.

1) Miller - Good move. Hasn't performed the way fans would like but was a gamble and we needed to have clear cut number one after the Luongo debacle. At the signing: good signing, too much money.

2) Kassian out: Good move. didn't appear that he could put it all together outside of some real funny Celebrations. Return ? Prust will hopefully bring some leadership(bikes out) to the room and a constant hard nosed game. Did not get him for his offence. JB over paid in shipping out Kass in my opinion. ( F*#k yeah!!!!!! )

3) Vrbata Good Move - SO's Constant PP and regular scoring threat.

4) Sbisa - First season terrible. IF JB is truly a great talent evaluator this should show dividends in the next year or two. If not, piss poor signing, particularly for the dollar value. Intrigued to watch this play out as fans either change their tune or lose their collective marbles as he stinks up joint.

5) Sutter - Like this move. Never a fan of Bonino. Sutter plays in all three zones, has offensive upside, wins draws and can play pk. Still some overpayment here.

6) Lack- He was the odd man out. they believe in Markstrom. Eddie has been replaced by Markstrom 2 other times i believe in his career in Sweden, i think. Popularity aside, time will tell if this was the right choice. Deal: JB didn't get enough back. (TACO Tuesdays and Lack shuffle )

7) Bieksa out - Just did not perform. Great guy, apparently good leadership skills but didn't really have a place on this team moving forward. Aging player. (SJS Stantion winner )

7) Drafting- So far so good but time will tell.

IN summary: Jim Benning

- Changing the team including the core. ( torts called it stale )

- Cannot get fair value for assets

- has the Balls to spend money to get prime FA's. Vrbata, Miller

- Drafting seems solid but time will tell.

His acquisitions and plan better work or twitter and CDC are going to be freaking awesome...ly negative. Entertaining but negative.

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IN summary: Jim Benning

- Changing the team including the core. ( torts called it stale )

- Cannot get fair value for assets

- has the Balls to spend money to get prime FA's. Vrbata, Miller

- Drafting seems solid but time will tell.

What is "fair", besides your subjective belief? Benning got market value, which is exactly what they were worth.

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What is "fair", besides your subjective belief? Benning got market value, which is exactly what they were worth.

Exactly. Some seem to think when a GM wants to trade a player he calls only one team. Every team out there knew Kassian and Lack were on the market. They could be moved to any team in the league. The best offer (what we got) shows where the rest of the league places those players values.

NTC's can certainly put a limit on the return. It really comes down to how many teams you can deal with and how badly (if at all) they want that player.

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I agree that it doesn't seem like Benning can make a trade without throwing in a donut in the end (7th rounders), maybe other GM's are pissed at us or they just don't like what we have and the deals need to be sweetened until they do - who knows - BUT what I do know is if they can only get what they can get (market value has been used accurately this way).

Waivers could have been an option with Kassian but you could imagine how that would have gone over with the fans. Too bad expansion wasn't ready, could have left him unprotected, same with other players anchored with Gillis's NTC's. Maybe next year lol.

Comparisons to the Naslund - Stojanov trade have been made to the Kassian trade which just makes me scratch my head. Like everyone else I wished Kassian played his size and scored more goals when he had his chances, and that his IQ (not hockey IQ) was higher than 95 (I get this from folks that live in Windsor that know him) so he fit in the dressing room better (Montreal is in for a surprise there). There is a reason two teams gave up on him already, maybe the third team will straighten is career out and maybe Prust will re-sign with Montreal this summer - who knows. Too much catastrophizing has been made over a marginal player leaving this team and fan's need to move on and stop criticizing this - he wasn't Naslund and Prust is no Stajonov.

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Appreciate a positive spin although i wouldn't call then non-mistakes.

IN summary: Jim Benning

- Changing the team including the core. ( torts called it stale )

- Cannot get fair value for assets

- has the Balls to spend money to get prime FA's. Vrbata, Miller

- Drafting seems solid but time will tell.

His acquisitions and plan better work or twitter and CDC are going to be freaking awesome...ly negative. Entertaining but negative.

Also thanks for the post. I called them non-mistakes just to post something positive on this site after growing weary of all the whining and butthurting that was permeating the CDC earlier this summer (after Benning's moves) - and copied another post with the same title but without the NON in front of mistakes - some people got it, a lot didn't and rattled on with the same laments under this thread. I like your summary - the only lament I have with Benning (at least until the sample size grows larger and these deals take into affect - ie if they keep them competitive as he says he wants to while they re-build - a tricky fence to walk but the ideal scene if it works) - is that he publicly stated that their was interest in Miller. That was a mistake, the fans don't need to know this, neither does Miller and he shouldn't give a damn what people think about trading Lack for draft picks if that is the trade he wants. Aside from that thumbs up from me so far (or at least until the sample size is larger and if things fall apart on him).

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4) Sbisa - First season terrible. IF JB is truly a great talent evaluator this should show dividends in the next year or two. If not, piss poor signing, particularly for the dollar value. Intrigued to watch this play out as fans either change their tune or lose their collective marbles as he stinks up joint.

You are assuming that fans can tell the difference between a good and bad player, which they definitely can't in this market, particularly a defenceman.

"Cannot get fair value for assets"

I love how saying this over and over makes it true. Did you look up the values in the Beckett, and just go from there?

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Exactly. Some seem to think when a GM wants to trade a player he calls only one team. Every team out there knew Kassian and Lack were on the market. They could be moved to any team in the league. The best offer (what we got) shows where the rest of the league places those players values.

NTC's can certainly put a limit on the return. It really comes down to how many teams you can deal with and how badly (if at all) they want that player.

Don't you know that the market is set by CDC's expectations, and Dave Pratt's wild dreams?

It's overpayment if we say it is. And we can also say that only top 5 picks matter while still crying over the 5th rounder.

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What is "fair", besides your subjective belief? Benning got market value, which is exactly what they were worth.

Market value was fair based on what? The return he got? Most deals, the appearance is he is getting fleeced.

If you look at comparables lack vs. talbot returns an example .

Kassian Return,

I hear your point and I am not a GM but it appears that JB is throwing in extra on every deal. Seems like others got more for less

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You are assuming that fans can tell the difference between a good and bad player, which they definitely can't in this market, particularly a defenceman.

"Cannot get fair value for assets"

I love how saying this over and over makes it true. Did you look up the values in the Beckett, and just go from there?

Agreed 100%. Btw for those of you who believe I'm shutting on JB. Most of my commentary is positive

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Market value was fair based on what? The return he got? Most deals, the appearance is he is getting fleeced.

If you look at comparables lack vs. talbot returns an example .

Kassian Return,

I hear your point and I am not a GM but it appears that JB is throwing in extra on every deal. Seems like others got more for less

We beat this fair market value thing to h*ll after the Lack trade. FMV is what both parties agree to on a given day. It can only be determined by the market. Otherwise it is speculation.

Appraisers can estimate the value of a house for example based on comparable properties with similar features. But it can only be an estimate (ie not right) because the only way to know the value for sure is by an actual sale of a unique property.

Having said all that, there are instances where other prices are taken. Such as when a sale is made in what is called an arms length transaction. This is like when you sell a car to a relative for a very low price (for a reason that is unrelated to the market). Also if a seller is under duress. Like they badly need a sale because they're leaving town.

Was Benning under duress when he got rid of Kassian? Maybe he was desperate.

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Unfortunately it doesn't actually show the quality of the picks, just the percentage that managed to play 100 or more NHL games. Cam Barker was a 3rd overall pick and has played 310 NHL games. A success by the standard of both links I provided. Hardly a win of a 3rd overall pick though. I doubt anybody would consider him a win even he was a bottom end second rounder.

There are no guarantees when it comes to prospects or picks. But players who put up Veys type of numbers in the ahl do tend to make it in the NHL. How effective he will become or how long he can stay in the NHL is yet to be seen, but he'll certainly pass the 100 NHL game mark making him a success according to the one chart and beating the odds of a 2nd round pick.

In part that's true. But if we're talking tank/notank... since top 5 picks make it 96% of the time and 2nd round picks 31% of the time it shows that it's not exactly guesswork at the early stages of the draft. At the very least giving you a 96% chance to get a player with good potential to be a star. Cam Barker didn't turn out to be one. But the guys taken top 5 that year were:

Ovechkin - Malkin - Barker - Ladd - Wheeler. That's a draft that helped turn around 3 different franchises and helped win multiple Stanley Cups.

As far as the Vey argument, I'm hoping he takes steps forward this year. I just don't see anything that he brings to the team. Is he worth that draft pick? I guess depends how you value 2nd rounders and how much he improves.

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In part that's true. But if we're talking tank/notank... since top 5 picks make it 96% of the time and 2nd round picks 31% of the time it shows that it's not exactly guesswork at the early stages of the draft. At the very least giving you a 96% chance to get a player with good potential to be a star. Cam Barker didn't turn out to be one. But the guys taken top 5 that year were:

Ovechkin - Malkin - Barker - Ladd - Wheeler. That's a draft that helped turn around 3 different franchises and helped win multiple Stanley Cups.

As far as the Vey argument, I'm hoping he takes steps forward this year. I just don't see anything that he brings to the team. Is he worth that draft pick? I guess depends how you value 2nd rounders and how much he improves.

"Make it" and "quality" are subjective. That particular percentage is simply appearing in 100 or more NHL games. Quality of the picks isn't "in part true" it is true. You've proven that yourself naming Barker and Wheeler. Not even a top 5 pick gives you a guarantee. You certainly have a better chance of a star player in the top five, and even the entire first round, than you do drafting in the second or later. It certainly doesn't rule out drafting a star player later though.

Btw, Ladd is a good player but considering it took him 6 NHL seasons to break 50 points and last years 62 points is his career high, I don't think I'd include him with the likes of Malkin and Ovechkin in star power. I'd call him a top 5 pick that required development time to become a "good" player.

It was also the year after when Pittsburgh won the Crosby lottery that their tide really turned. They were in bankruptcy protection and looking to relocate prior to drafting Crosby.

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