Olympic Canuck Posted August 17, 2015 Share Posted August 17, 2015 Hi everyone, My girlfriend of 5 years and I are at a point in our lives where we're ready to purchase our first home together (and hopefully tie the knott soon after!). We both are settled into our full time careers and are making decent livings. As you all know, our beautiful city here is not exactly friendly turf for first time home buyers. The prices are ridiculous to say the least. That being said, we are pre-qualified for up to a maximum of $700k. We're currently trying to decide whether it's a better idea to purchase a condo in Vancouver (or Burnaby) or move out a bit further and get a house in Coquitlam/Port Coquitlam. Can any of you give us advice on things we should consider in our decision making? Or even if you can share your past experience with purchasing a home for the first time - that would also be useful. Some reasons we want to stay in Vancouver and get a condo: -closer to our families -I work in Vancouver so commute is much better (although this is something I'm willing to sacrifice if it means better properties) -we're pretty sure $600k-$700k can get us a very nice,"new",fully renovated condo in both Vancouver or Burnaby (vs a 20-30 year old house in the Tri Cities) -we assume growth potential in Vancouver is much higher (even though it's condo vs house) -fairly easy to rent out condos in Vancouver/Burnaby Reasons we want to move out to Coquitlam/Port Coquitlam/Port Moody and buy a house -we've always wanted a house together and both of us come from families that haven't been able to own a house. It's a bit of a goal to be the first ones in our families to change that. -more room to grow into: we're likely to get married in the next year or two and I would imagine kids wouldn't be too far behind that. -we like the idea or having the privacy a detached house offers (vs being surrounded by neighbours on all sides in a condo) -a house offers opportunity for rental income to help with mortgage(assuming it had a rental suite) -girlfriend works in Coquitlam so commute for her is better -don't have to pay monthly strata fees -way more freedom to decorate, renovate, and otherwise alter the property where as in a condo you're bound by contracts and limitations -you actually own something other than four walls and a roof in a house Any advice you can throw our way is appreciated! Thanks in advance! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EoH Posted August 17, 2015 Share Posted August 17, 2015 Judging by your post, it seems to me you'be already made your decision. The house is the ideal way to go, think of it as a long time investment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Ambien Posted August 17, 2015 Share Posted August 17, 2015 Family = house Single / crazy cat person = condo If you can't afford a house in the city (understandable) then move out of the city to get one. I presume townhomes aren't an option? In Canada they aren't bad. Townhomes in the US tend to suck, especially out west. Townhomes aren't bad particularly for small families and in a decent community. Just make sure to research the area. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wiseupsucker Posted August 17, 2015 Share Posted August 17, 2015 im grappling with this sorta as well... condos and townhomes have usually lower prices but strata fees... i would rather say forget the strata fees and put that money in equity in the house. also, it will be way easier to sell the house when it comes time. theres going to be a glut of condos and townhouses in the lower mainland soon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SaintPatrick33 Posted August 17, 2015 Share Posted August 17, 2015 Go for the house. You will find raising a family in a downtown condo to be quite difficult, the house offers quite a number of advantages in terms of living comfortably. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheRussianRocket. Posted August 17, 2015 Share Posted August 17, 2015 Judging by your post, it seems to me you'be already made your decision. The house is the ideal way to go, think of it as a long time investment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheRussianRocket. Posted August 17, 2015 Share Posted August 17, 2015 And forgot to mention, congrats on the plan to head out and move with the gf op. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Olympic Canuck Posted August 17, 2015 Author Share Posted August 17, 2015 Judging by your post, it seems to me you'be already made your decision. The house is the ideal way to go, think of it as a long time investment. You're right, a house is undeniably our preference. But that's hard to keep in mind when you put a beautifully renovated, 5 year old condo up against a house that's 30 years old and will likely cost us an additional $10k-$20k to renovate and furnish. And I haven't done the math yet but I would think the cost of commuting from Coquitlam/PoCo to Vancouver adds up in terms of gas/car maintenance. I suppose we do have the option of purchasing a condo in Vancouver or Burnaby, holding it for say 5 years then selling and using profits to upgrade to a house in the Tri Cities? Is the growth potential even feasible? Speaking of furnishing, does anyone know how much it truly costs to furnish a house from scratch? We're both moving from family homes so we literally have zero pieces to bring with us. We are not against using "budget" places like Ikea or second hand places as long as quality is not entirely sacrificed. This will also factor into our decision, I guess, as we don't have additional savings on top of our down payment set aside for this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Realtor Rod Posted August 17, 2015 Share Posted August 17, 2015 Always own your own earth if you can afford it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baer. Posted August 17, 2015 Share Posted August 17, 2015 Nothing wrong with raising a kid in a condo. That's how I grew up. Lots more to do in the city too. I'd stick with the condo. In 10 years you can always move out, rent the place, get a house and have another kid. You could have both. You should be glad you have so many options available. $600k-$700k is very easy to work with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D-Money Posted August 17, 2015 Share Posted August 17, 2015 I've been there. My wife and I moved from the heart of Kitsilano (York & Yew) to Calgary almost a decade ago. (A few reasons, but one of them was the opportunity to own a house and still be in a city.) Here's a few other things to consider: - Are you handy? If you are (reasonably), and could do most the of the small maintenance/reno/etc. stuff, dealing with a strata fee can be tough to swallow. Whereas if you're not (or just can't be bothered), and would get tradesmen to do any maintenance in your house anyways, then it may be a small price to pay not to deal with it. - Commuting from Vancouver to Coquitlam is a lot easier than vice versa. Going against the traffic flow makes a big difference. Also, if you have kids, she won't even be commuting when on maternity leave. - For your free time, are you homebodies? Or do you like to go out? If you like to be at home, having some room is really nice. Being able to go in the back yard can be great too. But if you like to go out more, and prefer parks/beaches to yards, then the city may be more enjoyable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
taxi Posted August 17, 2015 Share Posted August 17, 2015 You're right, a house is undeniably our preference. But that's hard to keep in mind when you put a beautifully renovated, 5 year old condo up against a house that's 30 years old and will likely cost us an additional $10k-$20k to renovate and furnish. And I haven't done the math yet but I would think the cost of commuting from Coquitlam/PoCo to Vancouver adds up in terms of gas/car maintenance. I suppose we do have the option of purchasing a condo in Vancouver or Burnaby, holding it for say 5 years then selling and using profits to upgrade to a house in the Tri Cities? Is the growth potential even feasible? Speaking of furnishing, does anyone know how much it truly costs to furnish a house from scratch? We're both moving from family homes so we literally have zero pieces to bring with us. We are not against using "budget" places like Ikea or second hand places as long as quality is not entirely sacrificed. This will also factor into our decision, I guess, as we don't have additional savings on top of our down payment set aside for this. No guarantee that a condo will increase in value in five years. I'd buy long term to minimize risk. I'd also look into new west. Might be a compromise. Also the commute to Coquitlam isn't that bad on the highway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
inane Posted August 17, 2015 Share Posted August 17, 2015 House is better investment, but don't underestimate the cost of living far away. Health costs, time wasted in traffic, car costs, distance from friends etc... It adds up. I had friends who lived in Vancouver and thought they got a great deal on a house in south surrey. After 6 months they moved back cause the commute was killing them, no one ever visits and any savings in mortgage payments were eaten up by bs they didn't have to spend in Vancouver. As they say, location, location, location. Don't get sucked in by the whole suburban white picket fence, 2.5 kids and a dog fantasy. This is not your parents world anymore. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
riffraff Posted August 17, 2015 Share Posted August 17, 2015 Owning the land you live on ie a house is financially better for you. If you have no children yet a condo would be fine and relatively low maintenance. When you have kids a house is great....the outdoor space. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aGENT Posted August 17, 2015 Share Posted August 17, 2015 Tough call. Lifestyle vs investment largely. Land is what's worth money (and increases in value) and you don't get any with a condo (or most town homes). Space, privacy, a yard, freedom to paint/decorate as you wish etc are all VERY nice but you also then have the added work/expense of yard work, maintenance etc that comes with a house. Particularly an older one that's likely to need things repaired/replaced more. Then as Inane eluded to you have things like commute, public transit, distance from friends/family etc to consider. Tough call only you can make. You could always try to find a compromise and find a small, old house in Burnaby/New West and hopefully with a basement you could suite to help with the mortgage in your price range. It would be a bit of a needle in a haystack, likely be old and need a LOT of work and possibly not in the nicest area though. This doesn't actually look too bad (right on busy 10th Ave though): http://www.realtor.ca/Residential/Single-Family/16037430/8093-10TH-AV-Burnaby-British-Columbia-V3N2S4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Offensive Threat Posted August 17, 2015 Share Posted August 17, 2015 If your planning on at least a few years before having kids you can buy a condo and move up when necessary. Or rent until then. Up until they enter school kids are fine with moving to a new area and adjust easily. my brother bought a condo in New west. Ground floor with a little yard but with a 4 year old and a second child on the way they are going to be buying a nearby townhouse. They love the area and the schools arent overcrowded like they are in Surrey and Langley where new home construction is booming. They were looking at a nice townhouse in Langley, much larger and nicer than what they can afford in New West, until they found out the new nearby grade school which opens next year is already expected to be at double capacity when its finished. Plus they would be paying the toll on the Port man times 2 which negates a lot of the value in moving out to Langley ($310 per month for the 2 cars IF they dont raise it again) $310 a month will cover $70,000 of a mortgage. That is the difference in price between comparable town houses in New West and Langley. Id rather put that money into my homes value than the ministry of highways coffers. One thing. Because the bank will lend you a certain amount doesnt mean you should spend it all. Look closely at what that will mean to your month to month cash flow before just accepting that as what you can afford. Also remember in 5 years interest rates may be substantially higher than they are now. If your income hasnt gone up much by then it can cause a problem. I bought my first home, a condo, in 1996. It was a lot easier back then even with 7.5% interest rates. We moved from there to a townhouse and eventually to a house. Each time we sold in the early then late 2000s it was for more than double what we had paid. If I was starting out now itd be so much harder. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
etsen3 Posted August 17, 2015 Share Posted August 17, 2015 I'm a condo person myself. Taking care of a yard and doing maintenance sounds like a hassle I don't need. I don't need a lot of space and I would rather have a convenient location where I can do more activities outside the house. Not to mention I find the suburbs extremely dull and I don't really enjoy the people. I'm also in a very different place in life than OP, so your tastes and needs are vastly different than mine. I just want a cool place to sleep and eat, in a great location. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
taxi Posted August 17, 2015 Share Posted August 17, 2015 If your planning on at least a few years before having kids you can buy a condo and move up when necessary. Or rent until then. Up until they enter school kids are fine with moving to a new area and adjust easily. my brother bought a condo in New west. Ground floor with a little yard but with a 4 year old and a second child on the way they are going to be buying a nearby townhouse. They love the area and the schools arent overcrowded like they are in Surrey and Langley where new home construction is booming. They were looking at a nice townhouse in Langley, much larger and nicer than what they can afford in New West, until they found out the new nearby grade school which opens next year is already expected to be at double capacity when its finished. Plus they would be paying the toll on the Port man times 2 which negates a lot of the value in moving out to Langley ($310 per month for the 2 cars IF they dont raise it again) $310 a month will cover $70,000 of a mortgage. That is the difference in price between comparable town houses in New West and Langley. Id rather put that money into my homes value than the ministry of highways coffers. One thing. Because the bank will lend you a certain amount doesnt mean you should spend it all. Look closely at what that will mean to your month to month cash flow before just accepting that as what you can afford. Also remember in 5 years interest rates may be substantially higher than they are now. If your income hasnt gone up much by then it can cause a problem. I bought my first home, a condo, in 1996. It was a lot easier back then even with 7.5% interest rates. We moved from there to a townhouse and eventually to a house. Each time we sold in the early then late 2000s it was for more than double what we had paid. If I was starting out now itd be so much harder. The moving on up strategy only works in a market where prices are going up. It also doesn't work well in a system where the prices of condos have been relatively steady, but detached homes keep skyrocketing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Olympic Canuck Posted August 17, 2015 Author Share Posted August 17, 2015 Thank you all for your feedback; these are all very valid points and useful information to keep in mind for us. House is better investment, but don't underestimate the cost of living far away. Health costs, time wasted in traffic, car costs, distance from friends etc... It adds up. I had friends who lived in Vancouver and thought they got a great deal on a house in south surrey. After 6 months they moved back cause the commute was killing them, no one ever visits and any savings in mortgage payments were eaten up by bs they didn't have to spend in Vancouver. As they say, location, location, location. Don't get sucked in by the whole suburban white picket fence, 2.5 kids and a dog fantasy. This is not your parents world anymore. You're right, the distance from our families and friends is the biggest con to moving to the suburbs. And it is, admittedly, something we've probably not given enough though in terms of just how big of an impact it'll have our lives. At this point we've accepted that distance from family and friends/ social lives will be impacted and "we'll learn to adjust". Needless to say that's going to be much tougher in practice of course. It would also be nice to cancel my gym membership (assuming the building has a workout room) and not have to worry about "maintenance work". My concern with going with the condo in Vancouver/Burnaby route is what if in say 5 years when we're ready to have kids and upsize to house we can't sell the condo for a decent profit? The condo market on Vancouver and Burnaby is growing out of control (there's literally new developments going up everywhere). I assume this saturation will have an impact sooner or later. The second reason is if we don't purchase a house in the suburbs now, we may be priced out in 5 years. Detached houses in pretty much all of the Lower Mainland are jumping up in price on a monthly basis. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RonMexico Posted August 17, 2015 Share Posted August 17, 2015 House is better investment, but don't underestimate the cost of living far away. Health costs, time wasted in traffic, car costs, distance from friends etc... It adds up. I had friends who lived in Vancouver and thought they got a great deal on a house in south surrey. After 6 months they moved back cause the commute was killing them, no one ever visits and any savings in mortgage payments were eaten up by bs they didn't have to spend in Vancouver. As they say, location, location, location. Don't get sucked in by the whole suburban white picket fence, 2.5 kids and a dog fantasy. This is not your parents world anymore. Investing in a detached house is a bad idea right now unless you can really afford to carry it at a higher interest rate than what you currently have. Investing in property is also a risk, it's not guaranteed to return anything. Interest rates are so low that if you scrimp and save just to able to afford what your lender says you can spend - I think it's at least 75% of your income which is insane, you will be up the creek if that interest rate goes up. There is just no way I can see the interest staying this low forever. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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