Nino Posted September 29, 2015 Share Posted September 29, 2015 So does any team want Vey for a 2nd? No Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Georgie Best Posted September 29, 2015 Share Posted September 29, 2015 Macann na should be NHL ya ah goo goo ga ga, frack you typo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hearditall Posted September 29, 2015 Share Posted September 29, 2015 OP started this & I give him all the credit. Big thumbs up as I instantly was interested & followed this forum as I never am really on the prospect one. People called U out for starting this thread & some even wanted it blocked, (lol) but I always enjoyed it for the same reason as U. I love the way McCann plays. Way tougher & stronger than his weight suggests (as quite a few young kids are now a days with the training, coaching, dieting, etc.) as well as his will to competes. U can never measure weight against HEART. Just ask the likes of a few of the top of my head: St.louis Gudreau Marchand Gallagher Krug T.Johnson T.Ennis Gionta Hudler Dionne Sakic Hull Crosby Gretzky Bure etc. etc. etc. Oh yah Sedins. they were only 180 when they started in the NHL. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
baumerman77 Posted September 29, 2015 Share Posted September 29, 2015 OP started this & I give him all the credit. Big thumbs up as I instantly was interested & followed this forum as I never am really on the prospect one. People called U out for starting this thread & some even wanted it blocked, (lol) but I always enjoyed it for the same reason as U. I love the way McCann plays. Way tougher & stronger than his weight suggests (as quite a few young kids are now a days with the training, coaching, dieting, etc.) as well as his will to competes. U can never measure weight against HEART. Just ask the likes of a few of the top of my head: St.louis Gudreau Marchand Gallagher Krug T.Johnson T.Ennis Gionta Hudler Dionne Crosby Gretzky Bure etc. etc. etc. Oh yah Sedins. they were only 180 when they started in the NHL. Sure you can. Perhaps you should include the hundreds of nameless prospects every year who get passed over because they are too small. That logic is just circular because you are defining "heart" to fit with those who succeeded. That being said, I think skill (as many would argue your list reflects) often can compensate for a lack of size to a certain extent. Let's not through out ill-defined terms like "heart" and claim that only winners (or those who succeed in the NHL) have it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hearditall Posted September 29, 2015 Share Posted September 29, 2015 Skill + Heart = NHL Skill - Heart = AHL Heart - Skill = AHL Which player above has no heart to go along with skill that I mentioned??? lol. None. They all have a bigger hearts than frame, every one of the above... St. Louis, Gretzky, Gallagher, Dionne, Bure, T.Johnson, REPEAT REPEAT.... U don't make it thru peewee, bantam, midget, juniors, playing for their respected countries & make it the SHOW without a HUGE HEART & SKILL. All of the above have those 2 attributes..... I only speak facts not fiction... The ones getting past over with skill obviously were lacking (Guess What) HEART.... PS when will u give it up with your arguing pure facts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
baumerman77 Posted September 29, 2015 Share Posted September 29, 2015 Skill + Heart = NHL Skill - Heart = AHL Heart - Skill = AHL Which player above has no heart to go along with skill that I mentioned??? lol. None. They all have a bigger hearts than frame, every one of the above... St. Louis, Gretzky, Gallagher, Dionne, Bure, T.Johnson, REPEAT REPEAT.... U don't make it thru peewee, bantam, midget, juniors, playing for their respected countries & make it the SHOW without a HUGE HEART & SKILL. All of the above have those 2 attributes..... I only speak facts not fiction... The ones getting past over with skill obviously were lacking (Guess What) HEART.... PS when will u give it up with your arguing pure facts. Define "heart" with some objective criteria. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hearditall Posted September 29, 2015 Share Posted September 29, 2015 Define "heart" with some objective criteria. Obviously U never played a competitive sport. Never mind make it as a pro.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
baumerman77 Posted September 29, 2015 Share Posted September 29, 2015 Obviously U never played a competitive sport. Never mind make it as a pro.. So you can't define "heart" by any objective criteria? Well if that's the case then why should I believe you when you say player X has it but player Y doesn't? Especially if it is supposedly so important. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
messier's_elbow Posted September 29, 2015 Share Posted September 29, 2015 The one thing I want to mention is that today's 19 yr olds are not the same as 10 year ago 19 year olds in general. Todays 19 yr olds have had much better coaching, skill development, & strength development than 10+ years ago. SOME of these teenagers (Horvat, McKinnon, Eichel, Bennett, McDavid Ekland, etc, etc.) have clearly demonstrated that. You must give a much longer look at these teenagers today. They are groomed better than some vets in the league because some of those vets never had the training & coaching that these teenagers are getting today. I can see McCann going back to juniors to dominate there & in the WJ's after some NHL games, but as for next season I see him on this team NO DOUBT. Not AHL bound at all in my eyes but time will only tell. the AHL is good for young players. Especially with green running the operation. All our guys from Utica look like they are developing well and they aren't rushing guys. Giroux took a similar route as I suggested. He played in the AHL and dominated. Hes a guy who's slight and skilled like McCann. Kind of a similar trajectory in my eyes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeNiro Posted September 29, 2015 Share Posted September 29, 2015 the AHL is good for young players. Especially with green running the operation. All our guys from Utica look like they are developing well and they aren't rushing guys. Giroux took a similar route as I suggested. He played in the AHL and dominated. Hes a guy who's slight and skilled like McCann. Kind of a similar trajectory in my eyes. I think this is one of those situations where the Canucks would love to be able to send McCann to the AHL early. Unfortunately the only option is the NHL or the OHL. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
messier's_elbow Posted September 29, 2015 Share Posted September 29, 2015 So does any team want Vey for a 2nd?Lol only trader Jim would take that bait. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
messier's_elbow Posted September 29, 2015 Share Posted September 29, 2015 Regardless of what happens with McCann he looks like a future top 6 centre man thank god. The best course is to give him the 9 game taste. He's earned it. He keeps playing like this keep him. If not Then let him play on the Canada junior team and all of a sudden he has a lot of high end experience. He practiced with a high end AHL playoff team last year as well. A half a season being the go to guy in junior isnt that terrible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
suomistyler Posted September 29, 2015 Share Posted September 29, 2015 Skill + Heart = NHL Skill - Heart = AHL Heart - Skill = AHL Which player above has no heart to go along with skill that I mentioned??? lol. None. They all have a bigger hearts than frame, every one of the above... St. Louis, Gretzky, Gallagher, Dionne, Bure, T.Johnson, REPEAT REPEAT.... U don't make it thru peewee, bantam, midget, juniors, playing for their respected countries & make it the SHOW without a HUGE HEART & SKILL. All of the above have those 2 attributes..... I only speak facts not fiction... The ones getting past over with skill obviously were lacking (Guess What) HEART.... PS when will u give it up with your arguing pure facts. this is taking a very reductionist approach to assessing nhl worthiness. if these were the only measurements of success, anyone could be an nhl scout...sign me up! as the other poster mentioned, its very easy to say after the fact that someone has more heart than someone else simply based on the fact that he was successful when the other was not. its like saying that white people are better off financially than other minorities because they have more skills and more heart. see how ridiculous that type of reasoning is? the human condition is far more complex and harder to measure and involves the confluence of factors such as genetics, environmental influences, opportunities given, psychological maturity, physical wear and tear on the body and on and on it goes.... if it was just all about skills and heart, then drafting would be easy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
khay Posted September 29, 2015 Share Posted September 29, 2015 So does any team want Vey for a 2nd? Maybe we can ask for refund from LA? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hearditall Posted September 29, 2015 Share Posted September 29, 2015 the AHL is good for young players. Especially with green running the operation. All our guys from Utica look like they are developing well and they aren't rushing guys. Giroux took a similar route as I suggested. He played in the AHL and dominated. Hes a guy who's slight and skilled like McCann. Kind of a similar trajectory in my eyes. Not saying it ain't good for players? OBVIOUSLY IT IS for 90%+ of them but McCann ain't 90% of them. Kinda like Horvat, Eklad, Sedins, McKinnon, etc. & someone who he really resembles McCann to me, M.Richards... Born Winners who don't need pro conditionng like most. M.Richards: http://www.hockeydb.com/ihdb/stats/pdisplay.php?pid=59738 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hearditall Posted September 29, 2015 Share Posted September 29, 2015 this is taking a very reductionist approach to assessing nhl worthiness. if these were the only measurements of success, anyone could be an nhl scout...sign me up! as the other poster mentioned, its very easy to say after the fact that someone has more heart than someone else simply based on the fact that he was successful when the other was not. its like saying that white people are better off financially than other minorities because they have more skills and more heart. see how ridiculous that type of reasoning is? the human condition is far more complex and harder to measure and involves the confluence of factors such as genetics, environmental influences, opportunities given, psychological maturity, physical wear and tear on the body and on and on it goes.... if it was just all about skills and heart, then drafting would be easy. Sorry making hockey isn't the sme as making your own export company up... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maniwaki Canuck Posted September 29, 2015 Share Posted September 29, 2015 Not saying it ain't good for players? OBVIOUSLY IT IS for 90%+ of them but McCann ain't 90% of them. Kinda like Horvat, Eklad, Sedins, McKinnon, etc. & someone who he really resembles McCann to me, M.Richards... Born Winners who don't need pro conditionng like most. M.Richards: http://www.hockeydb.com/ihdb/stats/pdisplay.php?pid=59738 The Richards comparison is looking kind of "unfortunate" (as they say) these days. McCann looks to have more offensive upside and better character than that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maniwaki Canuck Posted September 29, 2015 Share Posted September 29, 2015 In Willie's post-game comments last night, he said point-blank that some vets are in danger of losing their jobs to prospects who are out-playing them. This was after discussing McCann and Hutton, who I take to be the prospects in question. Clearly a shot across Vey's bow, but I'm not sure who they would cut loose for Hutton. Maybe we're closer than we know to seeing McCann make the team. No question he's earning it up to now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
combover Posted September 29, 2015 Share Posted September 29, 2015 They really need to look at this rule that forces guys that are ready for the next level yet are forced to return to jr hockey. McCann virtanen as well a quite a few others are beyond jr but maybe not full time nhl ready. ahl is the natural next step. Maybe The rule should be guys drafted in the first round are excempt from this development freezing rule but if the nhl club chooses they can return to jr. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
73 Percent Posted September 29, 2015 Share Posted September 29, 2015 They really need to look at this rule that forces guys that are ready for the next level yet are forced to return to jr hockey. McCann virtanen as well a quite a few others are beyond jr but maybe not full time nhl ready. ahl is the natural next step. Maybe The rule should be guys drafted in the first round are excempt from this development freezing rule but if the nhl club chooses they can return to jr.its been discussed here many times. Some believe it will cripple the chl if thats done. What dhould happen is every team gets 1 exception. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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