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Prospects pushing vets


captaincowbasher

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Higgins is a work horse every night. He doesn't have moments of flash like Hansen so people want him gone. :picard:

They are both great players but also players we "should" get a good return for. They are third line players at best but great ones, problem is we need third line openings to bring in our prospects so I just see them as blockers to our rebuild.

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Its unbelievable how many people want to stay the course with a bunch of vets who have really proven nothing when everything matters, rather than moving on, taking some rough patches and letting the young guys learn with experience. Not every team that injects youth is going to be on the "Edmonton" path. I would rather watch our young guys learn and entertain us, rather than another possible year of maybe just making the playoffs, getting bounced and dropping further for draft day. Face reality, the 2011 leftovers are finished, expired. Just counting the day until our team is Swede free

I take it, you just started watching hockey this year?

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They are both great players but also players we "should" get a good return for. They are third line players at best but great ones, problem is we need third line openings to bring in our prospects so I just see them as blockers to our rebuild.

Meh. I think of the Hs (Higgins & Hansen) as average 3rd liners, meaning far more sound that merely serviceable, but also hardly gonna rock the opposition with that awesome gooey intimidation affect. Still, they'd be keepers if not for the problem you flag - needing 3rd line openings to make room for the youth...

I think of how the Sedins, Keslers and Burrows of the Canucks world would have evolved if not for having a solid transition to the NHL via the 3rd line intro... I mean, those guys were properly developed by 1] being clearly ready for the NHL, 2] getting a full year on the 3rd (learning/playing/mastering 200 foot games), and 3] having the benefit of #2 because the team actually had a solid top 6. Meaning they got some traditional sheltering while being seasoned and mixed into the special teams second units.

In an ideal world, Horvat would get the benefit of another year at 3C, though start seeing more special teams minutes, while guys like Baer and Virtanen would play his wings for the full season. But that not only means Higgins & Hansen can't be taking up space on the 3rd line - there has to be a valid 2nd line that can be relied upon for secondary scoring and some of the harder minutes.

I think you're correct that Higgins & Hansen are bottlenecks - they should be 3rd liners who are, this year, replaced by youth such as Bear and Virt. It could be argued that Burrows, my fav who I think of as more the "great" 3rd liner at this stage, is also a bottleneck. I don't know what to think of Sutter (other than 1] he better live up to Bennings hype/hope, and 2] his effort/drive to do so hasn't impressed in the pre-season), and guess I wasn't too impressed with Vrbata last year either, go figure. I kinda see all of these guys - Higgins, Hansen, Burrows, Sutter and Vrbata as average to great 3rd liners. And so bottlenecks for youth getting proper 3rd line seasoning.

But the bigger problem, in my (not so) humble opinion, is that there is no genuine top 6 outside of the Sedins (who arguably are close to being aged into 2nd line duty themselves). If I plugged the current names into a roster where I think they'd fit on a genuine cup contender, it'd look like this - with the "bottlenecks" in brackets -

?? - ?? - ??

Sedin D - Sedin H - Burrows (Vrbata)

Baer (Higgins) - Horvat (Sutter) - Virtanen (Hansen)

Dorset - ?? (Vey) - ?? (Prust)

To be a real contender, I think the Canucks need

1] a full 1st or 2nd line - a trio of established young vets, mid to late 20s guys, to provide proven top 6 offense

2] a 4C who is an ace in the dot (Maholtra's offspring?) and offers a physical, durable veteran body

3] age/phase out Higgins, Sutter (I know, won't happen now), Hansen, and Prust

4] waive/trade or whatever else can be done, but call it a day for Vey (see point 2)

Seeing how none of that is gonna happen this year, the best we can hope is that despite the lack of traditional 3rd line seasoning, each of Baer and Horvat take big leaps this year, along with someone like Virtanen, so there's a genuine trio to play 1st/2nd line next year, that Sutter doesn't mind being a well-paid 3rd liner until the Sedins retire, and somewhere between today and the trade deadline, bottlenecks Higgins and Hansen, possibly Burrows too, and Vey and Prust are moved.

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Forward vets to keep

Sedins

Burrows

Sutter

Dorsette

I'd rather have prust long term deal at lower cap than Hansen

It's time to integrate virtanen, beartschi, McCann, gaunce because next year how can you incorporate virtanen, gaunce, shink, Cassels, Mcann all at once

Ya, why would we want any decent players in Utica for call ups. Let's just empty the farm and put them on the team now ready or not.

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Oh, you mean that Swede Kesler, that put the team on his back and carried it until he got hurt while the other Swede let himself get speed-bagged by a guy about up to his knee.

It was the Swedes that put the team on their backs in San Jose when Kesler disappeared. Some seem to forget that part and focus only on the Nashville series. The one and only series Kesler dominated.

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Right now (and it may change slightly over the last couple of games)

Sedin/Sedin/Burrows

Baertschi/Horvat/Vrbata

Gaunce/Sutter/Dorsett

Virtanen/McCann/Prust

Cracknell- I think he's earned the 13th forward spot and he can slot in for a young guy when needed

IR- Higgins

Edler/Tanev

Hamhuis/Bartowski

Weber/Hutton - Hutton needs to play if he's in the NHL

Sbisa

Biega

Markstrom - yes he's my No. 1 because he's completely out playing Miller

Miller

Trade Hansen- Maybe you get a 3rd rd pick for him

Send down, Fedun, Corrado, Grenier, Kenins, Vey. Corrado, Kenins and Grenier all need to play and they will get that chance in Utica. Fedun and Vey haven't been good enough to earn NHL jobs.

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Right now (and it may change slightly over the last couple of games)

Sedin/Sedin/Burrows

Baertschi/Horvat/Vrbata

Gaunce/Sutter/Dorsett

Virtanen/McCann/Prust

Cracknell- I think he's earned the 13th forward spot and he can slot in for a young guy when needed

IR- Higgins

Edler/Tanev

Hamhuis/Bartowski

Weber/Hutton - Hutton needs to play if he's in the NHL

Sbisa

Biega

Markstrom - yes he's my No. 1 because he's completely out playing Miller

Miller

Trade Hansen- Maybe you get a 3rd rd pick for him

Send down, Fedun, Corrado, Grenier, Kenins, Vey. Corrado, Kenins and Grenier all need to play and they will get that chance in Utica. Fedun and Vey haven't been good enough to earn NHL jobs.

Trade Higgins over Hansen. I'd trade Burrows over Hansen even.

Corrado and Vey have to go through waivers, try and trade them first.

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