The Province - Willie comes strong defending the deployment of his young players

[Fateless]

I think Willie's approach makes sense, I just disagree that his actions last night jive with what he is saying. The young guys were taking chances all night. Virtanen went deep for big hits and a few plays multiple times. McCann had two excellent scoring opportunities. I didn't see at any point that they stopped playing like they should - at least until Willie benched them.

I agree with wanting to keep them confident, I just don't see how benching them for the last half the game after them doing well in the first half is going to boost that confidence. 

Again, I buy his approach and think he's right. I just don't think that's what went down last night.

[Canorth]

Willie was brought in because he was good with young players. Now is his time to show he can develop these guys and put them in situations where they can succeed.

To me this is just a distraction from the fact that Willie still hasn't been able to figure out his lines 7 games into the season. He may have started the season late, but the players didn't. The lack of scoring is a direct result of the lack of organization in preseason.

Lack of organization in the preseason is also a direct result of young players pushing for and earning spots on the team. None of this was expected, especially Hutton & McCann. It's the cost of integrating young players on to the team. I'm sure it would have been a much smoother preseason if the rookies didnt improve and didn't push for spots - the trade off being no rookies in the lineup....

[ilduce39]

I really like what WD is saying here - definitely a good element to focus on with the kids.  If you're going to make a mistake, do it at full speed.

 

 

 

[Me_]

Not surprisingly though, the complaining is cherry-picked, as usual.

On the one hand, Baertschi (who arguably needs shelthering and has shown as much) and the two teenagers aren't being used in lockdown situations.

On the other, Horvat, who proved himself able to handle them, was considered ready for those situations early in his career.

Last night Hutton and Sbisa combined for 2 offensive zone starts and 13 defensive - handled fairly large minutes against a very strong opponent and did well imo. 

WD appears to look at each situation on an individual basis - as he should - as opposed to satisfying the cookie-cutter expectations of some people around here that want everyone be treated equally and that all the young guys 'get a chance'.   That's not how it works - thankfully.  This isn't youth culture kumbaya. 

If you want the youth to succeed, you put them in situations to succeed - not throw them in over their head prematurely.  

Second that.

+1

[oldnews]

I understand Willie's stance, but giving them some shifts might have made a difference.

McCann strikes me as a guy who takes more risks in clutch time; but then again--he did go to the bench asap whenever he made a mistake in the neutral zone.

Baertschi should have gotten more time, as his puck possession prowess put a lot of pressure on the Caps--especially since we won so many faceoffs--but he kept getting blocked.

Virtanen is someone who could have given Prust a breather, as he's a high energy guy who plays quite safe--maybe too safe.  

I can see why Willie shortened the bench, but when it was 2-2 they might have played with the urgency that was needed.  

This is exactly what WD referred to in that interview.  Under pressure they're letting off a bit on their aggression - trying not to make mistakes - and that lack of puck pressure / ceding space is as costly as playing their game without the apprehension.

They'll come along soon enough imo.  I've found Virtanen to be smarter and more responsible without the puck than I'd expected at this point - very good decision making imo.  If anything McCann has had more frequent lapses of judgement or coverage - but they're both fine imo and their development trajectories are ahead of what could reasonably have been expected.

WD will ease them into greater roles imo - he'll reward them in due course for attention to detail and they'll be better players for it.  If anything, I've been pleasantly surprised by their ability to take this step on a lot of levels - my only real concern might  be McCann's durability at this age with the kind of attention he is getting from opponents - but overall, they're really exciting young players to watch progress.  I think WD has a pretty good handle on it.

[Canorth]

Becoming more and more clear why WD never before was given the opportunity behind an NHL bench.  

Except of course for that job in Pittsburgh he turned down

[TOMapleLaughs]

Down 3-2 late.  Puts out Prust and Dorsett.

This might not be so much a developmental theory problem, so much as a lack of depth problem.

Bo's been quiet thus far this season.  At what point does someone notice he's undergoing a classic sophomore jinx?

[coolboarder]

McCann handling so far in the young season makes sense because if you are planning to keep him on the roster after 9 game mark, you want to gradually gain minutes as the season go on, you do not want to burn him out fast after 82-game season.  He is not physically mature and he is ready for some NHL time as evidenced by his play.  He has not made any glaring mistake so far and I feel that he can play with the Canucks.  With the low minutes, he then can focus on the fitness side to build his body to a standard NHL body and when he is getting stronger, he can play more minutes with some scratches along the way will not lose his confidence because Junior game is different than the pro game.  

 

If you do not plan to keep him after 9 game mark and you want to see what he is made of, you play him more minutes in the third period.   With that strategy, I have a feeling that McCann and Virtenan will make the team after 9 game mark, hence the reason of benching them in the 3rd period to keep them fresh and gradually make them stronger on a fitness side.   Their skill is NHL-ready but they are physically not NHL-ready yet and they could build them up to get them to NHL-ready physically when mid-season comes just like Horvat did last year.  

[RakuRaku]

WD's coaching style is simply too conservative! This is a crucial transitional year for our team and we fans deserve to be entertained by these exciting rookies... there's a reason why there are so many empty seats... mostly due to the quality of the product.

Just roll all 4 lines and see where they can take us before the 9-game trial ends! McCann is clearly skilled enough to play in the NHL and Virtanen needs the right linemates to create chances. The last thing we need is seeing Virtanen and McCann returned to juniors and have Kenins and Vey take their spots. That would be so counter-productive!

[alfstonker]

How is a player/line going to become more aggressive and confident when they get benched for things like: setting up a goal?

Did you read that before you posted it?

You don't make a player better by letting him star gaze (Jake) on the ice, or get knocked on his ass all night (Jared) Do you really want the fans to turn against them, because that is what will eventually happen. 

Fans wan to win and Willie's job depends on it. Willie has a good coaching record with youngsters and you don't achieve that by throwing them under the bus every night. Being benched is part of learning for rookies (ask Green, he does it often enough in Utica)

 

[DIBdaQUIB]

I'll buy it. I believe Willie D is genuine with what he said, and from how he handled Horvat and Vey last year, I think he deserves a bit more trust from the fans.

That said, I think even Willie would admit that last night they tried to shorten the bench and get that game at least to OT. We started the 3rd on the PK, and by the 5 minute mark it was 2-2. As much as I disagree with the call, I don't blame him.

It was an important game early in the season, and the way things have gone at home, the win would have been a monkey off their back (against one of the best teams in the league right now).

 

Problem is...playing the kids got them into the lead.  To suddenly decide the kids can't be trusted to win the game sends all kinds of wrong messages.  It also over-works the other players an fatigue leads to mistakes.   Like others have said, you either play the kids and allow for their mistakes od send them down.  Playing the likes of Prust and Dorsett 15+ minutes a night will not lead this team to the playoffs.

[Ilya Mikheyev]

Did you read that before you posted it?

You don't make a player better by letting him star gaze (Jake) on the ice, or get knocked on his ass all night (Jared) Do you really want the fans to turn against them, because that is what will eventually happen. 

Fans wan to win and Willie's job depends on it. Willie has a good coaching record with youngsters and you don't achieve that by throwing them under the bus every night. Being benched is part of learning for rookies (ask Green, he does it often enough in Utica)

 

That's not what has happened with Virt or anyone on that "kid line." I agree about McCann—he has a ton of skills, but not the strength to be a NHL center at this point. 

When a line is playing well, and you break them up and sit them for what I see as poor rational—like after setting up the Bartkowski goal or the 10-point pre-season game, their confidence will hurt. 

[PhillipBlunt]

WD's coaching style is simply too conservative! This is a crucial transitional year for our team and we fans deserve to be entertained by these exciting rookies... there's a reason why there are so many empty seats... mostly due to the quality of the product.

Just roll all 4 lines and see where they can take us before the 9-game trial ends! McCann is clearly skilled enough to play in the NHL and Virtanen needs the right linemates to create chances. The last thing we need is seeing Virtanen and McCann returned to juniors and have Kenins and Vey take their spots. That would be so counter-productive!

While I was critical of WD benching the kids last night, seeing his comments makes some sense now. It is still early in the season too.

But you need to really give the whole "I'm a paying customer and I deserve to be entertained by rookies" a rest. It has nothing to do with what you deserve. It has a lot more to do with taking these unbelievably talented young players and acclimating them to the NHL properly rather than rushing them in so that some yokel in the nosebleeds has a reason to wave his giant Styrofoam hand and scream.

This is about long term goals, not instant gratification.

[alfstonker]

Willie was brought in because he was good with young players. Now is his time to show he can develop these guys and put them in situations where they can succeed.

To me this is just a distraction from the fact that Willie still hasn't been able to figure out his lines 7 games into the season. He may have started the season late, but the players didn't. The lack of scoring is a direct result of the lack of organization in preseason.

Really? 

Gifted players like McDavid and from his performances so far, Hutton are developed in the NHL Players like McCann, Virtanen and increasingly apparent, Baertschi should be developed in the A, or do we turn it all upside down because this is "youth-starved" Vancouver?

It is completely laughable to say it is an NHL coach's job to develop prospects who can barely cope out there on the ice. You do realise we are witnessing the exact opposite of what we saw with Bo, who's 9 games was an upward curve compared to what we are seeing with Jake and McCann. Are we so hell bent on ruining these young careers just so we can kid ourselves we have got McDavid out there.

I wanted to see them flourish like Bo too but I don't, unlike you it appears, let that blind me to what I am actually seeing on the ice. To somehow make their poor showing, Willie's fault makes me think you have spent so much time in the prospects thread it is affecting your judgement (which is normally pretty sound, I might add)

 

[Hairy Kneel]

He did the exact opposite with Vey.

Doesn't make sense..I think he's totally projecting his attributes about fear and lack of aggression onto the kid line.

[Canuck Surfer]

Down 3-2 late.  Puts out Prust and Dorsett.

This might not be so much a developmental theory problem, so much as a lack of depth problem.

Bo's been quiet thus far this season.  At what point does someone notice he's undergoing a classic sophomore jinx?

I thought that was interesting. Bo was at his best last year playing against lesser competition. But with energy guys like Dorsett, Hansen & Kenins. 

Jinx? Maybe.

I think Horvat has been a bit miscast this year.  Ok so he has received 2knd line minutes and situations. That could be fine. How successful is he going to be doing a defensive zone start, against top competition. But with offensive guys like Baer & Vrbata? All three got off to a poor start because it was the wrong sort of matches for him to be playing with. If he was our top "match up centre" anyway.

All three (Horvat, Baer, Vrbata) are likely to come around now that they are starting to be used with players more suited to what they are being deployed to accomplish. Vrbata with the Twins to score. Baer with McCann because he also has offensive creativity and puck control. Horvat with guys like Burrows & Hansen.

And Horvat was double shifted with Dorsett whom he had success with last year plus Prust. I was ok with that. When some of the leash was taken ff the other rookies late in the game. Horvat and Dorsett both scored a lot last year creating pressure, then going on the counter attack. Which is exactly what you need when down at the end of a game.

 

[alfstonker]

That's not what has happened with Virt or anyone on that "kid line." I agree about McCann—he has a ton of skills, but not the strength to be a NHL center at this point. 

When a line is playing well, and you break them up and sit them for what I see as poor rational—like after setting up the Bartkowski goal or the 10-point pre-season game, their confidence will hurt. 

Well when exactly were they "playing well" in planet earth time?

Which line were they out performing?

Which of them outshone poor Cracknell who has had 20 shots 2 goals and +2, in 6 games, isn't getting knocked on his ass and who actually functions like an NHLer out there but finds himself surplus to requirements because we have to play these rookies even when their play doesn't warrant it?

It seems your bias is kicking your memory's butt.

[alfstonker]

Problem is...playing the kids got them into the lead.  To suddenly decide the kids can't be trusted to win the game sends all kinds of wrong messages.  It also over-works the other players an fatigue leads to mistakes.   Like others have said, you either play the kids and allow for their mistakes od send them down.  Playing the likes of Prust and Dorsett 15+ minutes a night will not lead this team to the playoffs.

Come on!

They may have been on the ice, granted, but in what stretch of the imagination does that equate to "got them into the lead" Is that the kind of logic used when Vey is playing, or Higgins? Damn right it isn't.

[Ilya Mikheyev]

Well when exactly were they "playing well" in planet earth time?

Which line were they out performing?

Which of them outshone poor Cracknell who has had 20 shots 2 goals and +2, in 6 games, isn't getting knocked on his ass and who actually functions like an NHLer out there but finds himself surplus to requirements because we have to play these rookies even when their play doesn't warrant it?

It seems your bias is kicking your memory's butt.

Cracknell's been great and has earned his two goals. But if you want to talk about memory, Cracknell has only had 10 shots compared to Horvat's 12 and Virtanen who has 7 in 4 games despite getting hardly any opportunity (7,8, 9, 8 TOI so far). The kid line was showing much more promise than the Prust - Cracknell - Dorsett line, not including the Washington game IMO. And I think a huge hit to their aggressiveness and confidence is the fact they keep getting benched for petty reasons. 

[RakuRaku]

I got a feeling WD is still upset with management's decision to send Vey down.... you could totally tell Vey was always his lover boy all season long... I'm no Vey basher but he just lacks certain elements (drive & hunger) we find in Jake and Jared.

I hope I'm wrong about WD but it would be a joke if Jake and Jared never get the proper playing time and then get sent down after their 9 games.... and instantly welcome back Vey! I wouldn't mind seeing Vey back to the team if Higgins or Burrows get traded for a pick....