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[Discussion] Do Benning and Linden have what it takes to move the Sedins on time?

Ilya Mikheyev

By Ilya Mikheyev
in Canucks Talk

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Ilya Mikheyev Canucks First-Line

Ilya Mikheyev

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Will Jim Benning and the Canucks’ brass have what it takes to move the Sedins this off-season?

Everyone watched as Jay Feaster waited too long to move the greatest player in Calgary history, Jarome Iginla and longtime franchise cornerstone, goalie Mikka Kiprusoff.


Although Iginla still managed to put up high point totals, his age became a concern and his contract status shifted his value from a multi-year investment to a rental player.

As Eric Francis puts it “Ask almost anyone…around the NHL and they’ll tell you the Calgary Flames waited at least a year too long before trading Jarome Iginla.”

In the end, Feaster landed a conditional 1st and two mid-level prospects, one who has now played 8 NHL games and one now 25 year old who plays in the DEL (Germany’s top hockey league). Calgary ended up with the 1st rounder, but because they traded Iginla to such a high-level team, it was a late first rounder that has turned into Emile Poirier, who might end up being a serviceable NHLer eventually.

For Kiprusoff, Feaster landed nothing as he decided to retire after a poor performance.

Not only does a failure to land solid assets create a longer rebuilding process, regardless of what kind of route the team takes to rebuild, it also makes the changing of the guard more difficult.

The Canucks have their own example in Markus Naslund. Naslund was a franchise player during the Canucks’ West Coast Express era and served as Captain.

As he slowed down, Nonis opted not to move him. He slowly declined. As a Captain, he was not a loud leader, but a silent one who led by his dynamic offensive play on the ice. Without that, there was a leadership vacuum and the Canucks failed to make the playoffs in 2 of his last 3 seasons. There was also zero progress on building toward the future as Nonis failed to acquire future assets for the aging star and continued to sign project players to fill holes.

When Gillis came a board, Naslund was no longer under contract, so he let him walk and the Canucks, clearly led by the Sedins and supported by fresh newcomers or players in new roles like Pavol Demitra (RIP), Ryan Kesler and Mats Sundin, returned to the playoffs and built a foundation that would make them to the SCF.

Near the end of the WCE era, there were also implications about a dressing room divide between Bertuzzi and the WCE and what would become the Sedin-era.

The Canucks face issues with similarities to both the Nonis Canucks and Feaster Flames.

The Sedins are still putting up good numbers, can still control the pace of the game and still have a few years left in the NHL, and also on their contracts.

They won’t be moved this year, and it doesn’t make sense to move them. They are still the leaders, they’re going to be crucial in showing many young players the ropes, just like Naslund did for them in their early careers, and the Canucks want to build around success, not a full-tilt rebuild like the Oilers or pre-Crosby Penguins.

But in the off-season or at the draft, they won’t be old rental players. They’ll have 2 full seasons left on their contracts and teams will have opportunity to move around cap space for them—especially with a potential increase in cap spending.

Horvat, Sutter, McCann are all showing that they’re better than 4th line centers this year, and with another season, summer and perhaps playoff under their belts, none of them will develop in that role going forward.

There’s a youth transition happening, from being led by the Sedins to being led by a group of younger players like Bo Horvat, Chris Tanev and the rise of Ben Hutton. With character guys like McCann and Virtanen getting experience this year, it will continue to shift.

Would the departure of the Sedins leave the Canucks as non-playoff contenders?

Not necessarily. With a rising cap, a few ending contracts, especially those of Vrbata and Hamhuis, the space created by the Sedins, Benning would have some ability to replace their offense.

Even if it’s not Lucic, there’s going to be other UFAs like Ladd and Eriksson who could replace some of the lost offense. Plus, the Sedins could land a top-2 defenseman or a top-6 forward, or a blue-chip prospect ready to make the jump.

What is becoming clearer is that Jim Benning and Trevor Linden are creating a team in a similar mold to the Canucks they were part of in the late 80s and early-to-mid 90s. Fast, hard work ethic, intense, lots of Western Canadians who want to bring the cup to Vancouver/Canada and are willing to go to the dirty areas to do so. Their bringing in players with connections to Desjardins and Green who are both former WHL coaches, and sometimes players who they’ve coached against—like Brandon Sutter.

Another hint at their direction was when they took hometown WHLer Jake Virtanen over Fleury, Nylander or Ehlers. I’m happy with that pick, but it also signaled a specific direction as many had Virtanen ranked after those three.

The Sedins, unfortunately, don’t fit the mold of the future anymore. Yes, they’re hard workers, but they’re part of the last group of Canucks. Many of the key pieces from the pre-Benning era have already been moved out: Kevin Bieksa, Ryan Kesler, Alain Vigneault, Rick Bowness, Jason Garrison, Zach Kassian, Brad Richardson.

As Lyle Richardson, of the Hockey News observed, trading the Sedins could "spark" the rebuild and though they said they would rather finish their careers with the Canucks, they did not outright reject the notion of waiving their NTCs. 

And next off-season is the moment before the scale starts to tilt toward an Iginla or Kiprusoff ending, rather than one that brings in the future.

But with all the Sedins have brought to the franchise and to the community of Vancouver, along with being former teammates of Linden, will Benning and co. have what it takes to move two players who help keep their jobs safe?

 

 

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Ilya Mikheyev Canucks First-Line

Ilya Mikheyev

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they are 14 million in cap space what team could possibly add that to a stanley cup contender? maybe if it was a bottom feeder but then that wouldnt be realistic in terms of competing for the silver mug

Maybe Nashville?

They have an internal cap, they're stacked on D, and Shea Weber makes a similiar amount in salary as the Sedins do next year..

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Ghostsof1915 Canucks Hall-of-Famer

Ghostsof1915

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$14 million is a lot in salary. So unless the Coyotes feel they need the Sedins to make the playoffs, what would they offer?

A 1st and 2 Second round picks? Only once Doan and Boyd Gordon is off the books (In the offseason?).

As good as the Twins are. Every team would low ball them at their current salary. I'd rather keep them. 

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stawns Canucks Hall-of-Famer

stawns

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What if the loyalty is keeping the Canucks further away from the SCF, like it was with declining-Naslund?

but it's not......this team is easily 4 years from being a serious contender.  Keeping them until the end of their contract will help the organization more than hurt.  The only way a trade happens is if they indicate they play beyond the current contract and their salaries are out of range for JB

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apollo Canucks Franchise Player

apollo

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What if the loyalty is keeping the Canucks further away from the SCF, like it was with declining-Naslund?

Naslund isn't the same calibre player as the sedins. End of story. 

 

There is no way this team benefits if we move the twins. They are the most important citizens in BC. 

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RWMc1 Canucks First-Line

RWMc1

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First of all, they have  NMCs and would be unlikely to waive.

Secondly, they would probably have to go to a team that is seriously taking a run at the CUP.

Thirdly, the team in question would have to have cap space to acquire them.

So which team fits the bill?

I don't see it happening this off-season if at all.

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elvis15 Canucks Hall-of-Famer

elvis15

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Maybe Nashville?

They have an internal cap, they're stacked on D, and Shea Weber makes a similiar amount in salary as the Sedins do next year..

Yeah, because they'll trade us Weber for the Sedins, right...

 

I'd love to see the return they could get us, but it's not realistic for all the reasons already mentioned. Combined salary is an issue for cap strapped teams, combined cap hit is an issue for contenders. Their NMCs (which they deserve) means they control their destiny. If we try and force a trade they can just decide to retire.

Unless the Sedins come to us and say they'd like to try a move, Linden and Benning aren't going to ruin that legacy by forcing it. Even if they do start talking, it won't be this summer, it'll be at best a trade deadline deal in the final year of their contracts (2017/18) to make it easier from a cap perspective since retaining major pieces of cap for two full seasons is not likely to happen and we aren't likely to take any boat anchor cap dumps for any significant term either.

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TheRussianRocket. Canucks All-Star

TheRussianRocket.

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This is one of the dumbest posts ever. 

Did Detroit trade away Lidstrom and Yzerman? Did Colorado trade away Sakic? Sedin's are at that level for our organization. Luongo's/Kesler's/Bieksa's have been dealt and rightfully so. Hamhuis/Vrbata/Higgins might be in the near future. But the Sedin's, you don't trade them away just to get some minuscule value back at the end of their careers after they've done everything and beyond for this organization, city, province, and community. They are the franchise and you do whatever they want. If they are comfortable staying under a secondary role while the youngsters take over (which is what they have said), you fulfill those words and commit to what they say. If they say they want out (which they've never said), you trade them. If they walk when FA's to go elsewhere, you let them. They are that special to us and that's the respect and loyalty they will be given and treated with.

 

...absolutely ridiculous topic smh
ZiWKad22.jpg

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flickyoursedin Canucks First-Line

flickyoursedin

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No, let them finish here, they deserve it.

Sometimes a trade like this can set you up for a century. Think back to the Linden trade for example. In return we got Bertuzzi (had him for his best years and was a big part in Luongo trade), Ruutu and McCabe (which was a big part in getting the draft pick for Henrik Sedin at 3rd overall). Only to have Linden come back 5 years later. The twins would most likely come back the very next year.

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