Seriously! Jim? Trevor? Willie? What is going on in your minds and behind the Canucks bench during games?

[soshified]

Different circumstances though.

When it's a 3-2 loss where they weren't ready to play, yet somehow battled back into the game only to give it away with 17 seconds left. In that situation it's not okay to come away with nothing.

Games like this you gotta find a way to at least get a point. Those single points do add up at the end of the year.

Except the GWG wasn't even WD's fault. Sedins had a great rush back to the offense zone but Daniel did a stupid, dangerous pass.

It's funny when Canucks win games, you don't get these comments. But when they lose, all of sudden, "WD should be fired" "He should play the youth more" blah blah blah. Where in fact, they do get shifts in the third, but every nonsense fan here thinks they should get 15+.

[swizzey]

 Team had a "bounce back" year last year thanks to rolling 4 lines. DIDN'T roll 4 lines in the playoffs last year against a younger, more aggressive, faster, AND BETTER COACHED Calgary team. Results are obvious history by now.

Along comes the offseason moves, talk of youth and re-tooling on the fly, making room, etc., etc. Lo and behold we have three youthful standouts in pre season and true to Benning's word they all make the team. Deservedly so in my books. Kids looked great, 4 lines for the most part were used for whole games and some early wins started piling up. Yes, against struggling Calgary, Edmonton, LA, and Anaheim teams at the start, but none the less the hockey was FAST, EXCITING, and SOMTHING NEW! More than one line was scoring, we were outhustling lot's of teams, were weren't relaying on the damn cycle so much, and the future looked rather rosy for the most part.

Now, after running into some stiffer competition, and the games (obviously) not going so smoothly, I see a VERY DISTURBING trend developing that I don't really understand or even comprehend how it's been allowed by the higher ups (Trevor and Jim) to continue. Obviously today is not the first time we have lost in this disturbing way.

In MANY games that we have lost, we have had the lead going into the third or clawed back into a tie in the third or late second. We have done this (for the most part) by playing 4 lines and allowing the kids some decent ice time. This has rewarded the team with the lead or at least a tie as previously stated. Then for some UNEXPLICABLE reason Willie D has a major 3 period brain fart and decides that what got us to where we currently are in the game (i.e. lead or tie) is not good enough and he shortens his bench (sits the kids) and goes with his "trusted" vets in hopes of salvaging said win or tie. The LOOSING results in regulation or 3 -3 overtime speak for themselves. WE LOST plain and simple, and we LOST with at least 2 of the players that helped get the lead or the tie stapled to the bench for most if not all of the third and certainly all of the overtime.

Seriously don't get it. We have skilled youth now that is effective, fast, hockey smart, and seem to have a scoring touch, yet they sit while Willie D the dumb ass trots out the declining cores players that are the VERY REASON for the so called "youth movement" in the first place, in the hopes that they can salvage a win or a tie.(?????) Willie says he doesn't trust the kids or want them to get their confidence bruised by putting them in situations he feels they aren't ready for? How do think the kids are going to feel stapled to the third period bench night after night watching the very guys they are there to replace (soon I hope) loose the game they were instrumental in winning or at least halving until they were told to "sit!"

Willie? Jim? Trevor? Were losing games we shouldn't be loosing! What have you guys got to loose by playing the kids FOR THE WHOLE GAME? More losses? Maybe, but at least they would be exciting and fun the watch instead of predictable and waiting for the inevitable shoe that you know is going to drop, to drop.

Really guys you excited the fan base by keeping the kids, now your confusing the hell out of everybody by having a coach behind the bench that won't play them. Not a great situation is it?

Willie D may have won at every level up to the NHL, but he's REALLY struggling in the NHL. Mouth says one thing, brain and actions do something totally different.

Maybe there's somewhere else the team needs a change? Maybe somebody else is getting "stale" and "old?" Food for thought for sure. Hope the thought process doesn't take too long though. Thanks! 

  

 

... Stop being such a rage whore. If you don't enjoy the games then don't watch it.

[BanTSN]

Except the GWG wasn't even WD's fault. Sedins had a great rush back to the offense zone but Daniel did a stupid, dangerous pass.

It's funny when Canucks win games, you don't get these comments. But when they lose, all of sudden, "WD should be fired" "He should play the youth more" blah blah blah. Where in fact, they do get shifts in the third, but every nonsense fan here thinks they should get 15+.

This is true.  TOI among the forwards fairly balanced this game, so it doesn't seem to be the issue.

It just came down to an unfortunate play and then we didn't get it back.  We came close but never made it.  How do you draw a conclusion from that?

[DeNiro]

Except the GWG wasn't even WD's fault. Sedins had a great rush back to the offense zone but Daniel did a stupid, dangerous pass.

It's funny when Canucks win games, you don't get these comments. But when they lose, all of sudden, "WD should be fired" "He should play the youth more" blah blah blah. Where in fact, they do get shifts in the third, but every nonsense fan here thinks they should get 15+.

Because when they're winning games he's doing things that the fans have been calling for.

Like playing the rookies in the third, rolling four lines, and not overplaying the Sedins.

I think that if this team wasn't 0-4 in overtime he wouldn't have had the Sedins out in the last minute trying to go for it. He would have tried to secure the point first and then tried to go for it in overtime.

[wallstreetamigo]

I think the reason people get a bit worked up is that Desjardins reasoning for it flies in the face of actual results on the ice far too often.

He is quick to suggest that he doesn't know what he is going to get with young players in critical moments. But sooner or later doesn't he have to realize he knows what he is getting from the trusted vets and what the kids would do can't be worse?

He has a lot of good qualities as a coach but his stubbornness and painfully slow ability to adapt are real weaknesses. McCann on the PP should already be a no brainer. But his loyalty to aging vets that aren't getting it done clouds his ability to adapt.

[Baggins]

It's lose not loose.

 

That's about all I got out of the op.

[Alflives]

It's lose not loose.

 

That's about all I got out of the op.

eat 20 pounds of beans and you'll be loose.  It's loose, not lose.

[DeNiro]

I think the reason people get a bit worked up is that Desjardins reasoning for it flies in the face of actual results on the ice far too often.

He is quick to suggest that he doesn't know what he is going to get with young players in critical moments. But sooner or later doesn't he have to realize he knows what he is getting from the trusted vets and what the kids would do can't be worse?

He has a lot of good qualities as a coach but his stubbornness and painfully slow ability to adapt are real weaknesses. McCann on the PP should already be a no brainer. But his loyalty to aging vets that aren't getting it done clouds his ability to adapt.

Fans have been calling to change up the country club mentality of this team for years. A system where the vets can make mistakes and blow games with impunity, but the rookies have to gain trust with minimal opportunity.

The turnover has been nice, but it's obvious that until the old core is gone, we're going to keep seeing the same system.

[Baggins]

Because when they're winning games he's doing things that the fans have been calling for.

Like playing the rookies in the third, rolling four lines, and not overplaying the Sedins.

I think that if this team wasn't 0-4 in overtime he wouldn't have had the Sedins out in the last minute trying to go for it. He would have tried to secure the point first and then tried to go for it in overtime.

Considering the Sedins are under 20 minutes per game so far I don't see how anybody could say they're being overplayed. Horvat is in the top six among forwards for ice time. Earn the trust, get the ice time as Horvat has done. Have patience.

 

The concensus when Willie was hired was he good at developing young players. Has it not occurred to anybody else that this is how he has developed his rookies into solid players at every level he's coached?

[1-d]

Because when they're winning games he's doing things that the fans have been calling for.

Like playing the rookies in the third, rolling four lines, and not overplaying the Sedins.

I think that if this team wasn't 0-4 in overtime he wouldn't have had the Sedins out in the last minute trying to go for it. He would have tried to secure the point first and then tried to go for it in overtime.

If it went to OT, I'm pretty sure WD would have matched the young and speedy BUF line with our slug line (22-33-23) as the 1st shift.  One of the slugs is bound to lose the puck and fall behind, and Sabres would have waltzed into our zone and scored GWG within the first 30 seconds.

If WD didn't want 0-5 overtime record, I guess the mission was somehow accomplished today although the loss was even uglier.  Meanwhile we keep pissing away points left and right like a leaky condo.

"I'll stick with what I know" -- Sure, it's your prerogative Willie.  Just don't expect different results making the same mistake over and over again.

[Tambellini's Wrist Shot]

Because doing what Edmonton did work so well for the Oilers right. Give your head a shake

I'm not saying what they did was right either. There has to be a balance between throwing the kids to the wolves (Oilers) and stapling their butt to the bench so they play less than 10 minutes every game (Willie). Give them a regular shift and put them in a spot where they will succeed. The only player I think he's succeeded with so far is Hutton. 

McCann is our leading goal scorer. Doesn't play on the powerplay or during OT. Plays with a possession anchor in Dorsett so that brings his game down.

Virtanen plays with two of our best two way players, but then gets sat when Willie starts pissing in his undies during the third periods.

Baertschi has one of his best games of the season against the Flyers, and then gets healthied the next game. Nevermind the fact that he's our second best possession player, and was our best for the first few weeks of the season.

Bo isn't doing bad, but I think he's a bit over his head in the 2nd line centre position. Would be nice if he could have this year to be our third line centre. That was the plan originally but Sutter shockingly isn't a number 2 centre!!!!!! (Sarcasm).

[wallstreetamigo]

Considering the Sedins are under 20 minutes per game so far I don't see how anybody could say they're being overplayed. Horvat is in the top six among forwards for ice time. Earn the trust, get the ice time as Horvat has done. Have patience.

 

The concensus when Willie was hired was he good at developing young players. Has it not occurred to anybody else that this is how he has developed his rookies into solid players at every level he's coached?

The funny thing with rookies having to earn (and also being able to lose) the trust of the coach is that it only really works long term if all the players are held to that same standard. The trouble is that certain players on this team have for years been handed their jobs with no chance of losing it even when the results have quite consistently been less than ideal in trusting them with it. If we had no one able to step up that would be one thing. But sometimes as a coach you have to put young players in the position to succeed even if at first they fail. Suggesting it will ruin or delay their development is just smoke and mirrors by Willie to justify his foregone conclusion that vets = trust and reliability.

Funny how Chicago and other top teams routinely throw their prospects into the deep end and how often those players adjust well and become key contributors in short order. Willie is too slow to adjust to what he has and is too stuck on the core vets despite the fact that they are declining in the quality of their play.

We have seen the same movie for several years. Even if trying something different fails miserably I would prefer the attempt at finally doing something differently than seeing the re-run again. 

 

But I am also a fan who realizes that every great team has gone through periods of losing badly to be able to accumulate the assets to become great. I have no problem supporting this team unconditionally even if they are 30th place.

[captaincowbasher]

Ya we've spoiled them with PP time which is why we've consistently been a top 10 powerplay for most of the past 10 years.

You said it... PAST!  They will be lucky to get to 60 points this year. Mark my words, and worst then that they will be under +5 for the entire season. They need to transition the Sedins to a second line asap, they're too slow, and they are terrible at back checking. Don't get me wrong i'm a huge fan of them but the team comes first.

Build a PP line with Horvat, Baertschi and Vrbata and they will out produce the Sedins. The back end needs to be Edler and McCann(unbelievable shot). Second PP unit, Sedins and Sutter(at least Sutter backchecks) and they get 40-45 seconds. The young guns will develop like crazy under those circumstances and we can all live with their mistakes.

[captaincowbasher]

The funny thing with rookies having to earn (and also being able to lose) the trust of the coach is that it only really works long term if all the players are held to that same standard. The trouble is that certain players on this team have for years been handed their jobs with no chance of losing it even when the results have quite consistently been less than ideal in trusting them with it. If we had no one able to step up that would be one thing. But sometimes as a coach you have to put young players in the position to succeed even if at first they fail. Suggesting it will ruin or delay their development is just smoke and mirrors by Willie to justify his foregone conclusion that vets = trust and reliability.

Funny how Chicago and other top teams routinely throw their prospects into the deep end and how often those players adjust well and become key contributors in short order. Willie is too slow to adjust to what he has and is too stuck on the core vets despite the fact that they are declining in the quality of their play.

We have seen the same movie for several years. Even if trying something different fails miserably I would prefer the attempt at finally doing something differently than seeing the re-run again. 

 

But I am also a fan who realizes that every great team has gone through periods of losing badly to be able to accumulate the assets to become great. I have no problem supporting this team unconditionally even if they are 30th place.

so last years playoffs against Calgary worked out...He was badly out coached, His team is dominating the game and losing so in the third he changes the lines... are kidding me sounds like Midget A hockey...brutal

[Baggins]

I'm not saying what they did was right either. There has to be a balance between throwing the kids to the wolves (Oilers) and stapling their butt to the bench so they play less than 10 minutes every game (Willie). Give them a regular shift and put them in a spot where they will succeed. The only player I think he's succeeded with so far is Hutton. 

McCann is our leading goal scorer. Doesn't play on the powerplay or during OT. Plays with a possession anchor in Dorsett so that brings his game down.

Virtanen plays with two of our best two way players, but then gets sat when Willie starts pissing in his undies during the third periods.

Baertschi has one of his best games of the season against the Flyers, and then gets healthied the next game. Nevermind the fact that he's our second best possession player, and was our best for the first few weeks of the season.

Bo isn't doing bad, but I think he's a bit over his head in the 2nd line centre position. Would be nice if he could have this year to be our third line centre. That was the plan originally but Sutter shockingly isn't a number 2 centre!!!!!! (Sarcasm).

Line numbers don't really mean much any more. Henrik leads all forwards in ice time per game with Sutter 2nd and Horvat 5th. So who is the number 2 center?

[Alflives]

You said it... PAST!  They will be lucky to get to 60 points this year. Mark my words, and worst then that they will be under +5 for the entire season. They need to transition the Sedins to a second line asap, they're too slow, and they are terrible at back checking. Don't get me wrong i'm a huge fan of them but the team comes first.

Build a PP line with Horvat, Baertschi and Vrbata and they will out produce the Sedins. The back end needs to be Edler and McCann(unbelievable shot). Second PP unit, Sedins and Sutter(at least Sutter backchecks) and they get 40-45 seconds. The young guns will develop like crazy under those circumstances and we can all live with their mistakes.

I gotta agree.  The Twins are second line guys now.  Baer is not a top line guy though.  We a really stuck without top line guys to replace them.  Horvat, McCann and Virtanen are still a year or two away from that responsibility.  How about we play the hand dealt, and finish in the bottom five of the league and get a top pick?

[captaincowbasher]

I'm not saying what they did was right either. There has to be a balance between throwing the kids to the wolves (Oilers) and stapling their butt to the bench so they play less than 10 minutes every game (Willie). Give them a regular shift and put them in a spot where they will succeed. The only player I think he's succeeded with so far is Hutton. 

McCann is our leading goal scorer. Doesn't play on the powerplay or during OT. Plays with a possession anchor in Dorsett so that brings his game down.

Virtanen plays with two of our best two way players, but then gets sat when Willie starts pissing in his undies during the third periods.

Baertschi has one of his best games of the season against the Flyers, and then gets healthied the next game. Nevermind the fact that he's our second best possession player, and was our best for the first few weeks of the season.

Bo isn't doing bad, but I think he's a bit over his head in the 2nd line centre position. Would be nice if he could have this year to be our third line centre. That was the plan originally but Sutter shockingly isn't a number 2 centre!!!!!! (Sarcasm).

excellent post-  so true, we can all see it, the pee in his panties i'm referring to.

[Alflives]

excellent post-  so true, we can all see it, the pee in his panties i'm referring to.

I think he uses Depends, so it's okay.

[stawns]

TL and JB just need to not be reactive and stay with the plan.  All in all I'm happy with how the team is playing and the young guys are thriving in a protected, pressure free environment.  I don't get why anyone would  jeopardize that after 15 games.  This team belongs to the twins, Sutter, Edler, Burrows and Hamhuis for good reason yet.......the young guys aren't ready to take on the pressure of carrying a National Hockey League team.  Just sit back and enjoy watching them grow, and eventually take over. 

[Baggins]

I'm not saying what they did was right either. There has to be a balance between throwing the kids to the wolves (Oilers) and stapling their butt to the bench so they play less than 10 minutes every game (Willie). Give them a regular shift and put them in a spot where they will succeed. The only player I think he's succeeded with so far is Hutton.

The bolded parts is a contradiction. The Oilers have been giving their kids regular shifts for years now. That is essentially throwing them to the wolves. Horvat did quite well last season on the fourth line and sheltered as Mccann is this year. Is Horvat doing as well this year with a regular shift against stiffer match ups? No. There's no need to rush the youngsters at this point. Patience.

Hutton is a 22 year old rookie that has been playing against men at college for several years. It's tougher to shelter d-men with only three pairings as opposed to four forward lines. But he's already earned trust with defensive play and puck movement. Be happy for him doing so well but don't translate that to others who are younger.